50
   

What should be done about illegal immigration?

 
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:34 pm
Quote:
a) You want as many illegals to move here as want to move here

I want as many people to move here as there are jobs that need to be filled, Simple supply and demand, a conservative economic principle.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:36 pm
ebrown_p wrote:
squinney wrote:

You persist in making statements that indicate I'm not compassionate, understanding and am racist / do not want diversity. That's ridiculous. The people of Dulfar...



You are making statements that indicate you are not compassionate.

You want to punish people I care about by insisting on uprooting their lives. You want to give spouses the choice of either leaving lives and careers or breaking up their families. You want to pull kids from school and send kids who have grown up here and are Americans in every way except a sheet of paper to what is to them a foreign country.

You are willing to do these things because either they or their parents broke the law by crossing a border or overstaying a visa. Even though you accept that when Americans break the law, it is sometimes a good thing to offer compassion and understanding.

We are not talking about people in Darfor (although I would love to be able to help). We are talking about people who are living with us and working for us.

But the Senate Bill is offering the border security.

If you care about border security then you will support the Senate bill. If you care about punishing people who you resent being here you will support blocking it.



Where does the above indicate what you conclude as being a logic of it, Foxfyre?
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:37 pm
Quote:
b) You don't want the government to do anything to stop them or do anything but welcome them with open arms when they come

I want whatever screening (health etc) as is determined by a well reasoned immigration policy (skin color/religion not to be considered)
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:40 pm
Quote:
c) You don't mind that hard working people who have played by the rules all their lives are, against their choice, having to support many of the illegals who get here

hard working people is not dertermined by legal/illegal status, "against their choice" against whose choice and just how is anyone forced to support anyone else be they legal or illegal? Blatent hyperbole totally without merit.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:41 pm
"Hard working" has never been the issue for new immigrants to most countries.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:43 pm
Quote:
d) You don't mind that hospitals close emergency room and deny everybody emergency care because they can no longer afford to provide free services for so many

Public hospitals are by federal regulation required to provide medical services to women about to deliver/in labor as well as critical emergency neeeds, Hospitals that exceed that do it at thier own inititiative.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:46 pm
Quote:
e) You don't care that all students suffer from so many special needs kids who can't speak any English being admitted to the schools to receive a free education

Todays edition of the "New Mexican" has a study report demonstrating the illegals in New Mexico pay more than their fair share of education costs by all the various taxes they do pay including property taxes paid via their rent.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:48 pm
Quote:
f) You don't care that 40 to 60% of the prison populations of the border states are made up of illegals who have committed serious crimes

If this stat is from the DOJ rather than some nitwit like Lou Dobbs I will accept it as valid.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:49 pm
Quote:
g) You don't care if a few terrorists slip across the border along with ordinary people

Can you document one single example of this happening?
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:49 pm
f) is also quite unremarkable. You go to prison because you commit a crime. It shouldn't surprise us that the prison population consists of criminals.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:51 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
ebrown_p wrote:
squinney wrote:

You persist in making statements that indicate I'm not compassionate, understanding and am racist / do not want diversity. That's ridiculous. The people of Dulfar...



You are making statements that indicate you are not compassionate.

You want to punish people I care about by insisting on uprooting their lives. You want to give spouses the choice of either leaving lives and careers or breaking up their families. You want to pull kids from school and send kids who have grown up here and are Americans in every way except a sheet of paper to what is to them a foreign country.

You are willing to do these things because either they or their parents broke the law by crossing a border or overstaying a visa. Even though you accept that when Americans break the law, it is sometimes a good thing to offer compassion and understanding.

We are not talking about people in Darfor (although I would love to be able to help). We are talking about people who are living with us and working for us.

But the Senate Bill is offering the border security.

If you care about border security then you will support the Senate bill. If you care about punishing people who you resent being here you will support blocking it.



Where does the above indicate what you conclude as being a logic of it, Foxfyre?


eBrown has said that Squinney (and I) lack compassion because we do not agree with his opinions on the best way to deal with illegal immigration.

I was simply showing how this kind of logic can be used conversely.

The difference is I don't pretend to know eBrown's mind, wishes, or motives and take what he has posted at face value. He however, like some others, seems to have some kind of clarvoiyant powers into the minds of others that those who disagree with him lack.

And then there are those who just wish to cast aspersions on others and make no effort whatsoever to substantiate their opinions. Those I can mostly ignore, however.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:52 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
f) You don't care that 40 to 60% of the prison populations of the border states are made up of illegals who have committed serious crimes


You gave that percebtage already a couple of times before.

As of 2003, there were in New Mexico (in federal, state, county/town and private prisons) a total of about 12,000 inmates. (Source: Bureau of Justice Statistics)

Taking the lowest percentage, there would be - according to you - about 5,000 illegals imprisoned only for serious (!) crimes.
Minor offenses added, only Indians and illegals can be imprisoned in New Mexico. Shocked
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:53 pm
Quote:
h) You don't mind if a few more tons of illegal drugs are brought into the country and peddled to your kids

There are drugs brought into this country, they are brought into this country by illegal drug smugglers, not by immigrants seeking work. This could be addressed by a drug use policy of the US of A that addressed drug use rather than illegal alien workers.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:55 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
If we use your logic eBrown we will have to conclude:
k) You don't care that those who have played by the rules to immigrate legally are punished while illegal activity is rewarded.

Legalization of all (non-criminal, healthy) immigration solves that issue, becaue there will be no more illegal immigrants.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:56 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
j) You don't care if the United States becomes just another overpopulated, under resourced third world country unable to take care of its own people, much less able to help out others in time of need.

Considering that China can feed 1.3 billion people on less fertile ground, this is not a real concern for me for the time being.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:56 pm
Quote:
i) It's okay with you that wages are artificially depressed in industries where large numbers of illegals are working

illegal alien workers do not depress wages, greedy employers do. This issue could be addressed by applying depart of labor standards such as minimum wages to all human beings.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:58 pm
Quote:
j) You don't care if the United States becomes just another overpopulated, under resourced third world country unable to take care of its own people, much less able to help out others in time of need.

Do you actually think this likely?
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 01:58 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
i) It's okay with you that wages are artificially depressed in industries where large numbers of illegals are working

This is no artificial depression, it's supply and demand in the job market: a principle dear to each libertarian's heart. as for "large number of illegals", legalization solves that problem.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 02:00 pm
dyslexia wrote:
h) You don't mind if a few more tons of illegal drugs are brought into the country and peddled to your kids

As a libertarian, I support the legalization of drugs, which would free up enough police resources to protect the kids.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sat 27 May, 2006 02:01 pm
We can also blame the board of directors that pays CEOs way beyond what they are worth; some hundreds of millions in salaries and stock options. Blaming illegals for depressed wages implies something not rational or factual.
0 Replies
 
 

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