Atheists... Your life is pointless

Early in the evenin' just about supper time
Over by the courthouse, starting to unwind
Four kids on the corner trying to bring you up
Willy picks a tune out, he blows it on the harp

Down on the corner, out in the street
Willy and the poor boys are playin'
Bring a nickel, tap your feet

Rooster hits the washboard and people just got to smile
Blinky thumps the gut bass and solos for a while
Poor boy twangs the rhythm out on his kalamazoo
Willy goes into a dance and doubles on kazoo

You don't need a penny just to hang around
But if you've got a nickel, won't you lay your money down
Over on the corner there's a happy noise
People come from all around to watch the magic boys

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Re: Atheists... Your life is pointless

John Creasy wrote:

I've always wondered why people that are so adamant about the non-existence of God, debate morals and what is right and wrong. If there is no God and this world is truly just a cosmic fluke, than your life and everything that happens in it are of no consequence whatsoever. Why not just do whatever you want and not care about others. After all, survival of the fittest is the name of the game right? Love of others is just some accidental emotion that means nothing. So do whatever you want. Your life, your children's life, and your children's children's life will all be over soon and nothing will be remembered.

I don't believe in the existance of God. I do believe the world is a cosmic fluke. I don't know the "meaning of life" and for all I know my life and everyone elses could be pointless. However there could be some great meaning which people are yet to discover. Therefore, my goal is to increase others life expectancy and collective knowledge in the hope that others might find meaning where I have failed. On the other hand there might not be any point to existance. If that is the case then it doesn't matter what I do. In a sense, helping people is hedging my bets, so regardless of the meaning or meaningless of life I aim to help people.

Effectively that is my belief system and has been for most of my life. It is why I went into medicine, why I volunteer for charities and why I teach part time.

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Edgarblythe played the air guitar; Chumly argued that to some extent we are all atheists because there are many gods we don't believe in or deny the existence of.

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Chumly, The human weakness of believing in gods is well established; from sun gods, animal gods, and invisible gods. What I observed in Tibet last week only reinforces the need for humans to believe in gods. Many Tibetans travel to Lhasa to visit the most important Buddhist temple in their country; many travel on foot and prostrate themselves while traveling here - some taking up to two years.

Human devotion to religion is a fact of humanity; we poor animals must submit to a higher, imaginary, supreme "X" to provide our lives with meaning.

The human animal cannot accept the fact that the short life we have is all there is to our existence.

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Is human animal an oxymoron? Just wondering.

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cicerone imposter wrote:

The human animal cannot accept the fact that the short life we have is all there is to our existence.

It's not easy to come to terms with the simple fact that there is no sensible reason to expect a greater purpose.

Intrepid wrote:

Is human animal an oxymoron? Just wondering.

Being human is not normally contradictory to being an animal, unless one is as refined as yourself.

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Chumly might concur that our "purpose" is...

Quote:

To explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where no one has gone before.

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Early human ancestors came down from the trees; perhaps their underlying motivations were not entirely dissimilar, perhaps it was only happenstance.

In any case, cliché and corny though it is, I can think of far worse "purposes."

Kapla!

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"I've always wondered why people that are so adamant about the non-existence of God, debate morals and what is right and wrong. If there is no God and this world is truly just a cosmic fluke, than your life and everything that happens in it are of no consequence whatsoever. Why not just do whatever you want and not care about others. After all, survival of the fittest is the name of the game right? Love of others is just some accidental emotion that means nothing. So do whatever you want. Your life, your children's life, and your children's children's life will all be over soon and nothing will be remembered. "

I am defiantly not religious... But do you know what? I have a feeling that's mainly the reason why I don't think people should do what you want. I like to think the average person has 80 years on this planet and then POOF! Their gone for good. No after life, no Shangri-la. No nothing. It is because of this I care about other people and want other people to be happy. I mean, would you really want to ruin someone else's entire existence by treating them like crap. (By stealing their possessions, killing their families... Or even ruining their night out by being obnoxious)

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Intrepid wrote:

Is human animal an oxymoron? Just wondering.

No, it's closer to a pleonasm -- just like "the dog animal" would be. But it's not really a pleonasm, just close to one. A real pleonasm would be "You are nothing but a hound dog" (Elvis Presley).

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So what if our life is "meaningless". Your definition of meaning is "god" just because we are not arrogant enough to make an assumption regarding the meaning of life doesn't mean we are living for nothing. Besides if christianity turns out to be correct and there is a merciful god, we all go to heaven anyway assuming we have a good life. Just because a person says they are christian does not mean in anyway that they are good. They have the same faults and flaws as us non-believing folk. Ultimately we are all the same except some of us choose to believe in a god. And really every religious believer believes they are right.

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Re: Atheists... Your life is pointless

John Creasy wrote:

I've always wondered why people that are so adamant about the non-existence of God, debate morals and what is right and wrong. If there is no God and this world is truly just a cosmic fluke, than your life and everything that happens in it are of no consequence whatsoever. Why not just do whatever you want and not care about others. After all, survival of the fittest is the name of the game right? Love of others is just some accidental emotion that means nothing. So do whatever you want. Your life, your children's life, and your children's children's life will all be over soon and nothing will be remembered.

you complete tosspot.

I take it you are a believer in a concept you refer to as 'God'. Its a short word and its dog backwards. Now I know exactly what a dog is, in fact I'm a believer in dog. But before you can believe you have to understand what it is you are asked to believe in. And there are as many definitions of the word 'God' as there are people out there who 'believe'. What's your definition of 'God'? It may well be different from mine. Is that ok?

But for the sake of argument consider this. Perhaps we could agree that God is the creator of all things, the maker of heaven and earth, the orginator of the Universe of all that exists. Now thats how we define Universe. Everything that exists. And God exists, obviously or he couldnt be around creating things. Therefore God is part of what we define the Universe to be. So he created the universe and himself as part of it. God exists as just a component of all existence? But thats not how we have agreed to define god. Because it begs the question who created God?[/i]

Surely God is somehow over and above the Universe. His existence was before the Universe. But by definition something that is outside the Universality of all existence, does not exist.[/i] Smile

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Steve

I haven't got the time to check through the thread but I have probably said ( if not here, then elsewhere) that "existence" and "logic" are incompatible concepts. Therefore although I sympathise with your general point, your mode of "reasoning" may be flawed. The only way out in my opinion is to re-examine the concept of "existence" in relativistic terms. Thus some (the believers) define "self" as relative to "God". Neither has "existence" outside such a relationship. Atheists are merely those whose perception of "self existence" does not have such a requirement. Existence is relationship. "Logic" assumes otherwise.

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Interesting points fresco. I wasnt really claiming to have disproved the existence of god, I just wanted some "believer" to pick out the flaw in my argument.

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Steve,

The infinite regress argument culminating in "so who made God ?" rests on the assumption that "God" is evoked by believers because (1) all "things" require a creator and (2) God is a "thing". However, believers can sidestep the conclusion by rejecting (2). What such an ad hoc rejection fails to pursue is an exploration of "thingness" itself. That would lead to reconsiderations of "existence" such as that I outlined above thereby devaluing the necessity of evoking "a creator" as in (1).

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Re: Atheists... Your life is pointless

Steve 41oo wrote:

John Creasy wrote:
I've always wondered why people that are so adamant about the non-existence of God, debate morals and what is right and wrong. If there is no God and this world is truly just a cosmic fluke, than your life and everything that happens in it are of no consequence whatsoever. Why not just do whatever you want and not care about others. After all, survival of the fittest is the name of the game right? Love of others is just some accidental emotion that means nothing. So do whatever you want. Your life, your children's life, and your children's children's life will all be over soon and nothing will be remembered.
you complete tosspot.

I take it you are a believer in a concept you refer to as 'God'. Its a short word and its dog backwards. Now I know exactly what a dog is, in fact I'm a believer in dog. But before you can believe you have to understand what it is you are asked to believe in. And there are as many definitions of the word 'God' as there are people out there who 'believe'. What's your definition of 'God'? It may well be different from mine. Is that ok?

But for the sake of argument consider this. Perhaps we could agree that God is the creator of all things, the maker of heaven and earth, the orginator of the Universe of all that exists. Now thats how we define Universe. Everything that exists. And God exists, obviously or he couldnt be around creating things. Therefore God is part of what we define the Universe to be. So he created the universe and himself as part of it. God exists as just a component of all existence? But thats not how we have agreed to define god. Because it begs the question who created God?[/i]

Surely God is somehow over and above the Universe. His existence was before the Universe. But by definition something that is outside the Universality of all existence, does not exist.[/i]

The efficacy of your argument is limited by your (and our) failed perception of time.

We perceive time according to events. The possibility of 'no events' - what about that?

Not proving anything. Just stirring the pot.

Atheists... Your life is pointless

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