50
   

What should be done about illegal immigration?

 
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 11:58 am
@ebrown p,
ebrown wrote:
Quote:
Well you could stop enabling people who are spreading lies-- particularly when similar lies have done so much damage to immigrants (both legal and illegal) over the past 100 years.


I don't enable anyone that lies about legal or illegal immigration. I'm one citizen with an opinion that says "I have no control over congress or other people's thinking and actions."

I'm not a control freak like some people on a2k, and I know that some people will agree as well as disagree with my personal opinions. That's life.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 01:09 pm
Does anyone think CIR will be attempted this (an election) year? McCain doesn't seem to think it will, primarily because it is an election year.

On the other hand, I read an editorial in a Dallas newspaper (online) the other day wherein the Mexican consul there had some harsh words for the 500,000 or so immigrants in the border-state city to makeover their image in anticipation of an upcoming debate.

Quote:

Mexico's new consul general in Dallas, Juan Carlos Cué-Vega, has an admirable and ambitious agenda for the estimated 400,000 to 500,000 Mexicans living in Dallas and other cities covered by his consular region. Cué-Vega says his compatriots here have a bad reputation, and it's time for an image makeover.

With refreshing candor, he is blunt about the problem: "Frankly, we have spoken about the issues that make us not look very good, like celebrations using guns, littering, [being] noisy in the neighborhoods, leaving the kids at home while going to work. These are social and cultural things that we need to change."

Cué-Vega says President Felipe Calderón shares his concerns. Until now, we suspect, Mexican officials have been reluctant to raise these issues publicly, not wanting to fuel the extremely harsh atmosphere in this country over illegal immigration.

But it's an important discussion to have. President Barack Obama says he wants to reintroduce comprehensive immigration reform, which means a new round of recriminations is coming. Cué-Vega acknowledges the role that Mexicans' image will play in that debate.

The vast majority of Mexican immigrants are hard workers lured here by jobs, he says, but they don't always think about the responsibilities and behavioral changes that U.S. residency involves. "We have to educate our people ... to respect the law."

That respect doesn't just start when an illegal immigrant takes up residence here. It begins at the border, and when an immigrant enters illegally, his reputation instantly becomes tainted in the eyes of many Americans, regardless of how the immigrant behaves as a resident.

That said, Cué-Vega's agenda is commendable because the illegal immigration issue isn't going away anytime soon. So the next best thing is to ensure that immigrants assimilate and abide by the laws and customs of this land.

The consul general has started his campaign by making the rounds at immigrant centers such as Casa Guanajuato in Oak Cliff. He should also consider meet-and-greet sessions with police and neighborhood code enforcement officers, who can clarify any ambiguities about what kinds of behavior are out of bounds. Churches and meetings of neighborhood associations also are a great way to get the message out.

Had Cué-Vega's predecessors launched this campaign earlier, the atmosphere against illegal immigrants might not have reached the boiling point of recent years. The message is overdue, but late is certainly better than never.




ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 02:41 pm
@Irishk,
The Irish are also gearing up for the upcoming immigration debate. At pro-immigrant rallies around Boston you always see this shirt...

http://www.irishphiladelphia.com/files/images/Legalize_the_Irish.jpg

There are prominent Irish-American voices in the pro-immigrant movement, as well as support from within Ireland for immigration reform.

cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 02:43 pm
@Irishk,
My kind of Mexican Council General; he even understands the difference between legal and illegal.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  2  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 03:27 pm
While I certainly have thoughts about what should be done about illegal immigration, I have no thoughts about what can be done to turn this thread into a meaningful dialogue about immigration, does anyone?
hamburgboy
 
  2  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 03:35 pm
@dyslexia,
you wrote " meaningful dialogue " , didn't you ?
you'll have a long wait , i'd think .
as always : "best of luck " - and don't get lonely waiting .
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 03:37 pm
We are told by the illegal immigration dupes in this thread how wonderful and productive these people are. If this is true, they should return to their home countries, which certainly need such people. They can work to build up businesses and otherwise improve those countries. We need their jobs in this country.

Regarding their stoop labor on our farms, those farmers should change their crops so that planting and harvesting could be handled by mechanization. The crops that lend themselves only to stoop labor could be grown in countries with an abundance of stoop labor.
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 03:51 pm
@Advocate,
Are you wonderful and productive, Advocate?
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 11:19 pm
@dyslexia,
dyslexia wrote:

While I certainly have thoughts about what should be done about illegal immigration, I have no thoughts about what can be done to turn this thread into a meaningful dialogue about immigration, does anyone?
Doesn't seem too likely, because neither side seems willing to see things from the other's perspective. And it's not just those who harbor mindless bigotry either: Those with compassion for their fellow man are flat out refusing to give up any ground to those with meerly an irrational bias too. Making clear, logical arguments seems to help not at all. See Ebrown.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 11:25 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
Well, when you pose everyone as either ". . . those with compassion for their fellow man" and with ". . . meerly an irrational bias. . ." what do you expect in the way of meaningful dialogue?
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2010 11:39 pm
@roger,
On page 330? Not much. I don't mean to impugn you, btw.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2010 10:16 am
@OCCOM BILL,
OCCOM BILL wrote:

dyslexia wrote:

While I certainly have thoughts about what should be done about illegal immigration, I have no thoughts about what can be done to turn this thread into a meaningful dialogue about immigration, does anyone?
Doesn't seem too likely, because neither side seems willing to see things from the other's perspective. And it's not just those who harbor mindless bigotry either: Those with compassion for their fellow man are flat out refusing to give up any ground to those with meerly an irrational bias too. Making clear, logical arguments seems to help not at all. See Ebrown.

What a bunch of crap for an opinion. When you have nothing in the way of meaningful or credible arguments, you always resort to the accusation of bigotry. I am glad you apparently changed to your true colors,from what I thought was somewhat reasonable when I first joined this board into a Democratic voter, Bill, because that is your mindset. Liberals are emotionally based and they always appeal to people's emotions, and that is why the Democrats use demagoguery as a refined craft of theirs, and they woo their voters with emotionally based crap, filled with promises and vague slogans, while accusing their opponents of all kinds of things like bigotry, racism, and hatred, because apparently they judge others by their own hidden feelings and emotions. Their policies are not founded upon responsibible and sensible policies, only emotion. That is how most of the great leftists in history gained power, so if you like that company, stick with it, Bill, but you reap what you sow.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2010 10:32 am
@ebrown p,
ebrown p wrote:
The Irish are also gearing up for the upcoming immigration debate. At pro-immigrant rallies around Boston you always see this shirt...


LOL, thanks, I also like the "Got Blarney?" one. I think they'll probably wait until sometime in 2011 to bring CIR up again, though. JMHO.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2010 11:01 am
@roger,
roger wrote:
Well, when you pose everyone as either ". . . those with compassion for their fellow man" and with ". . . meerly an irrational bias. . ." what do you expect in the way of meaningful dialogue?


Well said.
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 09:31 pm
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4005/4290827150_ddb521e5fb_o.jpg

Japanese Americans and Immigration: Where We Fit

by Guest Contributor Kristin Fukushima
(Policy coordinator for the Japanese American Citizens league)

Quote:

Explaining why I, an Asian American, am involved in the fight for comprehensive immigration reform (CIR) is simple enough. To break it down quickly: 63% of the AAPI community is foreign-born; immigrants from the Asian Pacific region face the longest backlogs (6 of 10 countries with the longest backlogs); 10% of the undocumented population is AAPI, etc, etc.
...

And why should JAs care about CIR " where do we fit in the debate?

Well, JAs have been involved in the fight for fair and humane immigration reform for decades. But now we’ve disassociated ourselves from the racism and xenophobia that Japanese and other Asian immigrants faced " exclusion laws against immigrating, naturalizing or owning land, as well as struggle to overcome it all (such as gaining the right to naturalize).

...

it’s about remembering where we come from, and our family’s experiences. The narrative for immigrants remains the same " folks just want a better life for their family and children. And JAs now can be an example of how immigration helps shape this country with new ideas, culture, and flavor. It’s also about solidarity " recognizing that if we truly consider ourselves part of this umbrella we call the AAPI community then we must similarly take on the issues in our community. And finally, it’s about reframing the way we think about the JA community " recognizing there’s this part of our community that the larger portion generally overlooks, and including new immigrant narratives and needs into the larger community.

....


http://www.racialicious.com/2010/01/20/japanese-americans-and-immigration-where-we-fit/

It is a good thing for Asians and Hispanics to be working together to for Immigrant rights.

0 Replies
 
praglen
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 01:41 am
No one has really offered what seems to me the best way to reverse the immigration(both legal and illegal). If the U.S. opens manufacturing plants, home-building industry and Wal-Marts, Home Depots and Ace Hardware Stores in Latin and South America, the immigrants who are already here will return in droves, since those jobs will pay more, with less subterfuge, less lying, less danger and eliminate the need to send money home. No wall, no river, no ocean can prevent those who come here thru Mexico, the Gulf of Mexico, the Atlantic Ocean or Canada from getting through. Putting 1,500 on ships every day would take a lifetime to send the 10-20 million already here; just not practical.
Let's give money to these countries for training and education and hope some of it reaches its intended target.
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 09:57 am
@praglen,
praglen wrote:

No one has really offered what seems to me the best way to reverse the immigration(both legal and illegal). If the U.S. opens manufacturing plants, home-building industry and Wal-Marts, Home Depots and Ace Hardware Stores in Latin and South America, the immigrants who are already here will return in droves, since those jobs will pay more, with less subterfuge, less lying, less danger and eliminate the need to send money home. No wall, no river, no ocean can prevent those who come here thru Mexico, the Gulf of Mexico, the Atlantic Ocean or Canada from getting through. Putting 1,500 on ships every day would take a lifetime to send the 10-20 million already here; just not practical.
Let's give money to these countries for training and education and hope some of it reaches its intended target.




Your solutions are very problematic. For one thing, we would lose many jobs to the countries in which we build plants and businesses. This has already happened thousands of times. Also, considering the huge population numbers in the other countries, we could not afford the money needed to build the plants, businesses, and schools needed to reverse the immigration to this country.

Once this country returns to a vibrant economy, we will again be flooded with illegals and their attendant problems. That is the truth of the matter.
0 Replies
 
Pemerson
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Feb, 2010 04:42 pm
@praglen,
Don't put the cart before the horse. First, Mexico would have to develop laws. They have no law.
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Feb, 2010 04:51 pm
@Pemerson,
Quote:
Don't put the cart before the horse. First, Mexico would have to develop laws. They have no law.


That is an really, really stupid thing to say. Mexico not only has laws... they have a Congress and a President and indoor plumbing.

http://www.diputados.gob.mx/LeyesBiblio/

Pemerson
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Feb, 2010 06:08 pm
@ebrown p,
OK, sorry, stupid thing for me to say.

My son is married to a girl from Mexico who is an attorney, she got her degree in Mexico. They live here but visit there quite often. Both say Mexico has no law. What, then, are they talking about? That was their reply when I suggested another stupid thing - they are such close neighbors, maybe we could all just blend together.

So, I'll check this out. Did see your website, thank you. I'll call them in Michigan tomorrow and get back here. They are two intelligent people.
 

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