1
   

AG says journalists can be prosecuted for publishing leaks

 
 
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 08:29 am
My apologies if this topic has already been started, but I searched around a bit and didn't find one. The Attorney General is saying that he believes the law supports prosecuting journalists for publishing classified information. I find this interesting for a number of reasons.

1) The AG is reinforcing the impression that he has a habit of creative interpretation of the law. See the Unitary Executive Branch and America Spying on Americans.

2) He didn't specify which laws he's referring to, which makes me think that he is either afraid to have his opinion challenged or he's bluffing in an effort to put the scare in the press.

3) He says they have an obligation to enforce the laws, which he has said must be read carefully to get to the conclusion he has drawn (that he can prosecute journalists), meaning, their original intent was not to allow the prosecution of journalists. Why would there be an obligation to enforce such a narrow interpretation in this case, but in the case of other legislation, like FISA and the anti-torture law, he feels no obligation to enforce what is the obvious intent of the law? I'm getting the feeling that this guy is a legal hack who is there for no other reason to find ways around the law and through loopholes in the law.

4) In the section I've bolded, he says that the 1st ammendment right can't trump... and then he trails off about some right that Americans would like to see. I see no competing right to the 1st ammendment in the Constitution. I think he's just making **** up.

5) The whole thing is just absurd because it puts a burden on journalists to know whether the information they receive is classified or not.

Quote:
US govt free to spy on journos
Associated Press
Posted Monday , May 22, 2006 at 10:51
Updated Monday , May 22, 2006 at 11:12
Email Email Print Print

Washington: U S Attorney General Alberto Gonzales said on Sunday he believes journalists can be prosecuted for publishing classified information, citing an obligation to national security.

The top U.S. law enforcer also said the government will not hesitate to track telephone calls made by reporters as part of a criminal leak investigation, but officials would not do so routinely and randomly.

"There are some statutes on the book which, if you read the language carefully, would seem to indicate that that is a possibility," Gonzales said, referring to prosecutions.

"We have an obligation to enforce those laws. We have an obligation to ensure that our national security is protected."

In recent months, journalists have been called into court to testify as part of investigations into leaks, including the unauthorised disclosure of a Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) operative's name as well as the National Security Agency's warrantless eavesdropping program.

Executive Director of the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press, Lucy Dalglish, said she presumed that Gonzales was referring to the 1917 Espionage Act, which she said has never been interpreted to prosecute journalists who were providing information to the public.

"I can't imagine a bigger chill on free speech and the public's right to know what it's government is up to, both hallmarks of a democracy, than prosecuting reporters," Dalglish said.

Gonzales said he would not comment specifically on whether The New York Times should be prosecuted for disclosing the National Security Agency (NSA) program last year based on classified information.

He also denied that authorities would randomly check journalists' records on domestic-to-domestic phone calls in an effort to find journalists' confidential sources.

"We don't engage in domestic-to-domestic surveillance without a court order," Gonzales said, under a 'probable cause' legal standard.

But he added that the Constitutional right of a free press should not be absolute when it comes to national security. If the government's probe into the NSA leak turns up criminal activity, prosecutors have an 'obligation to enforce the law.'

"It can't be the case that that right trumps over the right that Americans would like to see, the ability of the federal government to go after criminal activity," Gonzales told ABC's This Week.



http://www.ibnlive.com/news/us-govt-free-to-spy-on-journos/11093-2.html
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 08:35 am
They are approaching this incorrectly. The leak is the one that needs to be prosecuted, not the reporter. What they need to do is avail upon the reporter who leaked the classified information and prosecute that person. It's the media's right to print stories they learn about, but it is the source that needs to be brought to justice.

Reporters should be required to be forthcoming with sources of classifeid information though when an investigation finds that classified information vital to national security has been leaked.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 08:46 am
What are those shield laws for? Oh, yes. To protect the reporter and her or her source when breaking a story....
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 08:47 am
I think what you outline is the traditional approach to these things. That's why Judith Miller, among others, spent time in jail. There are arguments for and against requiring journalists to reveal their sources, and I admit that I find both pursuasive. But the idea that a journalist can be prosecuted just feels so wrong. I agree with what you say, that once the information is out, they have the right, maybe even the responsibility, to publish it.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 08:50 am
I wasn't aware of this -- thanks for bringing it up, and really good analysis.
0 Replies
 
paull
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 11:03 am
The framers left the Constitution quite vague on the matter, and many others. "Freedom of the Press" can mean many things, and it is natural for law enforcement and reporters to have different takes on it. Freedom of Speech, I have heard, does not allow one to yell "fire" in a theatre, and the ability to prosecute someone who does that is a "right that Americans would like to see". It isn't a huge stretch to apply that sort of enforcement to the dissemination of classified material. The underlying problem, to me, is that if this enforcement is in place there is nothing to keep the government from classifying nearly everything.

As for the onus of a reporter's having to know if something passed to him is classified, if he can't figure that out prima facie or by enquiry, he isn't a reporter.

BTW, every time I go to the range or hunting I am grateful for the second amendment, and I have NO idea where to sign up for that militia it talks about.
0 Replies
 
Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 04:22 pm
Who gets to define "classified"?
0 Replies
 
talk72000
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 May, 2006 10:53 pm
The AG seems to act like a South American Banana Republic dictator.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 12:08 am
All of this points out the need for moral people. Moral leaders, moral reporters, and people that generally understand the value of freedoms and that love the country first and foremost over their own self indulgence. When people start going off the reservation, then problems begin to multiply.

I do not think reporters should be targeted, but instead the people in government that are charged with keeping the secrets should be most accountable. However, in the most severe and obviously damaging cases, perhaps reporters should be held accountable, but the threshold to do so should be very, very high so that reporters do not have to fear for every story or investigative piece that they write about. If reporters would simply use some common sense and care for the country along with their own self importance, this would probably not even need to come up as a subject.
0 Replies
 
Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 03:40 pm
Glenn Greenwald:

Quote:
Imprisoning journalists

Other than the fact that the President believes that he has the power to break the law and has been continuously exercising that power, the issue about which I've written most on this blog is the sweeping and dangerous attacks by this administration on investigative journalism. Those two issues are quite related, as the latter is intended to conceal and thus enable the former.

The administration's assault on a free and vital press took a huge leap forward this weekend, when Attorney General Alberto Gonazles announced on national television that the Bush administration has the power to imprison journalists who publish stories revealing conduct by the President which the administration wants to conceal (such as the warrantless NSA eavesdropping program, which he specifically cited). Gonazles went further and made clear that the administration is actively considering prosecution against journalists who publish such stories. The video is here.

It really is hard to imagine any measures which pose a greater and more direct danger to our freedoms than the issuance of threats like this by the administration against the press. If the President has the power to keep secret any information he wants simply by classifying it -- including information regarding illegal or otherwise improper actions he has taken -- then the President, by definition, has complete control over the flow of information which Americans receive about their Government.

An aggressive and adversarial press in our country was intended by the founders to be one of the most critical checks on abuses of presidential power, every bit as much as Congress and the courts were created as checks. Jefferson said: "If I had to choose between government without newspapers, and newspapers without government, I wouldn't hesitate to choose the latter." The only reason the Founders bothered to guarantee a free press in First Amendment is because the press was intended to serve as a check against Government power.

And the only reason, in turn, that the press is a check against the Government is because it searches for and then discloses information which the Government wants to keep secret. That is what investigative journalism, by definition, does. The Government always wants to conceal its wrongdoing from the public, and the principal safeguard in this country against that behavior is an adversarial press, which is devoted to uncovering such conduct and disclosing it to the country.

Virtually every issue of political controversy during the Bush administration has been the result of the disclosure to a journalist by a concerned Government source that the administration is engaging in illegal, improper and/or highly controversial conduct. Whatever criticisms one wants to make of the American press -- and such criticisms are numerous -- it is still the case that what we do know about this Administration's conduct is the result of the press. Literally, if George Bush had his way -- if government sources were sufficiently intimidated out of disclosing classified information and journalists were sufficiently intimidated out of writing about it -- we would not know about any of these matters:


* Abu Ghraib

* The Bybee Torture Memorandum

* The use of torture as an interrogation tool

* The illegal eavesdropping on Americans without warrants

* The creation of secret gulags in Eastern Europe

* The existence of abundant pre-war information undermining and even negating the administration's WMD claims

* Policies of rendering prisoners to the worst human rights-abusing countries



Our Government would be engaging in all of this conduct, and worse. But we would not know about any of it. We would just be going merrily along our way, completely ignorant of the fact that the Bush administration has undertaken the most unimaginably radical and disturbing conduct in the name of the United States. We would all be Hugh Hewitt and John Hinderaker -- incapable of doing anything other than obediently praising the Commander-in-Chief and reciting the view of the world which the administration wants us to have because we would not know any better.

If this world were implemented, the only information about the Government which we would have is the information which the Bush administration wants us to have -- i.e., information which reflects well on it and which enhances the Glory of the president. Any information which reflects poorly on the president or which reveals any of his controversial and improper behavior would be concealed.

The only "leaked" information which we would ever hear is information which bolsters the administration's views (such as pre-war claims by Ahmed Chalabi about the existence of Iraqi chemical weapons) or which depicts the President as Our Hero and Protector (like the time he saved the “Liberty Tower” from destruction, or the way he ordered an innovative high-tech scheme to detect unusual levels of radiation in our neighborhood mosques). But leaks which the administration doesn't want us to know because they politically harm the president would never happen because those who are privy to such information (government employees and journalists alike) would be too fearful of criminal prosecution to inform us about it.

That is what this is all about. There is not a single instance -- not one -- which reflects any harm to our national security as a result of any of these disclosures. The press goes out of its way to avoid disclosing information which could harm national security -- the Times concealed all operational details of the NSA program when it disclosed that the President was eavesdropping without warrants and the Post concealed the location of the secret gulags in Eastern Europe when reporting that they existed. These disclosures trigger public debate over highly controversial matters and, as a result, often harm the President politically. But none of them is an example of gratuitous disclosure of secret information intended to harm national security.

That is how our country has operated for at least the last century, through two world wars and scores of other military conflicts. The press reports classified information to the extent that doing so brings to the public's attention legitimate matters of political debate, and it exercises self-restraint by concealing information which could harm national security and which is unnecessary for the debate to be had. And unlike many other countries whom we have never (until now) aspired to copy, we do not threaten journalists with prison or prosecute them for publishing such stories, precisely because that conduct is a critical and necessary component of the checks and balances which preserve liberty in our country.

It ought to go without saying that the press cannot serve as a check against the Executive branch if the only information it publishes is information which the President wants it to publish. Then the press becomes Pravda, existing solely to pass along information to citizens which the Government wants it to convey. That's the world where the administration wants Americans to believe that we have to wage war against Iraq to rid it of its WMDs, and so selectively “leaks” to Judith Miller the information which bolsters that claim while concealing the information which undermines it. And the Government's claims then are printed on the front page of The New York Times under the guise of independent reporting, without any contrary information being disclosed.

When the Government can control which information is disclosed and which information is concealed, newspapers become a government propaganda venue -- an arm of the Government -- rather than any meaningful check on it. I've cited this Jefferson warning several times before, and included it in my book, because it is so prescient and so self-evidently applicable to the Bush administration:


"Our first object should therefore be, to leave open to him all the avenues of truth. The most effectual hitherto found, is freedom of the press. It is therefore, the first shut up by those who fear the investigation of their actions."

There simply is no American president, at least in the last century, who has waged war against a free press the way George Bush has. Not even close. Not even Richard Nixon, who hated the press with a consuming passion, tried to imprison journalists. And there is a reason why the Bush administration has as its highest priority these attacks on the press. And Jefferson told us the reason why: because the press is the "first shut up by those who fear the investigation of their actions."


Even during World War I, the Congress refused to include in the Espionage Act of 1917 a provision which Woodrow Wilson wanted to allow criminal prosecution against any journalists who -- in a time of war -- disclosed information which the President deemed to be "of such character that it is or might be useful to the enemy." (h/t Cynic Librarian). The debate regarding that amendment makes abundantly clear that it was rejected because the grave dangers from stifling an aggressive and free press -- even during war -- far outweigh the “benefits” of eliminating one of the sole checks on the Government's ability to control the flow of information.

Why were we able to defend our national security throughout the 20th Century without imprisoning journalists? Why have we suddenly reached a point where our Government is too weak to defend our country without trying to stifle a free press by threatening journalists with imprisonment? Why can't George Bush defend the country without destroying almost every traditional institution and practice in our country to which presidential administrations of both parties have, for decades if not longer, managed to adhere?

A prohibition on imprisoning journalists for fulfilling the function which the Founders intended is just another defining tradition and principle of our country which the Bush administration is attempting to dismantle. Whether they actually prosecute journalists or not, the threat to do so -- combined with the knowledge that they possess the means to investigate their telephone calls -- by itself has a highly damaging deterrent effect on vigorous investigative journalism. This administration is obsessed with eliminating the few remaining checks on their ability to operate in secret, and there is nothing which can advance that goal more than official threats of imprisonment of journalists -- which, as amazing as it is, is exactly what happened this weekend.

UPDATE: One of the most striking aspects of these escalating attacks on the press is just how silent the major media outlets are about any of this. The Attorney General threatened journalists with prison this weekend on national television. Shouldn't the Times and the Post be editorializing against those threats, at the very least? And yet, from what I've seen today, no newspaper has published an editorial response to the administration. Just silence.


http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/2006/05/imprisoning-journalists.html
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 04:48 pm
Totally agree with his afterthought. I can't believe this isn't a bigger deal in the press. Where are the people who come forward and dispute the legality of prosecuting journalists for doing their jobs? I think this is a pretty big hairy deal. Even if he is just bluffing, the fact that he's trying to put the scare into journalists is also a big, hairy deal.
0 Replies
 
paull
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 05:55 pm
Quote:
Why were we able to defend our national security throughout the 20th Century without imprisoning journalists?


BECAUSE, the leftwing rage against every moderate to rightwing politician, individual or idea has grown to the point that these "journalists", with a short sighted (and profit oriented) axe to grind, don't care whose ox is gored when classified info is revealed. If some bad guys intent on killing civilians in the name of Allah find out how they might get caught, and change their plans accordingly, who cares, because the "truth" is out.

The wonderful thing for this class of reporters is that they live in the most free and diverse country in the world, and can subvert it, in complete safety. So far.

The espionage acts during WW1 punished the periodicals and papers, not reporters, that printed subversive stuff, and many were fined and otherwise lost revenue via loss of use of the mail. The difference now is that individual reporters might be asked to take a moment and think if their reporting might have adverse consequences to the nipple on which they suckle noisily. I can't find a problem with that.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 09:32 pm
Very much agreed, paull. A few bad apples can ruin it for everybody. A few shoplifters, and then you have security measures installed and scanners at the doors, etc. If reporters would all use sound judgement and not divulge things that seriously damage national security, this subject would probably not be raised, but I think there are increasingly more reporters that have an axe to grind to the point they will report anything regardless of the detrimental consequences to this country.
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 09:43 pm
I'm having a hard time believing that the morals of journalists have changed significantly enough over the years to justify stomping all over the Constitution.
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 May, 2006 11:48 pm
One of the most brilliant Jurists of our day( no, not Debra L A W, although she is very very erudite), Richard A. Posner, has written, in his masterwork--"Overcoming Law" points out--
"Radical feminists argue that pornography does harm; critical race theorists that hate speech does harm. Nothing in PRAGMATISM teaches that the harms caused by speech should be ignorned; nothing justifies the priviliging of freedom of speech OVER OTHER SOCIAL INTERESTS>"

If left wingers like Glenn Greenwald are so frightened by the words of the Attorney General, they should immediately enlist the help of the ACLU and challenge the AG's policies in court.

That is the way checks and balances work!!!

I am sure that the USSC, in its wisdom, will be able to work out the problem as posed by Judge Posner--"nothing justifies the priviliging of freedom of speech OVER OTHER SOCIAL INTERESTS"

Radical feminists believe that with regard to Pornography

Critical hate theorists believe that with regard to hate speech

The USSC may be able to discern which releases by the press is as detrimental to other social interests as the Radical Feminists claim about Pornography and as the Critical hate theorists hold about hate speech.
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 May, 2006 12:00 am
Debra L A W cites someone named Glenn Greenwald. He is a litigator who has worked the last ten years specializing in First Amendment cases. I am sure that he is competent. However, if his vita is compared with someone like Richard Posner, there is no question.

Glenn Greenwald is a newbie!
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 29 May, 2006 01:55 am
This is an important, and interesting issue.

We would be foolish indeed to believe that we might never need an aggressive and independent press. Some had faith in Clinton and some have faith in Bush, but neither deserve unquestioning faith.

The dynamics of a free press are similar to our legal system.

As average Americans, we regard defense lawyers who strive to free known criminals as scumbags. As average Americans, we are capable of seeing the bias in the national press.

As much as we might like it to be, life is not a series of prescribed boxes. The press is no more capable of consistently unbiased and honest behavior than the government.

It is amusing that some (always on The Left) will argue that the Press is inviolate in its purpose and ethics, while the government is but a sewer of personal interests and power mania.

The world can best be described by Venn diagrams. Efficacy, if not truth, lies within the overlapped segments of the circles.

A mob of horse's ass journalists confront a mob of horse's ass politicians. Neither is altruistic in their motives. Somewhere, however, there is an intersect that benefits the polity.

As a general rule, freedom is good. Free markets, free press, free elections, free internet etc.

No reporter should ever be prosecuted for reporting, unless such reporting is a deliberate attempt to break a law.

However, the American Press are still Americans.

One would hope that members of the press realize that they (and their families) must live within the society which they can endanger through their reporting.

Of course there are (as is the case with government) members of the press who value their journalistic success above all thing - including national security.

What makes a successful reporter? Way down on the list of qualifications is an appreciation of how the news impacts the interests of his or her nation.

Ultimately what we need to keep in mind is that we are humans, and as such are imperfect.

Government and Commerce will never be perfect, but neither will their critics. It is foolish to believe that one side of the equation is that much more valid than the other.

Culturally we are programmed to find affinity with the iconoclast. This is a tremendous strength of America, and yet, like any strength, it can be turned to a weakness if pressed to the extreme. The Establishment is not only not always wrong, it is seldom wrong.

It is, however, wrong often enough to require a voice that points out the Emperor has no clothes. We can't, though, control this voice we can only employ our intelligence to judge the wisdom of its reportage.
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 May, 2006 02:26 am
Finn- You have found the nexus of the problem, I hope that I will be allowed to follow up your excellent post with some observations that are not as central as yours but do indeed add to your post, if only peripherally.

l. The media is biased--

As Bernard Godberg wrote in his book-"Bias"

quote

"Do we really think that if the media elites worked out of Nebraska instead of New York, and if they were overwhelmingly social conservatives instead of liberals and if they overwhemingly voted for Nixon and Reagan instead of McGovern or Mondale..do we really think that would make no difference? Does anyone really believe that the evening newscasts would be the same?"

end of quote

2. Richard A. Posner, the most erudite judge who wrote a masterwork called "Overcoming Law" wrote:

"The United States is a nation of more than a quarter billion people closely watched by a hoard of journalists. Every bad thing that can happen does happen and much of it is reported in the media, so that a piling on of anecdotes can make any bad thing, however rare, seem common"
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 22 Jun, 2006 11:03 pm
Re: AG says journalists can be prosecuted for publishing lea
FreeDuck wrote:
My apologies if this topic has already been started, but I searched around a bit and didn't find one. The Attorney General is saying that he believes the law supports prosecuting journalists for publishing classified information. I find this interesting for a number of reasons.

1) The AG is reinforcing the impression that he has a habit of creative interpretation of the law. See the Unitary Executive Branch and America Spying on Americans.

This is a poltical and not a legal argument, and, as such, has little credence.

2) He didn't specify which laws he's referring to, which makes me think that he is either afraid to have his opinion challenged or he's bluffing in an effort to put the scare in the press.

Or he didn't think a public announcement such as this required an extensive legal justification. Once again, poltical, not legal.

3) He says they have an obligation to enforce the laws, which he has said must be read carefully to get to the conclusion he has drawn (that he can prosecute journalists), meaning, their original intent was not to allow the prosecution of journalists. Why would there be an obligation to enforce such a narrow interpretation in this case, but in the case of other legislation, like FISA and the anti-torture law, he feels no obligation to enforce what is the obvious intent of the law? I'm getting the feeling that this guy is a legal hack who is there for no other reason to find ways around the law and through loopholes in the law.

Sorry Free, but this is blah, blah, blah and blah.

You may have a legitmate argument somewhere in the preceding paragraph but you have not done it justice.


4) In the section I've bolded, he says that the 1st ammendment right can't trump... and then he trails off about some right that Americans would like to see. I see no competing right to the 1st ammendment in the Constitution. I think he's just making **** up.

Not much of a legal argument, and so I have passed on it.

5) The whole thing is just absurd because it puts a burden on journalists to know whether the information they receive is classified or not.

The question of value is are journalists the free radicals of society, or do they represent a segment of the soceity on which they report?

It's a bit fuzzy to me, but there was a movie 30 to 40 years ago called Mondo Cane. One of the pieces of this movie involved sea turtles f*cked up by atomic bomb tests hoplessly laying eggs that would never hatch. Anyone watching this movie likely called out "Help the effin turtles! Don;t just stand by and watch them advance towards extinction!"


Thereafter came a movie called "Medium Cool" which addresses whether or not reporters were removed or engaged in the stories they covered: should they have pointed the turtle in the right direction?

And so the question is whether or not journalists are members of the society which they calim to serve. Notice that when we killed al Qaeda in Iraq's NUmero Uno, the Iraqi press cheered at the annuncement of his death. Would this ever have hap[pened in the US? No, man, never.

Our journalist have somehow dedicated themelves to a God that transcends the country in which they live.

This would be all fine and good if this God didn't have a personal hard-on for America.

Quote:
US govt free to spy on journos
Associated Press
Posted Monday , May 22, 2006 at 10:51
Updated Monday , May 22, 2006 at 11:12
Email Email Print Print

Washington: U S Attorney General Alberto Gonzales said on Sunday he believes journalists can be prosecuted for publishing classified information, citing an obligation to national security.

The top U.S. law enforcer also said the government will not hesitate to track telephone calls made by reporters as part of a criminal leak investigation, but officials would not do so routinely and randomly.

"There are some statutes on the book which, if you read the language carefully, would seem to indicate that that is a possibility," Gonzales said, referring to prosecutions.

"We have an obligation to enforce those laws. We have an obligation to ensure that our national security is protected."

In recent months, journalists have been called into court to testify as part of investigations into leaks, including the unauthorised disclosure of a Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) operative's name as well as the National Security Agency's warrantless eavesdropping program.

Executive Director of the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press, Lucy Dalglish, said she presumed that Gonzales was referring to the 1917 Espionage Act, which she said has never been interpreted to prosecute journalists who were providing information to the public.

"I can't imagine a bigger chill on free speech and the public's right to know what it's government is up to, both hallmarks of a democracy, than prosecuting reporters," Dalglish said.

Gonzales said he would not comment specifically on whether The New York Times should be prosecuted for disclosing the National Security Agency (NSA) program last year based on classified information.

He also denied that authorities would randomly check journalists' records on domestic-to-domestic phone calls in an effort to find journalists' confidential sources.

"We don't engage in domestic-to-domestic surveillance without a court order," Gonzales said, under a 'probable cause' legal standard.

But he added that the Constitutional right of a free press should not be absolute when it comes to national security. If the government's probe into the NSA leak turns up criminal activity, prosecutors have an 'obligation to enforce the law.'

"It can't be the case that that right trumps over the right that Americans would like to see, the ability of the federal government to go after criminal activity," Gonzales told ABC's This Week.



http://www.ibnlive.com/news/us-govt-free-to-spy-on-journos/11093-2.html
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:36 am
Re: AG says journalists can be prosecuted for publishing lea
FreeDuck wrote:
My apologies if this topic has already been started, but I searched around a bit and didn't find one. The Attorney General is saying that he believes the law supports prosecuting journalists for publishing classified information. I find this interesting for a number of reasons.

1) The AG is reinforcing the impression that he has a habit of creative interpretation of the law. See the Unitary Executive Branch and America Spying on Americans.

This is a poltical and not a legal argument, and, as such, has little credence.


Sorry Finn, maybe you didn't notice but this thread is in the Politics forum and not the Legal forum. The words preceding number 1 are "I find this interesting for a number of reasons." So what you are saying has little credence is my enumeration of what I find interesting. Are you saying you don't believe I find it interesting?

Quote:
2) He didn't specify which laws he's referring to, which makes me think that he is either afraid to have his opinion challenged or he's bluffing in an effort to put the scare in the press.

Or he didn't think a public announcement such as this required an extensive legal justification. Once again, poltical, not legal.


See above.

Quote:
3) He says they have an obligation to enforce the laws, which he has said must be read carefully to get to the conclusion he has drawn (that he can prosecute journalists), meaning, their original intent was not to allow the prosecution of journalists. Why would there be an obligation to enforce such a narrow interpretation in this case, but in the case of other legislation, like FISA and the anti-torture law, he feels no obligation to enforce what is the obvious intent of the law? I'm getting the feeling that this guy is a legal hack who is there for no other reason to find ways around the law and through loopholes in the law.

Sorry Free, but this is blah, blah, blah and blah.

You may have a legitmate argument somewhere in the preceding paragraph but you have not done it justice.


It's obvious from the AG's comments that he has to read the law in a way other than it was intended in order to believe that he has the authority to prosecute journalists. If you find that notion "blah" feel free to skip it.

Quote:
4) In the section I've bolded, he says that the 1st ammendment right can't trump... and then he trails off about some right that Americans would like to see. I see no competing right to the 1st ammendment in the Constitution. I think he's just making **** up.

Not much of a legal argument, and so I have passed on it.


Again, there is a legal forum for legal arguments. This thread isn't in it.

Quote:
5) The whole thing is just absurd because it puts a burden on journalists to know whether the information they receive is classified or not.

The question of value is are journalists the free radicals of society, or do they represent a segment of the soceity on which they report?

It's a bit fuzzy to me, but there was a movie 30 to 40 years ago called Mondo Cane. One of the pieces of this movie involved sea turtles f*cked up by atomic bomb tests hoplessly laying eggs that would never hatch. Anyone watching this movie likely called out "Help the effin turtles! Don;t just stand by and watch them advance towards extinction!"


Thereafter came a movie called "Medium Cool" which addresses whether or not reporters were removed or engaged in the stories they covered: should they have pointed the turtle in the right direction?

And so the question is whether or not journalists are members of the society which they calim to serve. Notice that when we killed al Qaeda in Iraq's NUmero Uno, the Iraqi press cheered at the annuncement of his death. Would this ever have happened in the US? No, man, never.

Our journalist have somehow dedicated themelves to a God that transcends the country in which they live.

This would be all fine and good if this God didn't have a personal hard-on for America.



That's very interesting but mostly blah, blah, blah, and blah. Maybe there's an argument in there somewhere on whether journalists should be prosecuted for espionage, but you've not done it justice.

Ok, now that I've taken my digs, I do find your last comments interesting. Why do you think "this God" has a personal hard on for America? Incidentally, I'm unable to discern whether that's good or bad. Bad because it want's to f**k us? Or good because it finds us attractive?
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