Sheep - a poem in one sentence

aidan-

No. I've never been. There's millions of most beautiful places in the world and if you can't see all of them you might as well not see any of them. I find bed fits the bill best.



You can do anything you want with me. I'm like playdough. You can annoy Mathos as much as you feel like as far as I'm concerned. I find indignation quite amusing especially when their eyes are popping and that vein in the temple turns purple and pumps furiously.

aidan asked-



I don't do advice except keep a clean head and always carry a lightbulb.

There are a lot of factors involved anyway and I don't know any of them. And it depends on what the money is doing elsewhere. Property has been a pretty good investment for a long time now but the future is a bet.

There are property companies who won't be selling out on you every two years. Usually the best thing is to consult with the poshest estate agency in the area you are interested in and it is often unhelpful to uproot children from what they are used to.

Here's my dilemma. The pound equals (on any given day) anywhere from 1.75 to 2.00 dollars. So every pound I save is going to be worth almost two dollars if/when I move back to the US. Factor in the reality that property here costs between two and three times what the equivalent property in the US would cost and I think it's pretty clear that I wouldn't make that up in equity. I've also been able to live in a really nice house that I can afford to rent - but could never afford to buy.

On the other hand, I really feel that I may never want to return to the US to live. I can picture staying here indefinitely. My son wants to do university here and my daughter likes it as much as we both do. So if I am going to stay, I should go ahead and get on the housing ladder now, because as you say - property values (and costs) will only go up. And it would be nice to know that you're not going to get kicked out of your house anytime someone else gets a notion to sell it. There are plenty of nice houses for rent within twenty miles of here - but as you said- I don't want to uproot my kids from their school and friends. And I love this little village. I really, really want to stay right here.

So I think I should buy something. But I know that if I do, I'll just get right back on that treadmill of buying, buying, buying stuff. You just wouldn't believe how crazy I can go in a garden shop when I have my own garden to design and plant. If I have an addiction - that's it.

So should I do the economically intelligent thing and forfeit security - or take a possible economic loss and insure security?

aidan wrote-



I don't think I said that. What I said is that property as an investment is a bet with a good track record up to here. If I was sure of a continuing rise I would place a buy bet on the IG Index's Property Betting Scheme as profits from betting are tax free.

There are pros and cons to the buy/rent problem whether you stay here or go back to the US.

I know too little about your circumstances and attitudes to offer any advice about what you should do but you might bear in mind that property here and in the US and the exchange rate between the £ and the $ are and,indeed, coffee prices are all subject to markets and thus unpredictable with certainty.

I'll illustrate for you with an example. I once found that a friend of mine, who was in the demolition business, had a valuable building taken up with the storage of about 200 tons of scrap lead which, that day, was trading at £260 per ton to sell and £275 to buy. The £15 is known as the spread and provides the funds to run the exchange as with shares.

He said he was waiting for the price to rise. When I explained to him that he was betting the money the building was worth to rent out on a price rise and that he could sell all the lead at £260 a ton and then buy it back on paper and rent the building he did some calculations and sold all the lead. He then used the money from the sale to buy lead futures to the same amount and rented the building out.

But emotions are involved with your case. The first thing to decide is whether you are staying here. There is no economically intelligent thing. With housing personal factors are important. If one choice was obviously sensible everybody would take it. The simple fact that there is a strong market in houses for sale and for rent indicates a fairly even balance between the choices from an economic point of view.

You almost might as well toss a coin but I would say that if property in the US is, as you say, 2 or 3 times cheaper than here then it is because it is less sought after by those who have the choice. Property in Serbia is probably 10 times cheaper than here although I don't know.

I hope that helps.

You did help. And you're right. Emotions are definitely involved for me. Feeling that I have a home is really important to me. I love this house - and now I have to leave. This is the first time in almost twenty years someone else has had control over whether I could stay in my home or not. I don't like the lack of control I feel over that.

But I also don't like feeling tied down financially. And I know what it's like to live somewhere and not be able to move because you have financial obligations that aren't easily transferred. But then again, I love this place and would love to own a little piece of it. So, I'm just a bundle of conflicts and contradictions sometimes.

Anyhow - I had a piece of good news this evening. My son's best friend's mother's boyfriend has a nice barn conversion he wants to rent out about three streets over from where we live right now. He said he'd give it to me on a renewable three month lease so I can stay if I want, or move if I find something I want to buy. That's the beauty of village life - everyone knows someone who is willing to help. One problem solved- for the moment anyway.

You can be really nice sometimes, you know that Spendius?

PS: I think the reason property is cheaper in the US is because it's just so much more abundantly available. I'm not sure, but I think the percentage of home owners is at least as high as in the UK, if not higher. Homeownership is pretty much the aspiration no matter what a person's economic status is over there- or at least that's always been my impression.

I see The Oriental Genie is pontificating as usual.

Yes of course I have children and grandchildren, the effort on knowing 'kids' was purely hypothetical, Americans do take time to grasp things. As for Widow Twanky and her cohorts, they appear in Aladdin, I put Cinderella aside to give excrement brains a lever, which he missed and yammered on about his lead etc.

With regards to your property concerns, you should buy. Buy and buy as quickly as you are able to. I have no idea how long you have been renting, but that money is dead! It is no Jesus fund either, it cannot be resurrected.

Property in the UK will always be a profitable commodity, and if you spend a fortune at the market garden ..so what? Appearances are valuable and should you decide to sell, a pleasant and attractive scene is far better than an eyesore or even a standard appearance. The size of America alone is one factor in creating cheaper land and house prices. Plus the fact, (which amazes me) so many Americans do rent. I understand that Las Vegas is still the most sought after location in America. However, you would have to determine which element of Americans really wish to live there. Your countrymen are also nomadic, most move from state to state on a regular basis. Britain, being such a small country does not appear to have such a trait.

Divorce rates are climbing, which means every household using one home, suddenly requires two. Immigration is another strong factor to benefit the housing market. As property prices rise and they are and will continue to do so, the costs of renting also increases. Good tenants, wishing to live in a comfortable and pleasant surrounding automatically spend on improving the value of rented property, this in real terms only benefits the landlord.

The Oriental Genie mentions property in Serbia being perhaps some ten times cheaper than in the UK. Of course it is, who wishes to live there?
Many Brits started the trend of having a second property in the warmer climates of Europe, causing prices to climb, Spaniards for instance were running out of coastal properties to sell, so they build new housing estates now for wealthy Brits, and stick a fish and chip shop on every fourth corner. The in crowd are now doing the same in the Middle East, Dubai with its fancy apartments and houses in the sea being a prime example. It is totally irrelevant as to you returning to the States or not, the property will continue to rise, if you rent it will go up along with inflation.

Not a lot to it really is there?

Hey Mathos- I actually saw Aladdin. I knew those names sounded familiar. That was the first (and so far only) panto I went to over here. It was pretty funny. The girl who played Aladdin had a nice voice and the guy who played Widow Twanky was appropriately burly and drag-queen like.

I think you're right - I know you're right- about buying. It's just so much easier to rent. Back to that lazy streak of mine, I'm afraid. But at least I have time to look around now and not feel like I have to settle for the first thing I find I can afford.

Was it a miserable rainy day where you were? They had the heat on at work, it was so cold. I hope it's nicer this week-end. I have tickets for the Chelsea Garden Show so I hope it stops raining.

Well you are the one to make the decision about purchasing property, it mainly depends on your circumstances as well, but not only will buying give you added security, the final sale should be extremely profitable for you, especially if you return to the States in 10 or 15 years time. Good luck with whichever route you select.


I am glad you enjoyed Aladdin, the Christmas Panto's can be good fun.

I was saturated this morning, for the second time this week, but worked until lunchtime (singing in the rain) after a steaming hot shower and change of clothes I decided to finish some paperwork and took the opportunity to view the threads. I was wishing I had done the clerical a.m. and had a windy cold but dry afternoon to do my manual outside work. Never mind, we will see what tomorrow brings.

I envy you going to the Chelsea Garden Show, I should have made time, but Southport is also very good in August and I will be going there.


I think the signs are pretty good for a decent June through to September though, I have not seen a long range forecast, but hope is a good booster regardless.

The first three weeks of May were not bad at all, I have been stripped to the waist most days and definitely pulled my tan back. It is good to work outside and feel the warmth of the sun on your body, don't you think?

Take care Aidan, watch that Tyke though, he's obviously a slice or two short of a full loaf.

I'll be almost sixty if fifteen years- that's scary to think about- but then as you say, maybe I'll be rich and sixty. My best woman friend is sixty and another woman friend I'm close to is over seventy. And they're doing fine. Funnily enough - they're more fun to be around and freer in their expression and attitudes than most of the women of my own age that I know and even those who are younger. I myself feel they've earned the right to sniff at stuffy convention, and have nothing left to lose. Although my sixty year old friend told me the other day, "I broke a rule...and I'm such a rule follower...what do you think might happen now?" I just laughed - I told her I guess it depended on which rule she had chosen to break.

Yeah, I had to have my arm twisted to go to the Panto I went to. I didn't think it would be my cup of tea, but a colleague was in it, and my daughter likes that sort of thing - so we went - I was surprised at how much I laughed. And now my daughter, who is a good little actress has joined our village drama society and they'll be doing a panto next winter. I think she told me it's The Three Bears. Maybe she'll get the part of Goldilocks- she'll definitely have to wear a wig though- her hair is darkest brown.

I like working and walking in the wind and rain. Being outside in extreme weather (except heat and cold - which I hate) makes me feel more alive - like I'm experiencing something I normally would have missed. We must have gotten your morning rain here in the afternoon. It was almost clear enough for me to consider hanging laundry out on the line yesterday morning before I left for work, but it poured all afternoon, so I was glad I didn't.

I'm going to Chelsea with my horticulture class. I'm looking forward to it, as I've been told it is the premier garden/flower show throughout the world, actually. What do you think? Could that be true, or do you think they're just bragging? Anyway, I take my exam June 28, and then I'll have a Level 1 certificate from the Royal Horticultural Society. I haven't heard about the Southport thing. My August is shaping up to be really busy though, so I'll have to miss it I guess.

Yes, May was beautiful until about a week ago. The last bit of April was lovely as well. I'm holding out hope for a nice summer as well. Do you have a Farmer's Almanac over here, as they do in the States? It's a little booklet published each year that farmers can consult to get an idea of what the year's weather might hold in store.

I love feeling the warmth of the sun - always.

When you said, "Watch the tyke" I thought you were talking about my son, and I wondered how you could possibly know anything about his mental status. (He's actually one of the most down-to-earth and practical people I have the pleasure to be acquainted with).

Anyway, can we try to obey at least one convention? I know every society has its own set of "rules"- but there is one I feel its important to import from my upbringing- you know the one about minding my own business and not talking about people unless they're present. I have no idea what anyone's mental status is on this forum. As Spendius has said in the past - people present themselves as they want to be perceived- so the truth is something that is hard to come by in this setting. For that very reason, little of anything is ever obvious about anyone.

I'm reading an interesting book about societies and how even the most well-intentioned utopias seem to always disintegrate into cruelty and mayhem, many times even more extreme than the established societies they originate from. It's Kazuo Ishiguro's new novel. I just started it last night, but so far it's pretty interesting. It has to do with how people are pressured to conform, how far people will go to subjugate the will of others to their own- however subtly, how willing some people are to twist themselves into any shape they need to in order to "fit in", and how far others will go to retain their individuality.

How about you Mathos? Has it ever been your burning desire to "fit in"?

PS - I hope you noticed I didn't use quotes. I also hope you noticed how much longer this post is. (I did that on purpose though - just to prove a point . I'll annoy you one way or the other- not really- just joking).

PPS- No rain so far this morning, just gray and foggy. I guess we'll have to wait and see what the day holds in store for us. Talk to you later.

Mathos wrote-



That's a load of baloney designed to impress economically illiterate people with the writer's financial acumen which,on this evidence, is non-existent. It is a pure guess. It may turn out to be good advice to follow or it may not. The financial difference between buying and renting is marginal for the obvious reason that if it wasn't the perceived worst option would be entirely neglected which would cause it's price to fall until the marginality was restored. That's what markets do.

Rent paid out is not dead money. It is fee paid to a landord for him having invested his money in a property he isn't going to live in and it leaves the tenant with that amount of money to invest elsewhere.

The marginality of the choice brings the personal factors into prominence and those,in this case, are unknown.

Spendius,

From the drivel you write above and other elements of twaddle you appear to relish in having the simple minded audacity to put into print under your name;

I can only assume that at the time of your birth the midwife ( having trouble in relating what she had found) slapped your face and you have been talking through your arse ever since!

Aidan,

Tell your woman friend, that at 60, there are no rules, she can do and say what the hell she wants.

I wish your daughter well in her village drama society, it is excellent education in oh so many patterns of life.

You should try walking naked in the rain in some isolated area of the countryside, it is a marvellous experience.

The Chelsea Flower /Garden show, cannot be touched. Southport is good, but not truly comparable. I wish you well with your forthcoming exam, I am confident you will achieve high grades. Let me know.

The farmers are usually very accurate in weather predictions, however there is a natural human tendency for them to exceed the bounds of their common knowledge and attempt long range forecasting, this is rarely accurate.

The sun is life, it is beautiful.

I cannot envisage anything in my writing which would cause you to think for one moment that I would be referring to your 'son' when I mentioned the Tyke. There is only one Tyke I ever mention on these threads and it is obvious to any reader, who I place in this category. Don't you think you were being rather melodramatic in your statement? Would you class yourself as a 'Drama Queen?'

I have to disagree with your comments, which in any event are basically aimed at The Oriental Genie, it is obvious, the clown is a simple minded oaf of a bookworm! I doubt he could repair a bicycle puncture!


It must be an extremely difficult occupation managing 'society' it must also be essential for the powers that be to keep control of us 'saps' They own us you know, lock stock and barrel, along with everything we touch, eat, drink or inhale.

No Aidan, I have no desire at all to fit in, I know enough to comply so as to remain as free as I possibly am able to be. This is why I enjoy my jungle travels (you might wish to join the other members of A2K who are on my mailing list. All e-mail address's I receive are treated with due respect.)

Your correspondence is far better without the quotes, no doubt you now realise that also.

A little rain this morning, but all in all a beautiful day here, sunny, reasonable temperature, no wind. Excellent!

Take care Aidan, I wish you well.

Mathos-

Would you mind explaining what you mean by-



I gave a very short, and admittedly superficial, explanation of how the markets in rented and purchased property operate. I had to keep it simple because of the highly technical nature of these operations.

For the benefit of other readers, and myself, will you inform us of what you see false in it. Just saying it is "twaddle" is hardly satisfactory.

It is also an important principle of investment that if you get onto a good thing, as you seem to think property purchase is as of now, it is very silly to tell anyone else about it. Or have you bought into the property market recently and are trying to ramp it up so you can take your profits and leave those you have advised holding the hot potato.

This is what it's about for me. It's about living somewhere I love and not wanting to have to leave. And this is the day I ended up with - the sun came out at about 4:00 today and everything was shiny and green, washed clean by the rain. Someone (my father) once told me that in his opinion, a perfect spring day in England is more perfect than a perfect spring day any other place in the world. (He spent a lot of time here when he was in the service, and traveling through his job). I think he's right about that. I think it's because all the rain makes it so incredibly green.

Hi Spendius.

Mathos-in terms of my friend saying what she wants- she pretty much does. You should hear what she says about Paul Bettany and RussellCrowe (She's an Admiral Lord Nelson fan and a fanatic about the movie, Master and Commander). In some ways she's this very proper Englishwoman, retired from years of teaching English, but catch her in the right mood and she's the funniest, most plain spoken person I've ever met. We have a ball, sitting around reading poems, drinking wine and talking about movie stars. (I like Clive Owens).

No walking naked for me. Too many stinging nettles where I go.

I think I'll do alright on my exam. I've done a good job on all the test papers he's given us. Thanks for your good wishes.

I didn't think I was being melodramatic. I thought you said "your" tyke and then referenced a he. I only have two tykes - and only one is a he. After I read it through- I got it. No, I'm not a drama queen. Okay, maybe sometimes...

I'm not talking about cops and others whose job it is to manage society. I'm talking about other everyday, run of the mill people who try to impose their will on others. (The book by the way is turning into kind of a disappointment. I love his writing - it's always very straightforward and unadorned - he wrote Remains of the Day among others- but this plot is turning out to be a little far-fetched for my taste).

You have no desire to fit in anywhere? I envy you that sort of independent spirit. No, I'm not giving you my e-mail address. As I've told anyone else who has asked me - I don't give contact details to people I haven't met in the flesh. Just due precaution.

You take care too. I wish you well as well.

Top picture is the best.

My house is just at the bottom of that hill.

You mean I could come scooting down that with no hands on the crossies and hit your front gate and go rolling all over your front lawn with you in my arms giggling like crazy in the warm spring sunshine and I wouldn't get wrung out like a dishcloth.

Takes me back a bit does that top picture.

Oh hell no. You'd have scooted through all sorts of cow pies (or whatever you guys call them over here). You'd need a good bath and to wash your clothes before I'd give you a hug of any kind.

And you (being an Englishman) know that as a matter of course there are hedges, stone walls, gates and all different other sorts of boundaries in place that would make just scooting down the hill impossible.

It's a really steep hill. On the days I went up there in the snow, I had to scoot back down it on my butt because I kept slipping and sliding.

Is Mathos going somewhere? He sounded like he was saying good-bye forever or something. Don't you think you two could be nicer to each other?

aidan wrote-



Hey Rebecca- Study the 3rd picture then.

I thought I was being nice to Mathos in view of his dumb advice. It's standard practice anyway for English men to exchange competitive banter. Americans seem to practice extreme flattery or extreme hate.

You really should offer some advice on photography to others I've seen recently on these boards.

It's a dull drizzle being dumped down outside. I think I'll stay inside.