okie wrote:Amigo, you have some good points I agree with and some I don't. And it seems Asherman has a very good understanding of history and I generally agree with his assessment. My observation is that some of the founders were not overly thrilled with organized religion, and it is quite true that much bad stuff has been done in the name of religion. I recognize that and agree with that. The argument over whether most of them were deists or not, I can't add anything to that. All of this does not change the fact that most, if not all, believed in a one Creator, and their moral grounding sprung out of a Judeo-Christian tradition. Some may have criticized the hypocrisy of some of the religious, which I also agree with, but I think most recognized that government was not the answer to the world's problems, as communism tends to do. They believed in the rights and responsibilities of individuals as endowed by the Creator, and as endorsed by our Declaration of Independence and Constitution. They also believed that a basic moral standard and personal morality was necessary for such a culture to thrive within the framework of our type of government.
Conservatism recognizes that some problems cannot be solved by government, that utopia is not possible, and that many things are best left to people. People, by nature, want to believe in something. If they don't believe in a God, they will tend to look for somebody else to cure their ills and the ills of society, and often that turns out to be government. I personally think this is a dangerous direction in which to go, because history has shown this to end up with the infringement of personal rights and even the deaths of millions of people.
Okie what me or you or asherman say or belive does not matter as it applys to the very clearly stated intent of the founding fathers regarding the church, religion and it's roll in government.
Founding fathers and deism;
http://www.deism.org/foundingfathers.htm
"The United States of America should have a foundation free from the influence of clergy."
-George Washington
"My own mind is my own church. All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit." -Thomas Paine
