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Bill Bennett: The Man of Virtues Has a Vice

 
 
Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 May, 2003 10:43 am
lola - I guess I live in a cave then, because no, I haven't seen much of Bennett over the last year other than him pimping for his k12.com venture.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 May, 2003 12:13 pm
Earlier, Scrat wrote:
Quote:
lola - I must admit to considerable ignorance of Bennett, both his history and present day actions.


Scrat used that excuse in order to ask Lola:
Quote:
Can you give us some specific examples of his engaging in what you call "self righteous finger pointing"?


Then Lola (quite properly in my opinion) wrote:

Quote:
Good night, Scrat. Where do you live? If you haven't seen Bill Bennett self righteously pointing his finger dozens of times, then you must be livin in a cave somewhere. He's been on Larry King Live on CNN repeatedly. He's been all over the place. The very voice of virtue and purity. Why he's so f--kin pure he makes my stomach turn.


To which, Scrat now writes:
Quote:
I guess I live in a cave then, because no, I haven't seen much of Bennett over the last year other than him pimping for his k12.com venture.


Interesting that Scrat would now limit the knowledge of Bennett to just the last year.

MY GUESS: Scrat has heard Bennett and heard his sactimoneous bullshit just as the rest of us have. But as Blatham pointed out, Scrat was probably just trying to set Lola up -- rather than arguing the comments on their merits.

What nonsense!

I surely hope Lola, Blatham, or someone else calls Scrat on this -- because Scrat is apparently bright enough not to engage me in debate.



Earlier, when Scrat wrote: "(Possibly) He (Bennett) considers it (gambling) a vice and left it out in an attempt to avoid being hypocritical"...

...I questioned him/her with:

"I would be interesting in the reasoning that causes you to suppose that by "leaving it out" Bennett would be attempting to avoid being hypocritical.

Why would leaving it out -- which seems to me to be blatantly hypocritical whether he thought it a vice of scale or a vice per se -- -- not be considered hypocritical in your opinion?

Scrat ducked the question. Perhaps one of you could pose it to Scrat again. I'd be interested to hear a response.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 May, 2003 01:31 pm
"I surely hope Lola, Blatham, or someone else calls Scrat on this -- because Scrat is apparently bright enough not to engage me in debate."

...sheeeesh!.....
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williamhenry3
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 May, 2003 05:48 pm
Scrat is reminiscent of a puppy who snaps at his owner's heels in playful fun. At his level of intelligence and immaturity, his bark is worse than his bite. Snapping back at him is like throwing crumbs to the puppy. He'll just want more. So, it seems best to keep from offering him something on which he can nibble.[/i]
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 May, 2003 07:17 pm
Do try to keep personal comments off the boards, folks.
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Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 02:01 pm
Yeah, let's not alienate poor Scrat. As much as we disagree with Scrat's opinions, we need that point of view here on A2K. It would be boring if we all agreed, no?

Back to Bennett...Frank Rich wrote a wonderful piece on him in today's NY Times: "Tupac's Revenge on Bennett":

http://www.nytimes.com/auth/login?URI=http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/18/arts/18RICH.html
0 Replies
 
PDiddie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 02:02 pm
How about an extremely personal comment about Bookie Bennett from Katha Pollitt at The Nation, blatham?

Quote:
I wish it had been sex, maybe some of that hot "man on dog" action that Senator Rick Santorum is so keen on chatting about. But let me not be picky. Since we are talking about that thundering sultan of sanctimony Bill Bennett, high-stakes gambling will do quite nicely. In eleven books, including the mega-selling Book of Virtues, a PBS cartoon series on morality for kids, countless speeches at $50,000 a pop, a slew of op-eds and more face time on TV than the man who squeezes the Charmin, Bennett has made himself our Cato, inveighing against everyone else's licentious, addicted, family-destroying ways. Abortion!, he growled. Drugs! Rap! Adultery! Homosexuality! Divorce! Single moms! The Simpsons! To the wall with you, feminists, gay priests and fornicating Democrats Bill Clinton, Jesse Jackson and Gary Condit!

* * *

Bennett's point was never just that people ought to obey the law: Sure, drink yourself into a daily stupor, as long as you're not driving. No, The Book of Virtues evoked the old Aristotelian/ Stoic/Christian/Early American civic values: piety, sobriety, temperance, honesty, prudence, self-control, setting an example. It's hard to imagine John Bunyan or George Washington giving Bennett a high-five on his way to private rooms at various Las Vegas casinos, where he was such a loyal and lavish customer he was comp'ed for limos, rooms and Lord knows what else.

* * *

Bennett's defenders make much of the fact that he never condemned gambling and so was not actually a hypocrite. Leaving your own pet vice off a long, long list of sins, and then, when you are found out, exempting that vice as practiced by you but not as practiced by others--that's not exculpation from charges of hypocrisy, that's what hypocrisy is.

If Bennett were a jolly, modest fellow, full of love for fallen humanity and the first to admit he was just another sinner like the rest of us--if he were less quick to impute the worst motives to perfectly ordinary behavior, like having two kids; if he spent less time promoting rigid, puritanical morals and more time promoting, oh, kindness and tolerance and looking into your own heart and cutting other people some slack because you never really know what demons they're contending with--no one would be piling on now.

But then, with a message like that, no one would have heard of him in the first place. You don't get to play Christian on TV, or amass real political power along with your millions, by urging people not to throw the first stone, especially if they live in a glass house.

Jesus tried that, and look what happened to him.


Bah, Humbug

And here's my comment on her comment:

Ba-da-BOOM! Ba-da-BING! Ba-da-BAM!
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 04:28 pm
PD

Very funny finale! To both you and the Musketeer...thanks kindly for these two wonderful pieces.

We ought to have a contest to come up with the appropriate Dantean end for this man (a la The Inferno), where the punishments quite exquisitely match the particular sin.
0 Replies
 
Tartarin
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 05:02 pm
Bennett's sin is something along the lines of Imposition. The Puritanical sin. It is never about "I'm making every effort to be a good person." It's always imposing your issues on others: "I'm not sparing my efforts to make everyone else a good person." Probably he's one of those unpleasant sorts who won't take one step to change themselves but spend a lifetime trying to change others. Perhaps Pride is the sin in question. Look forward to reading Rich -- but wait dutifully for my Sunday NYTimes to come in Monday's mail rather than read it on the screen.
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Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 06:37 pm
PDiddie

In your excellent quote from Katha Pollitt at The Nation, you posted:

Quote:
Bennett's defenders make much of the fact that he never condemned gambling and so was not actually a hypocrite. Leaving your own pet vice off a long, long list of sins, and then, when you are found out, exempting that vice as practiced by you but not as practiced by others--that's not exculpation from charges of hypocrisy, that's what hypocrisy is.


My point earlier -- and the reason I asked Scrat to explain why she thinks Bennett was not a hypocrite by doing that.

I've never gotten a response from Scrat -- but apparently Scrat is not talking to me.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 06:38 pm
Or -- cannot explain it.
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 May, 2003 07:06 pm
Maybe it's because, oh - how did you put it? He "is smart enough not to engage you in debate"?
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BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 May, 2003 08:26 am
Blatham
Blatham, how is "TILT" for a dantean end?

BumbleBeeBoogie
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 May, 2003 09:10 am
bumblebee

I like that! I him cranking down the bandit's arm, and the rolling picture sequence slowing and settling on ...a fat joint, eminem, and an erect black penis... TILT.

My dantean finale for the fellow would involve him, Santorum, and various farm animals.
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williamhenry3
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 May, 2003 09:31 pm
Bravo, blatham Exclamation [/i]
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Eva
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 May, 2003 09:48 pm
And mirrors, blatham...don't forget mirrors.
Lots of 'em...
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williamhenry3
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 May, 2003 09:56 pm
. . . and billowing clouds of cigar smoke, blatham.
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BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 May, 2003 08:58 am
Tom Delay's cigars
Of course, Tom Delay can provide the cigars to make the smoke.

---BumbleBeeBoogie
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 May, 2003 09:03 am
I'll provide the mirrors.
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Ethel2
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 May, 2003 10:49 am
Surely there's some way that I can help with this community effort. Let's see..................oh mirrors............somehow I'm feeling distracted.............being the stuggling sinner that I am.
0 Replies
 
 

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