Our Troops Must Stay

So there it is McGentrix. You conservatives have spent 300 Billion, 2000+ American lives, and 25,000+ American wounded so that you can create an Islamic Theocracy. Nice work !!

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Only 300 billion? Come on! We spend trillions on old people every year through medicare. And 25,000+ Americans get wounded EVERYDAY by papercuts so why aren't you actively against paper?

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What! only 3,000+ killed in the world trade center and we went to war? What an outrage!

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Quote:

Only 300 billion? Come on! We spend trillions on old people every year through medicare. And 25,000+ Americans get wounded EVERYDAY by papercuts so why aren't you actively against paper?

I am. We recently moved to a 70% more paperless office, thanks in large part to a bunch of wacko lefties on the staff such as myself. Now everyone loves the new system, and it will pay for itself in just three years.

Reduction of Usage is the easiest and most cost effective leg of Conservation and should be focused on much more so than Recycling.

Cycloptichorn

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Then there's always Soylent Green.

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I do support the recycling of electrons.

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Stevepax wrote:

So there it is McGentrix. You conservatives have spent 300 Billion, 2000+ American lives, and 25,000+ American wounded so that you can create an Islamic Theocracy. Nice work !!

I didn't see anything posted so far that says Iraq will be an Islamic Theocracy. Ive seen it posted that Islam will be the official religion, but that no minority will be discriminated against.

I did see the following tidbits within the new constitution.

"We the people of Iraq, newly arisen from our disasters and looking with confidence to the future through a democratic, federal, republican system, are determined -- men and women, old and young -- to respect the rule of law, reject the policy of aggression, pay attention to women and their rights, the elderly and their cares, the children and their affairs, spread the culture of diversity and defuse terrorism."

"We are the people of Iraq, who in all our forms and groupings undertake to establish our union freely and by choice, to learn yesterday's lessons for tomorrow, and to write down this permanent constitution from the high values and ideals of the heavenly messages and the developments of science and human civilization, and to adhere to this constitution, which shall preserve for Iraq its free union of people, land and sovereignty."

"Article (1):
The Republic of Iraq is an independent, sovereign nation, and the system of rule in it is a democratic, federal, representative (parliamentary) republic."

Continuing article 2, a bit joefromchicago left out:
"b) No law can be passed that contradicts the principles of democracy."
"(c) No law can be passed that contradicts the rights and basic freedoms outlined in this constitution."

"2. This constitution guarantees the Islamic identity of the majority of the Iraqi people and the full religious rights for all individuals and the freedom of creed and religious practices of people like Christians, Yazidis, and Mandaean Sabians."

I think I could go on and simply quote the entire constitution, but that doesn't seem to be needed.

As I asked before Stevepax, could you PLEASE post the parts of the new Iraqi constitution that lead you to believe it will lead to an Islamic Theocracy?

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Well, I'd like to think that the Iraqi Supreme Court will interpret Article 1 Sections b) and c) as taking precedence over Section a), but I wouldn't bet the farm on it.

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Bush is willing to bet a number of little 2'x6' farms, though.

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joefromchicago wrote:

Iraqi Constitution

المادة (2):

Article (2):
اولاً ـ الاسلام دين الدولة الرسمي، وهو مصدر اساس للتشريع:

1. Islam is the official religion of the state and is a basic source of legislation:
أ ـ لايجوز سن قانون يتعارض مع ثوابت احكام الاسلام.

(a) No law can be passed that contradicts the fixed principles of Islam.

McG, I think you have someone reading the parts to you that they want you to hear. I think you are unable to read.

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Stevepax wrote:

joefromchicago wrote:
Iraqi Constitution

المادة (2):

Article (2):
اولاً ـ الاسلام دين الدولة الرسمي، وهو مصدر اساس للتشريع:

1. Islam is the official religion of the state and is a basic source of legislation:
أ ـ لايجوز سن قانون يتعارض مع ثوابت احكام الاسلام.

(a) No law can be passed that contradicts the fixed principles of Islam.

McG, I think you have someone reading the parts to you that they want you to hear. I think you are unable to read.

It helps if you actually READ the WHOLE article...

Quote:

1. Islam is the official religion of the state and is a basic source of legislation:
أ ـ لايجوز سن قانون يتعارض مع ثوابت احكام الاسلام.

(a) No law can be passed that contradicts the fixed principles of Islam.
ب ـ لايجوز سن قانون يتعارض مع مبادئ الديمقراطية.

(b) No law can be passed that contradicts the principles of democracy.
ج ـ لايجوز سن قانون يتعارض مع الحقوق والحريات الاساسية الواردة في هذا الدستور.

(c) No law can be passed that contradicts the rights and basic freedoms outlined in this constitution.
ثانياً ـ يضمن هذا الدستور الحفاظ على الهوية الاسلامية لغالبية الشعب العراقي، كما يضمن كامل الحقوق الدينية لجميع الافراد في حرية العقيدة والممارسة الدينية كالمسيحيين والآيزديين والصابئة المندائيين.

Perhaps you can explain how an Islamic Theocracy will form from that?

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Here's what it is ... an unworkable document. A facade, which contradicts itself to the point if being toilet paper. It's a prescription for civil war. It gives Al Sistani the final word as to what law is and what it isn't. He's the Head Shiite, the guy with direct ties to Iran.

So tell me, how many Billions, how many Lives, and how many Crippled Americans do you want to invest in it??

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George Bush and his Administration says we who oppose the war, how it's being handled, and it's direction are "sending the troops the wrong message" which such opposition.

I think we're sending them the wrong message that we support them in any way in this immoral war. I think it's time we made it crystal clear that we DON'T support them, and they're dying for a fools errant. I guess I shouldn't really worry about them if they're stupid enough to allow themselves to be wasted by George Bush and his team of Anti-American criminals.

For me, it's time to stop supporting this immoral outrage in any form.

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Stevepax wrote:

Here's what it is ... an unworkable document. A facade, which contradicts itself to the point if being toilet paper. It's a prescription for civil war. It gives Al Sistani the final word as to what law is and what it isn't. He's the Head Shiite, the guy with direct ties to Iran.

So tell me, how many Billions, how many Lives, and how many Crippled Americans do you want to invest in it??

as many as it takes for McGentrix and others to walk around puffed out like tough guys since they're safely an ocean away..... I should think that would be obvious :wink:

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Stevepax wrote:

Here's what it is ... an unworkable document. A facade, which contradicts itself to the point if being toilet paper. It's a prescription for civil war. It gives Al Sistani the final word as to what law is and what it isn't. He's the Head Shiite, the guy with direct ties to Iran.

So tell me, how many Billions, how many Lives, and how many Crippled Americans do you want to invest in it??

So, it's your opinion that the Iraqi's are too backward and barbaric actually create a democratic government for themselves. I guess that's ok, I don't subscribe to that notion myself, but that's fine for you I suppose.

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I subscribe to the notion that they are Islamic, and that is the most important thing to them. That's why they put it in their constitution.

Like I said, I'm going to start getting very adamant about my NON-support of BushCo, etc. If the soldiers are so stupid as to get killed for them, so be it!! I won't mourn for them, and I won't mourn for their families.

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Stevepax wrote:

I subscribe to the notion that they are Islamic, and that is the most important thing to them. That's why they put it in their constitution.

Like I said, I'm going to start getting very adamant about my NON-support of BushCo, etc. If the soldiers are so stupid as to get killed for them, so be it!! I won't mourn for them, and I won't mourn for their families.

Huh. So, Muslims are incapable of democracy? You can disregard so much of the other portions of the constitution so easily and be blinded by your own hatred and rascism?

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Stevepax wrote:

I subscribe to the notion that they are Islamic, and that is the most important thing to them. That's why they put it in their constitution.

Like I said, I'm going to start getting very adamant about my NON-support of BushCo, etc. If the soldiers are so stupid as to get killed for them, so be it!! I won't mourn for them, and I won't mourn for their families.

You need to rethink that. There are good men and women who don't believe in Bush in that desert. They are there because they raised their hand and made a vow to obey the CIC, and they take that vow seriously. They are not all there because they are "stupid". And I really wish I could stand in the same room with you to convince you of that little thing.

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That's not a little thing, and Stevepax cheapens himself with such a stupid and callous remark.

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Snood, You better hope I'm not a conservative, because if you were in the same room with me, I just may murder you to make sure you do things my way. You're right Snood, they're not stupid, they're immoral. They're willing to kill and destroy just because some jackass told them to. How convenient not to have to take responsibility for their actions. I believe the Nazi's did that when they were roasting Jews. Hey man, it's not my fault, Hitler told me to do it, blame him!

Sententa, So be it! I think there has to be a moment when you ask yourself whether you're a moral person or not. If you are, you have to say NO! Young people left this country during VietNam rather than be forced to murder and kill in an immoral war based on lies!!

If everyone just says No, we want to be a moral people, the government has to arrest everyone in order to enforce the leadership immoralty. If you have no respect for truth and human life, I guess you just go ahead and kill whoever won't do things your way.

McG, Curious what you call racism. I'm calling them religious, and very much so! They also totally adhere to, and obey their religious leaders and their demands. It's the same as the Christains here in this country. No thinking, no responsibility, just obey!!

If anyone is a rascist, it's the stupid jackass that kills people because they are different, and won't do things the jackass way!

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