God help me, I'm one of THEM

Oh man, I sympathize. (I ain't shootin' though!) You know I've been through all of this with sozlet. She's girly girly girly girly and I've just kind of accepted that. I keep putting various things in her path and seeing what she's interested in, and going with that. And they're not ALL girly. AND! Small victory -- she doesn't want to do cheerleading this year.

But, yeah, I know just what you mean.

No cheerleading, eh? Did she say why, or did something else catch her fancy?

I'm actually ok with the cheerleading and dancing, I just want her to do soccer, or some other team sport too. I just think she can learn so much from it. But I don't know why it makes me angry that she won't try. She's only 4, it's no big deal. There are other kids who do the same thing. It's just that she really IS an aggressive girl, and fearless. So I expected her just to go out there and take over. And now, two games into the season, I don't know if I should let her quit or make her keep putting the gear on and going, even if it is just to watch.

The cheerleading thing is really more about the teacher than the subject, I think. The teacher was NOT good. Ditzy, disorganized, and plain uninspiring. Towards the end of it last year sozlet was saying she didn't want to go, and because I saw how bad the teacher was I didn't push. The main goal was to meet some local kids + parents, and that part happened.

So I just asked her if she wanted to do it this year, and first she was enthusiastic but then (OK I'm bad) I said, "remember how at the end of the year you didnt want to go anymore?" and she said "Oh, right! I don't want to." And that was that.

Looking back at myself when I was a kid as well as at sozlet when she was 4 (which was, uh, a few months ago ), I wonder if part of it is just plain individuality/ bloody-mindedness? That the fact that you, your husband, and her big brother are so into soccer is precisely why she's uninterested? As in, maybe some OTHER team sport would be more to her liking (and enable her to claim it for her own...)

I hated sports when I was 4 and I hate them now that I'm 44. On your way over to the soccer field drop that fearless kid off at my place and we'll go hang gliding together.

Me and you, Green Witch.

How old is your daughter, Freeduck?

One of my sons wanted so much to play soccer like his bro, but when he got into the field, he preferred to pick up grass and follow grasshoppers. He was 4. So I took him out of soccer.
He began to like the game at age 7, so I enrolled him in his school team. He's played ever since, and is very good, too. He's 21 now.
Unlike his brother, he never tried out to be a pro, even if he has natural talent. He loves the game, but never wanted to compete seriously: perhaps that's what he saw and didn't like about me and his brother.

My daughter never cared much about soccer. Or gymnastics. Or fencing. She loves ping-pong... and piano.

oh PLEASE let her quit soccer freeduck....at 4 years old don't let her start to think you can force her into doing things. Let her be, she's just a little girl.

Let her dance and jump and gaze at clouds and do things in her way...she's got a lifetime to have to adhere to rules and learning winning is good and loosing is bad and all those other terribly important things that only playing soccer can fulfill.

Don't be mad at her...she's not you, or your son, or you husband....in 50 years, is it going to matter?

This is from a non-parent but once little girl who was forced to grow up WAY too fast.

oh my god freeduck, you've actually got me crying right now.....

I so wish sometimes I could be little girl again, and allowed to act like one.

Aww.. I know what you mean..

(said little-boy me)

{{hug}} for Chai T

Sorry Chai. I should say that I don't force her to do much of anything. It was part of a deal I made with her when she wanted to do cheerleading. I said she could if she tried soccer too. I don't expect her to be good at it, I just want her to try. And I know it's not fair to be angry at her for not wanting to. That's why I say I'm ashamed of myself.

But soz, you have a good point. She is very individualistic and the fact that the rest of us love soccer could very well have something to do with it. And I know she knows that I want her to try it and like it. It's an ugly dynamic that I'm trying to change. Maybe she'd like basketball -- none of us are any good at that.

fbaezer, you have a good point too. There's really no hurry. I'm just so afraid that she'll think of herself in terms of the more girly sports and never find out about the others. But it's a long life and she has plenty of time.

Freeduck, she FOUR!!!!

Four year olds don't make deals...am I all off base or something that a 4 year old is a little girl that changes their minds from one minute to the next.

I'm sorry freeduck, but I remember vividly being 4 years old, and it was horrible because of having to, oh God, I don't even know how to say it..... be RESPONSIBLE for something. I just know that your little girl is not even old enough to be in kindergarden yet....what happened to just being a little kid?

She's not SUPPOSED to have schedules and goals and plans and worry about playing by rules or what position she is.

At four your little girl should be telling you one day she wants to be a lion trainer, and the next day she decides to be a princess.

Why do you want her to grow up so fast? One day when she doesn't have time for you because she's got all these other things going on in her life, you'll sit and wish and maybe even cry that you don't have your little girl to cuddle in your lap, and that you missed some of the chances to do that because you wanted her to do something she didn't want to do.

This isn't meant to criticize your parenting personally freeduck....I was there. I never got to sit in my mothers lap because she was "too busy" She was "too busy" all my childhood, and figured since she worked so much, I could be the maid. Then, when I wasn't even there anymore, she found the time to talk, and expected to be accomodated.

I'm crying again, because what I miss most about my childhood was being a child, and it's hard to believe that you wouldn't take every opportunity to savour her being your baby while you still can. The time of cuddles ends fast. She's barely out of diapers. Let her do or don't do any damn thing she wants, while she still needs you. That won't spoil her, or ruin or life, or keep her from getting into a good college. The title of your thread says it all...don't be one of them freeduck, be better than that. Go check to see if your little angel is sleeping, and kiss her on the forehead.

Nimh, thanks for the hugs...boy, I really needed it. I've got to go find my husband so I can be cuddled to make up for some of what I didn't get when I should have.

I think maybe you've misunderstood something. These are things she's trying to see if she likes them and to meet other little girls at the YMCA. It's something to do, because right now we don't live in a place where she can just go outside and play, and she needs a lot of physical activity. She doesn't have a position or any goals and no schedule other than preschool (which is where she had been doing dance class, btw, very unstructured).



I don't want her to grow up fast. I want her to find the same enjoyment in team sports that I've found, because it taught me lifelong lessons that I don't think I would have learned anywhere else. I want to keep her from limiting herself to girly things because she thinks that's what she's supposed to do. I want her to try. But I am cognizant of the fact that she may just not be up for it right now -- hence the guilt.



I'm truly sorry about your experience and even more sorry that my self-indulgent confessional of a thread has caused you to relive it. I realize that my initial post was blunt and might have given off the wrong impression. I don't care if she's good at anything. I just want her to be exposed to many different things so she can find out what she likes. It's one of the things I regret about my childhood, that it lacked stimulation and exposure to different activities. I made do, and she probably will too, but there are a lot of things for kids here and I intend to let her at 'em as long as she wants to try them. The thing here for you to understand is that this is not about achievement but about making sure she's not choosing activities based on her perception of whether they are appropriate for her gender.

You don't need to feel sorry for me freeduck. You haven't caused me to relive anything....this isn't about me at all....I'm feeling what your daughter is going through standing in a field NOT wanting to do something, and being too young to articulate this to her mother adequately, who she loves and doesn't want to disappoint.

Your intitial post was not too blunt, just right to the point. You are mad at a near baby for not wanting to "try" The guilt you're feeling is telling you something.....maybe I don't know a lot of fancy child phychology. Maybe this is another one of those cases where the parents think I can't possibly understand, since I don't have kids. I don't know how to be a parent maybe, but maybe I see things with a prespective parents don't.

In her mind, she has tried, and doesn't want it. Don't make her go back. From what you have said about her, there's no danger of her being trapped in girly things.

Try her again in a couple of years.

One of our godchildren (a niece) never liked soccer ... ot any other teamsport.

She was quite good with ballet dancing .... until she became 8, 9.

And then in listening music.

Now with 13 ... she seems to start a career playing soccer. (And she's good! Perhaps following her Austrian cousin, who was a national U18.)

Thank you Walter.

That was very nice of you.

I wouldn't worry about pulling her out. She's 4. At 4 I was put into figure skating. I did just what your daughter is doing - my mum made me stick it through. For a year! Not saying it warped me, but I can't skate properly to this day. I shunned it for other things.

Elementary school, junior high, high school: that's where sports happen. She is going to HAVE to try different sports in gym class.

I think it's only natural that parents do this occasionally, so don't beat yourself up. She has a lot of opportunities yet to be exposed to many different 'non-girly' sports.

And this is coming from a girl who LOVES sports and sometimes has that urge to push-push-push kids to try ones they don't want to.

OK, this might be a little unfair, to snip these phrases out of your post like this ... but ehmm, FreeDuck, Ive gotta kinda agree with ChaiTea here...

... and I mean, of course I know you kind of realise it too, otherwise you wouldn't have started this thread - but I'm only pointing it out again because this is how you argue why you would or be right to do what you do...

I mean, basically, what I'm saying is - just reading all this makes me tired - and I'm 34, not 4. That is a LOT to be wanting - whether from, or for - a four-year old...

... it just sounds like, even in the face of not wanting to be like "them", there's still a level of (well-intended) ambition and intention and conviction (of what would be good for her to do, not do, try, etc), that would better just be toned down...

Not everyone likes team sports or is competitive.