Life: Looking Back, Looking Forward

Lash, I think you're a real **** but I never liked you anyway.

Lash, good luck moving out and onward. You've gotten some great advice and support here. Take advantage of it! (I know you will). It's not that tough a decision when you put it down to your kids or him.

Damn! I thought I was a ****...










(sticks tongue in his ear...)

I feel a bit more confident. My daughter is moving out in August...and as soon as I get her settled, I'm moving out.

Thank you all for the support.

Best wishes to you Lash....

keep on talkin' when ya need to... lotsa ears round here...

(tho keep the tongue for Dys a?)

You always know where to find us, WhipLash.

I hadn't realized that your daughter was living there with the two of you. That can add a lot of stress to a relationship but it can also reveal things you needed to know. Anyway, how a boyfriend relates to the other people you love is a big friggin' deal.

Fer sure.

Glad things are moving along... take care, girlie.

((((((((((((((((my sweeties))))))))))))))))))
...and YES, Freeduck. Absolutely. I feel it was a blessing to have had my baby there--to see how he related before our relationship escalated further.

How' Lash?

Oh dear! I'm running to class...but wanted you to know I saw this, Iz, my puddin'. I'll be back in an hour or so with my most recent cataclysmic installment....

So, because he wasn't speaking to my daughter, my feelings for him just plummeted. We went through a very tense, stupid week of passing one another in the house--of him coming in from work and going directly to the bedroom... So, one day I said "I think it's pretty obvious that I should move out." And, his exasperation pretty evident, he says, "You've been wanting to do that for the past four months..."

I didn't think that was fair, so I explained to him in detail how I felt toward him at each juncture, and reminded him of conversations we'd had before he moved in about specific things---how he'd responded (or not responded) to those conversations, and how each response (or non-response) affected my feelings for him--I drew a diagram with a color-coded key...

I was surprised that I started crying when I was explaining how I felt about how he was treating my daughter. He hasn't been outwardly rude, but the absence of kindness and acceptance is rude to me. She has had to live through enough bullshit without me presenting her with more via a boyfriend. I reminded him that any possible future with any man I spent time was contingent on how they interacted with my children.

And, there is this really crappy "money" thing going on that infuriates me. I give. He takes. We seem to have this down.... When it is time for him to give and me to take, we seem to have problems. (I may as well say this happens in bed, too, though to a lesser degree.) I told him a few days ago he may as well leave a fidty on the nightstand....

I tell him maybe we can hang out once in a while...try to salvage a friendship before we wind up hating each other. He's wiping tears and saying he loves me...which I believe he does as much as he's capable of loving---it just doesn't seem like enough for me...or the same kind of love in my universe.

I looked at my finances and I can't afford to move out until September. I asked him if I can stay until then...He says he wants me to stay longer. I say I don't want to talk about that now...

The next day my daughter calls me for lunch and says, "You must have talked to NV, because he was talking my ear off this morning after you went to class." She goes on to say how he was going out of his way to find things to say to her...LOL...like the Barney Fife conversation...."Yep, that's what I'm gonna do...Go to the drugstore,...get a bottle of pop...walk over to Thelma Lou's and watch that George Raft movie..."

These things break my heart. It's like he's moving heaven and earth to be who I need him to be...but if it's so hard for him, and requires frequent break-ups...jeez. He sat in the den with us last night...she doesn't enter the room without him speaking now...but ...

So, I thanked him for considering her feelings.

Interestingly, my SON is worried about NV . He thinks the relationship is doomed because lack of a deep connection, and that I should put NV out of his misery (which I guess I did). He says the children shouldn't be an issue because they don't live with me (!!!) He says NV's always been nice to him. In other words, my son is making me feel that I'm impossible to please where my kids are concerned. I can't for the life of me reconcile these sentiments with my kid. How did he ever get this kind of opinion?

Anyhoo, in my poor pea brain, I am beginning to think if NV is making such attempts to amend himself to what I need,...and we can solve this last thing (the giving/receiving ratio)--we may possibly be happy.

Is this what they mean by working out relationship problems...or is this pushing a boulder up a hill...forever? How do you know the difference?

btw, he says he can afford the apt if I leave. *whew*

He talked with me about the money issue--and said he still has issues about trust where money is concerned because the last two women he was with (he felt strongly) used him and left him in financial disarray, but that doesn't explain why he is not as giving sexually.

Anyway. I haven't changed my mind about moving out...but wouldn't I be facing some of these issues in every relationship I find myself in?

Some of them, sure. This really seems pretty clear-cut, though.

I actually agree with your son, I think, about not continuing to provide NV with any hope. I agree with YOU that if it's this much work now, it's going to be work forever after.

Love the one you're with, not the one that the one you're with could possibly become if everyone tries really really hard.

And it sounds like the two of you just aren't compatible without a lot of convolutions. Shouldn't need to be THAT many convolutions.

So... if that's the situation... ending things all the way sooner rather than later really seems like the best idea.

Good news that he'll be able to afford the apt. on his own!

Can you do something temporary until Sept.?

Wait, why isn't HE moving out?

Thanks, Soz.

His name is on the lease.

Oh, OK. I think you'd said that before, sorry.

Maybe some sort of subletting situation out there somewhere, until school starts...?

I won't have enough $$ to do anything until mid August.

I promise....no more hope.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh Lash-girl.... so wanna reply but have dinner to do

Will reply sooooooooooooooooon!

Great, Iz! I'm headed off to workies, but I look forward to reading your opinion...

OH MY GIRL!!!!!! Hugging you ((((((((((((((Lash))))))))))))))))

Now…. Who are you trying to persuade - you are talking to yourself when you are talking to us hun - you thoughts and words are still questioning everything…


OK - only my perspective here which if often very flawed and warped into complete fantasy!!!!!!





So, because he wasn't speaking to my daughter, my feelings for him just plummeted. We went through a very tense, stupid week of passing one another in the house--of him coming in from work and going directly to the bedroom... So, one day I said "I think it's pretty obvious that I should move out." And, his exasperation pretty evident, he says, "You've been wanting to do that for the past four months..."


K - why wasn't he talking to your daughter…. Actually - it's not so much about talkings - it's about communicating - she's your daughter, you are living together - communication is kinda, a must. He's not communicating with either of you for that past week - coz he's hurting and he knows what coming. He just wasn't going to say it, and you ended up having to say it. But you left it open hun



I didn't think that was fair, so I explained to him in detail how I felt toward him at each juncture, and reminded him of conversations we'd had before he moved in about specific things---how he'd responded (or not responded) to those conversations, and how each response (or non-response) affected my feelings for him--I drew a diagram with a color-coded key...

I was surprised that I started crying when I was explaining how I felt about how he was treating my daughter. He hasn't been outwardly rude, but the absence of kindness and acceptance is rude to me. She has had to live through enough bullshit without me presenting her with more via a boyfriend. I reminded him that any possible future with any man I spent time was contingent on how they interacted with my children.

Has he got children of his own?????

Does he have any idea how to "parent"? Serious question there.

Not that it makes a difference to two people being in a relationship - UNLESS the child is living with you - and if you guys are together then he has to learn how to parent - which means accepting the kids and being a "family". You can't all live under the same roof as a family…. and not be a family. In his defence (not that I have the right to defend and don't wish to offend) but he didn't live your life in the past, or your kids - so he's coming into something strange and wonderful, but something he couldn't possibly understand - and your feelings re your kids - of course you are so protective of them - and….. it's hard actually to let anyone in on that - UNLESS everything is COMPATIBLE and it isn't such hard work and you are sure it's where you want to be. Then, any INCOMPATIBILITES can be worked on and surmounted/surpassed with compromise. It shouldn't be an effort in that respect. Nothing is ever perfect - but it should be acceptable to everyone.

And, there is this really crappy "money" thing going on that infuriates me. I give. He takes. We seem to have this down.... When it is time for him to give and me to take, we seem to have problems. (I may as well say this happens in bed, too, though to a lesser degree.) I told him a few days ago he may as well leave a fidty on the nightstand....


Seeeee - now that's not boding too well feeling like that girlie.


I tell him maybe we can hang out once in a while...try to salvage a friendship before we wind up hating each other. He's wiping tears and saying he loves me...which I believe he does as much as he's capable of loving---it just doesn't seem like enough for me...or the same kind of love in my universe.

He isn't you hun - he hasn't been through what you have been through - and you want more than just……"being with someone - a companion"…. To me, you sound like you need a whole lot more than what he has to offer. Not a fault on his part - you just have different outlooks about what the future holds.


I looked at my finances and I can't afford to move out until September. I asked him if I can stay until then...He says he wants me to stay longer. I say I don't want to talk about that now...

Actually Lash - you sound to me as tho you have made your mind up, but just don't want to make the final call…. Which is completely understandable because it means starting out again - and not what you had planned. But then nothing works out the way we really plan it…. you just have to figure what is MOST important…. And go from day to day.

The next day my daughter calls me for lunch and says, "You must have talked to NV, because he was talking my ear off this morning after you went to class." She goes on to say how he was going out of his way to find things to say to her...LOL...like the Barney Fife conversation...."Yep, that's what I'm gonna do...Go to the drugstore,...get a bottle of pop...walk over to Thelma Lou's and watch that George Raft movie..."

These things break my heart. It's like he's moving heaven and earth to be who I need him to be...but if it's so hard for him, and requires frequent break-ups...jeez. He sat in the den with us last night...she doesn't enter the room without him speaking now...but ...

So, I thanked him for considering her feelings.

It is good of him to make the effort…. But that should have been from Day 1 - and it's a rollercoaster in between the good and making an effort and….. the rest of the time. Kids (even if they are older) realise when people genuinely want and don't want to talk to them… your relationship with him is between the two of you - and of course kids fly the nest…… but your kids will always be your kids. Again Lash - I am on the other side of coin here - I have a ….. friend! His kids come first and they are adults. I understand him and therefore…. Until there is no hope - patience is my middle name….. or stupidity. I also have a child who will love and hate my friend for the rest of his life….. insurmountable at this time - no matter how him and I feel…. The kids win out until either we choose different paths, or choose to make the paths cross - with everything that entails.


Your fella - he absolutely wants YOU and that means the kids too - because in YOUR world you are a package…… either ALL or nothing! Either he makes it his world too…. or not.


Interestingly, my SON is worried about NV . He thinks the relationship is doomed because lack of a deep connection, and that I should put NV out of his misery (which I guess I did). He says the children shouldn't be an issue because they don't live with me (!!!) He says NV's always been nice to him. In other words, my son is making me feel that I'm impossible to please where my kids are concerned. I can't for the life of me reconcile these sentiments with my kid. How did he ever get this kind of opinion?


Hunni - you are impossible to please where you're kids are concerned….. until the right person comes along who makes you feel complete and that you don't need to compromise on your feelings of protection towards the kids and their feelings…. and when that person comes along….. you wouldn't be questioning or finding reasons because nothing is impossible and anything is possible. NV is no doubt a good guy….. he just doesn't make you "rock" in the right way. By the way - I don't believe KIDS should dictate relationships..... it's the adults who choose how they are going to dictate the relationships with the kids considerations taken into account. Your kids sound brilliant - they aren't pushing you, they are understanding you, most of all they wish YOU to be happy - that is massive - you should be so so proud of them. However, the problems with your fella REALLY aren't about the kids..... you can find reasons there..... your problems with your fella are because you and he are......... incompatible. Hard to say out loud - easier to find reasons for it not working. Sex, money, comfort levels, love, passions, fun, fitting together like a glove, missing piece of the puzzle.......... kids way down on the list of reasons that you've talked about so far that make you feel NV is not Mr. Right.

Anyhoo, in my poor pea brain, I am beginning to think if NV is making such attempts to amend himself to what I need,...and we can solve this last thing (the giving/receiving ratio)--we may possibly be happy.

OK………………….. may is ……………. MAY. Choices choices a? Easy road.... long road.... bumpy road...... yellow brick road.

Is this what they mean by working out relationship problems...or is this pushing a boulder up a hill...forever? How do you know the difference?

You just do when you realise the boudler doesn't feel as cumbersome.

btw, he says he can afford the apt if I leave. *whew*


Right there you go - he has given you the get out clause….. now, if you two think you have a chance….. then you could move out - date - don't live in each others pocket, sleep on the floor, feel uncomfortable, or feel like he may as well leave a $50 by the bed. Maybe he could be the right person and it was too much, too soon. So - get yerself an apartment…. And still see him. You will soon realise how much…or not… you miss him. He gave you the get out clause… he's going to make you make the decision. GUILT should not come into it…. not when you are talking long term future. So, please think very carefully.

He talked with me about the money issue--and said he still has issues about trust where money is concerned because the last two women he was with (he felt strongly) used him and left him in financial disarray, but that doesn't explain why he is not as giving sexually.

Well - there's another problem…. If it's like that now…. Well…….

Anyway. I haven't changed my mind about moving out...but wouldn't I be facing some of these issues in every relationship I find myself in?

NOPE….. definitely not.

Some maybe - but, surmountable problems if he is the right person. That's the difference between loving someone unconditionally……. and not.





Please ignore me if I am completely off the mark - I have the worst habit of projecting my feelings which may be completely inapprpriate for you... so..... please ignore me if I'm outta line and I often contradict myself. I know what's right..... I don't necessarily do it tho.

Thank you so much, Iz. I appreciate the time and consideration.

I do continually question what I'm doing right now because it's such a big thing for me (and him.)

It really helps a lot to hear others' takes on everything. I want to look at things from as many different angles as I can.

He has never had children, so I used to think he was a bit uncomfortable talking with a 20 year old young woman (my baby)...I thought he'd come around in time, and develop a casual, friendly relationship with her... Then, during the confrontation, he admitted he was resentful of the money her presence in our apt was costing him. He later said he was embarrassed about that, and he's done a 180 in that department. He said his former girlfriend's son, daughter and son-in-law all moved in and sponged off of him for months--and ran up his credit card.

This does not occur in my family, and I was highly insulted by the inference.

...and very hurt for my daughter.

I guess I must be impossible where my children are concerned, but I need the man in my life to know whatever my children need...if it is within the realm of possibility, I will give it to them. I will drop everything and go to them. If they need a place to live and I have a roof over my head, I'll share it with them--just as I'm doing now. And, during these times, I expect any man who claims to love me to treat my children as he would his own. I guess other people see this as asking too much...but I don't know how anyone would expect less.

So, to answer, he has NO CLUE about parenting.

in YOUR world you are a package…… either ALL or nothing!
Absolutely.

I'm sorry to hear about the complication with your child and your friend. Feel free to expand on it here if you'd like to. (((((((((((((Iz))))))))))))

I sort of cringed at your comment that I was looking for someone to complete me. I feel complete---I would like someone to enjoy life with that doesn't take away too much from my life, but since this live-in situation and the nuttiness that preceded it, I've decided to drift into instead of be on the lookout for possible candidates...haha.

Thanks for what you said about my children. They are constantly telling me they want me to be happy, and that they shouldn't be issues in my romantic relationship, but I know I could never be happy with a man who didn't care about my children.

However, the problems with your fella REALLY aren't about the kids..... you can find reasons there..... your problems with your fella are because you and he are......... incompatible. Hard to say out loud - easier to find reasons for it not working. Sex, money, comfort levels, love, passions, fun, fitting together like a glove, missing piece of the puzzle.......... kids way down on the list of reasons that you've talked about so far that make you feel NV is not Mr. Right

This raised my eyebrows. I thank you for this. I am going to give it a lot of thought. My kids ARE important enough to me to end a relationship--but there may be something to what you said still.

(smiling) Thanks, sweety! A lot to consider.