The Abramoff scandal investigation

blatham wrote:

mysteryman wrote:
blatham,
You said...

Quote:
Any dems that get rounded up for crimes of corruption - great! But there won't be many, if any.

Are you suggesting that the dems are not now corrupt,are you suggesting that they never have been,or are you saying they havent been caught yet?

Please focus. The subject of this conversation, and of the relevant investigations in progress, relate to the corruption and crimes surrounding Jack Abramoff.

We've posted a LOT of information previously, and if you haven't yet come to comprehend what is going on here, then you either aren't reading or you are just irredeemably dumb. I'll give you one more chance. Get straight on the information in the CSM piece...

Quote:
But before you do your usual "they're all crooks" wave of your hand - don't. This case is different. It is particularly ugly, and it's just beginning.
Christian Science Monitor

Then read this, slowly and carefully...
The DeLay Abramoff money trail

If you demonstrate that you've bothered to get yourself educated here, and to do so with some care, I'll have future conversations with you. Otherwise I simply won't. And there's little reason anyone else should either.

I have read the info,and I know whats going on.
I took issue with one sentence,and asked for clarification.
I am not saying that repubs arent guilty.

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1) the present corruption related to these investigations is overwhelmingly a Republican issue. Dems were not invited into the machine, they were excluded.

2) so, there will be few if any Dems indicted or copping a plea.

3) there have been eras where Dems were, and got busted for, corruption

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blatham wrote:

1) the present corruption related to these investigations is overwhelmingly a Republican issue. Dems were not invited into the machine, they were excluded.

2) so, there will be few if any Dems indicted or copping a plea.

3) there have been eras where Dems were, and got busted for, corruption

That is all I was asking.
Number 3 was the correct answer.
I am tired of those on the left trying to claim that dems never commit this kind of corruption.

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Well, I don't know who might have made that claim but it would be false and foolish to make it.

But I really think it behooves everyone in the US, regardless of party affiliation, to get a real good grip on what happened here. It isn't just people filling their bank accounts, though that is part of it as always. The worst of it is the the abuse of power to undercut democratic principles and institutions to an end of single party political dominance.

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mysteryman wrote:

blatham wrote:
1) the present corruption related to these investigations is overwhelmingly a Republican issue. Dems were not invited into the machine, they were excluded.

2) so, there will be few if any Dems indicted or copping a plea.

3) there have been eras where Dems were, and got busted for, corruption

That is all I was asking.
Number 3 was the correct answer.
I am tired of those on the left trying to claim that dems never commit this kind of corruption.

When has anyone on the left claimed dems never commit this kind of corruption?

Your argument MM is a strawman. There is no one that claimed Dems NEVER do this.

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mysteryman, you need to understand the Dems are mad they've lost their majority. They are the only enlightened ones that care about everyone's rights. The Republicans are all corrupt. The Republicans are right wing nazis. This is the prism through which they see the world. Corruption in the Democratic Party is not corruption because they are doing it for a noble cause. Few Democrats were interested in corruption when their party was in power. They can disagree, but we have the record.

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okie wrote:

mysteryman, you need to understand the Dems are mad they've lost their majority. They are the only enlightened ones that care about everyone's rights. The Republicans are all corrupt. The Republicans are right wing nazis. This is the prism through which they see the world. Corruption in the Democratic Party is not corruption because they are doing it for a noble cause. Few Democrats were interested in corruption when their party was in party. They can disagree, but we have the record.

Speaking of prisms that warp their view of the world. You should try taking off your 14" thick glasses okie. You make claims continually that you think are true but then can't provide any evidence to back them up.

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parados
Misery needs company. The right in order to lessen the sting, in their own eyes, of those they worship continually use the excuse that the Dem's do it also. Pointing out corruption of others won't cut it. Face it the major players in the scandal are republican's They have been caught with their hands in the cookie jar and if there is any justice the votes for sale group will get them cut off.

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okie wrote:

mysteryman, you need to understand the Dems are mad they've lost their majority. They are the only enlightened ones that care about everyone's rights. The Republicans are all corrupt. The Republicans are right wing nazis. This is the prism through which they see the world. Corruption in the Democratic Party is not corruption because they are doing it for a noble cause. Few Democrats were interested in corruption when their party was in power. They can disagree, but we have the record.

What's your point here, okie? That the Democrats are more interesting in Republican corruption than their own? Well, ain't that shocking! You write this as though you've uncovered a nasty truth...

As for the Democrats being "mad" because they lost their majority, so what? This corruption story exists independent of the Dems' feelings.

Maybe it's time you stopped demonizing one group and tried to be a little more objective...

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Quote:

Maybe it's time you stopped demonizing one group and tried to be a little more objective...

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D'artagnan wrote:

Maybe it's time you stopped demonizing one group and tried to be a little more objective...

You have just admitted being more interested in corruption now that Democrats are out of power. So perhaps you did not intend to agree with me, but did. Perhaps you need to take your own advice.

All of my "claims" are founded from my perception and collection of facts by watching politics for 50 years thereabouts. I made the last claim about this being because the Democrats are mad about being in the minority. My reasons for making that statement are well founded. The same Democrats were not interested, much less intent on doing anything about rampant corruption and abuse of power during the last administration. If the attitude toward corruption changes among Democrats, then you have to conclude that the reason is something other than the corruption itself that changed the attitude. I am only using common sense here. Believe what you want, I think a significant block of the nation's population, possibly a majority, believe as I do, for good reasons. I don't see any need to rehash all of that. Its all on the record, even on this forum. You can't change the truth.

Also, I think most reasonable people see the inequity of applying this stink about the lobbyists with Democrats trying to call the Republicans a party of corruption is clearly hypocrisy. Nothing in my statements is hard to understand and extreme. It should be plain as day. Now, I'm all in favor of prosecuting criminals. Evenly and across party lines. If I could see that attitude on both sides, I would not be quite so argumentitive on this forum. And I think that is precisely the point of mysteryman.

As a Republican, I am willing and glad to see corrupt Republicans thrown out of government. I would like to see the same attitude by Democrats. So far, I don't see it.

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Laugh now while you may, McWhitey, you'll crying soon enough . . .

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McGentrix wrote:

Quote:
Maybe it's time you stopped demonizing one group and tried to be a little more objective...

While I don't expect you to be familiar with all my posts, if you were, you'd know that I don't write along the lines of "Conservatives/Republicans/Right Wingers are just angry because _____."

That's what I mean by demonizing a group...

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Fair enough.

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Quote:

Also, I think most reasonable people see the inequity of applying this stink about the lobbyists with Democrats trying to call the Republicans a party of corruption is clearly hypocrisy.

bullsh*t. There is no comprable period in the history of the Democratic party.

The leaders of both of your branches of congress are under investigation, as well as many members;

The State branches of the Republican party are under investigation in several states;

and

The Executive branch has come under fire, with more 'advisors' to go. Bet on it.

I can't remember a period in which corruption pervaded the Democratic party to this extent. ANY party to this extent. It is accurate to say that 11 years of Republican control (5 of supercontrol) and the K street project have combined to create a culture of corruption.

Cycloptichorn

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It ain't so surprising to find the righties inability to see all these investigations going on that are primarily against republicans. It makes me wonder which media they rely on for their news besides FOX.

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As Ronald Reagan said, "there you go again."

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And that's supposed to be an answer? Give me a break!

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Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:
Also, I think most reasonable people see the inequity of applying this stink about the lobbyists with Democrats trying to call the Republicans a party of corruption is clearly hypocrisy.

bullsh*t. There is no comprable period in the history of the Democratic party.

I really hate to do this, because i don't think the member Okie deserves a break in any of these exchanges . . .

. . . however, i am always opposed to forgetting or distorting history, especially for partisan reasons.

For a comparable period in the recent history of the Democratic Party, go do an online search for "Koreagate." For a truly embarrassing period in the history of Democratic politics (and a time when the Republicans were just as bad) search for Tammany Hall and Jay Gould.

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BBB
I say a POX on both of their houses.

When a political party controlls the three branches of government, corruption will naturally result. Always has, always will.

As I've said many times, the only reason I voted for Al Gore and John Kerry in the last two elections is because George W. Bush scared the sh*t out of me. And I was right to worry.

BBB

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The Abramoff scandal investigation

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