1
   

Under God With Liberty

 
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 12:13 am
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
Hi Rex,

May I ask you, who is this scripture referring to?

Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.



This scripture is a bit mixed...


God precedes the beginning and he will never be last because his kingdom has no end...


OK , so your conclusion... who do you think it is?


If God is a self, if Jesus is the image of God, we are in the image of God and if the devil impersonates God then as I said it is a bit mixed...

Operate your spirit and the written word and the answers will appear...

To God be the glory...


I appreciate your desire to follow the spirit's leading.

Let me say this. Whoever Rev 22:13 is referring to, is one person or entity who is named all three of these:

Alpha and Omega

Beginning and End

First and Last

----------------

From what I see in scripture, "the Lord Almighty who was and is and is to come" is also referred to as Alpha and Omega, Beginning and Ending in Rev 1:8

Who is this? Well , the Almighty is usually understood to be God. And Rev 4:8-11 speaks of the One on the throne , the LORD God Almighty , who was and is and is to come as being the One who is worthy because He created all things. So this would seem also to refer to God, who is the Creator.

Well, this same Alpha and Omega ( Who was shown to be the Almighty, the Creator) is also said in Rev 1:11 to be not just Alpha and Omega , but also First and Last. This agrees with Rev 22:13 also.

This one of Rev 1:11 (Alpha and Omega, First and Last) speaks, and in Rev 1:18 says "I am He that liveth and was dead; and behold I am alive forevermore."

Also Rev 2:8 "And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;" identifies the First and the Last as He who was dead and now is alive.

Since this First and Last is also Alpha and Omega, He must also be the Almighty (as we saw Alpha and Omega was) and He who was and is and is to come, also referred to as LORD God Almighty.

------------------------

Remember we started with Rev 22:13, the Alpha and Omega , Beginning and End, First and Last are all referring to just One person or entity.

------------------------

Rex,

No doubt you are not convinced by anything I say, but you only want to get your beliefs from the scripture and I respect that.

I hope that you have been able to follow my thoughts thru this, if I have been able to write in a semi-logical way. Sometimes it's hard.

I agree to God be the glory, and Peace be to you this night, Rex.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 12:24 am
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
Hi Rex,

May I ask you, who is this scripture referring to?

Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.



This scripture is a bit mixed...


God precedes the beginning and he will never be last because his kingdom has no end...


OK , so your conclusion... who do you think it is?


If God is a self, if Jesus is the image of God, we are in the image of God and if the devil impersonates God then as I said it is a bit mixed...

Operate your spirit and the written word and the answers will appear...

To God be the glory...


I appreciate your desire to follow the spirit's leading.

Let me say this. Whoever Rev 22:13 is referring to, is one person or entity who is named all three of these:

Alpha and Omega

Beginning and End

First and Last

----------------

From what I see in scripture, "the Lord Almighty who was and is and is to come" is also referred to as Alpha and Omega, Beginning and Ending in Rev 1:8

Who is this? Well , the Almighty is usually understood to be God. And Rev 4:8-11 speaks of the One on the throne , the LORD God Almighty , who was and is and is to come as being the One who is worthy because He created all things. So this would seem also to refer to God, who is the Creator.

Well, this same Alpha and Omega ( Who was shown to be the Almighty, the Creator) is also said in Rev 1:11 to be not just Alpha and Omega , but also First and Last. This agrees with Rev 22:13 also.

This one of Rev 1:11 (Alpha and Omega, First and Last) speaks, and in Rev 1:18 says "I am He that liveth and was dead; and behold I am alive forevermore."

Also Rev 2:8 "And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;" identifies the First and the Last as He who was dead and now is alive.

Since this First and Last is also Alpha and Omega, He must also be the Almighty (as we saw Alpha and Omega was) and He who was and is and is to come, also referred to as LORD God Almighty.

------------------------

Remember we started with Rev 22:13, the Alpha and Omega , Beginning and End, First and Last are all referring to just One person or entity.

------------------------

Rex,

No doubt you are not convinced by anything I say, but you only want to get your beliefs from the scripture and I respect that.

I hope that you have been able to follow my thoughts thru this, if I have been able to write in a semi-logical way. Sometimes it's hard.

I agree to God be the glory, and Peace be to you this night, Rex.


Real differentiate between creator and creation and you will no longer see three but one...
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 12:40 am
I don't think anyone knows "the word" here like I do.

But I am so open to hear more... and other variations.

But if you could only know how I glory in God every day...

One God is the way to go...

A house divided is a house that has little function... (RR)
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 12:40 am
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
Hi Rex,

May I ask you, who is this scripture referring to?

Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.



This scripture is a bit mixed...


God precedes the beginning and he will never be last because his kingdom has no end...


OK , so your conclusion... who do you think it is?


If God is a self, if Jesus is the image of God, we are in the image of God and if the devil impersonates God then as I said it is a bit mixed...

Operate your spirit and the written word and the answers will appear...

To God be the glory...


I appreciate your desire to follow the spirit's leading.

Let me say this. Whoever Rev 22:13 is referring to, is one person or entity who is named all three of these:

Alpha and Omega

Beginning and End

First and Last

----------------

From what I see in scripture, "the Lord Almighty who was and is and is to come" is also referred to as Alpha and Omega, Beginning and Ending in Rev 1:8

Who is this? Well , the Almighty is usually understood to be God. And Rev 4:8-11 speaks of the One on the throne , the LORD God Almighty , who was and is and is to come as being the One who is worthy because He created all things. So this would seem also to refer to God, who is the Creator.

Well, this same Alpha and Omega ( Who was shown to be the Almighty, the Creator) is also said in Rev 1:11 to be not just Alpha and Omega , but also First and Last. This agrees with Rev 22:13 also.

This one of Rev 1:11 (Alpha and Omega, First and Last) speaks, and in Rev 1:18 says "I am He that liveth and was dead; and behold I am alive forevermore."

Also Rev 2:8 "And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;" identifies the First and the Last as He who was dead and now is alive.

Since this First and Last is also Alpha and Omega, He must also be the Almighty (as we saw Alpha and Omega was) and He who was and is and is to come, also referred to as LORD God Almighty.

------------------------

Remember we started with Rev 22:13, the Alpha and Omega , Beginning and End, First and Last are all referring to just One person or entity.

------------------------

Rex,

No doubt you are not convinced by anything I say, but you only want to get your beliefs from the scripture and I respect that.

I hope that you have been able to follow my thoughts thru this, if I have been able to write in a semi-logical way. Sometimes it's hard.

I agree to God be the glory, and Peace be to you this night, Rex.


Real differentiate between creator and creation and you will no longer see three but one...


I believe in only One God, Rex.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 12:47 am
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
RexRed wrote:
real life wrote:
Hi Rex,

May I ask you, who is this scripture referring to?

Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.



This scripture is a bit mixed...


God precedes the beginning and he will never be last because his kingdom has no end...


OK , so your conclusion... who do you think it is?


If God is a self, if Jesus is the image of God, we are in the image of God and if the devil impersonates God then as I said it is a bit mixed...

Operate your spirit and the written word and the answers will appear...

To God be the glory...


I appreciate your desire to follow the spirit's leading.

Let me say this. Whoever Rev 22:13 is referring to, is one person or entity who is named all three of these:

Alpha and Omega

Beginning and End

First and Last

----------------

From what I see in scripture, "the Lord Almighty who was and is and is to come" is also referred to as Alpha and Omega, Beginning and Ending in Rev 1:8

Who is this? Well , the Almighty is usually understood to be God. And Rev 4:8-11 speaks of the One on the throne , the LORD God Almighty , who was and is and is to come as being the One who is worthy because He created all things. So this would seem also to refer to God, who is the Creator.

Well, this same Alpha and Omega ( Who was shown to be the Almighty, the Creator) is also said in Rev 1:11 to be not just Alpha and Omega , but also First and Last. This agrees with Rev 22:13 also.

This one of Rev 1:11 (Alpha and Omega, First and Last) speaks, and in Rev 1:18 says "I am He that liveth and was dead; and behold I am alive forevermore."

Also Rev 2:8 "And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;" identifies the First and the Last as He who was dead and now is alive.

Since this First and Last is also Alpha and Omega, He must also be the Almighty (as we saw Alpha and Omega was) and He who was and is and is to come, also referred to as LORD God Almighty.

------------------------

Remember we started with Rev 22:13, the Alpha and Omega , Beginning and End, First and Last are all referring to just One person or entity.

------------------------

Rex,

No doubt you are not convinced by anything I say, but you only want to get your beliefs from the scripture and I respect that.

I hope that you have been able to follow my thoughts thru this, if I have been able to write in a semi-logical way. Sometimes it's hard.

I agree to God be the glory, and Peace be to you this night, Rex.


Real differentiate between creator and creation and you will no longer see three but one...


I believe in only One God, Rex.



Pray to this God.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 12:50 am
Joh 4:23
But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 08:28 am
RexRed wrote:
After the rapture (I call gathering day) the world is returned to a "physical" existence and "law" and it is a continuation of the OT. (the law is held in abeyance as grace rules the world [the church]) They (after the gathering) will not find heaven but if they prevail they will find paradise of which we will be the light thereof, within the lamb (christ) of God.

Paradise is always a place on earth as heaven is another calling through christ by God...

Rex,

So, is what you are saying is that there is no hell and there will be no final punishment or final judgment?

Paradise is always a place on earth...... Surely you are not talking about the earth of today being a paradise?
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Sep, 2005 09:15 am
Momma Angel wrote:
RexRed wrote:
After the rapture (I call gathering day) the world is returned to a "physical" existence and "law" and it is a continuation of the OT. (the law is held in abeyance as grace rules the world [the church]) They (after the gathering) will not find heaven but if they prevail they will find paradise of which we will be the light thereof, within the lamb (christ) of God.

Paradise is always a place on earth as heaven is another calling through christ by God...

Rex,

So, is what you are saying is that there is no hell and there will be no final punishment or final judgment?

Paradise is always a place on earth...... Surely you are not talking about the earth of today being a paradise?


There is a hell and there is a lake of fire and there will be a new heaven and earth... paradise will be again on earth...
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 12:25 am
There is a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God...
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 12:28 am
RexRed wrote:
There is a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God...

Would you mind telling me what the difference is?
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 12:34 am
Rex Reed Wrote:

Quote:
I don't think anyone knows "the word" here like I do.

But I am so open to hear more... and other variations.

But if you could only know how I glory in God every day...

One God is the way to go...

A house divided is a house that has little function... (RR)


Excuse me? Do you not realize this is the kind of superiority that turns people away from Christianity? You are open to hear more and other variations? Since when? You have heard more and were given variations and you accused me of idolatry! And I'm thrilled that you glory in God everyday. This is as it should be.

One God yes. But He had a Son who died on the cross for our sins and we are taught that no one gets to the father except through me.

You don't think anyone knows "the word" like you do? Now I really understand how non-believers can get so angry and say we force religion down their throats.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 12:57 am
Momma Angel wrote:
RexRed wrote:
There is a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God...

Would you mind telling me what the difference is?


I am not really that sure... Smile

But I believe the kingdom of heaven was created by God who is the LORD of the kingdom of God...

Someday the kingdom of heaven will be in total submission to the kingdom of God...

One of Christ's purposes was to "bring us to God"...
0 Replies
 
Arella Mae
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 12:59 am
RexRed wrote:
Momma Angel wrote:
RexRed wrote:
There is a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God...

Would you mind telling me what the difference is?


I am not really that sure... Smile

But I believe the kingdom of heaven was created by God who is the LORD of the kingdom of God...

Someday the kingdom of heaven will be in total submission to the kingdom of God...

One of Christ's purposes was to "bring us to God"...

Well, that covers the kingdom of God. Now what about the kingdom of heaven? Surely you have some thoughts on it or you would say they were two different things.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 01:53 am
Momma Angel wrote:
RexRed wrote:
Momma Angel wrote:
RexRed wrote:
There is a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God...

Would you mind telling me what the difference is?


I am not really that sure... Smile

But I believe the kingdom of heaven was created by God who is the LORD of the kingdom of God...

Someday the kingdom of heaven will be in total submission to the kingdom of God...

One of Christ's purposes was to "bring us to God"...

Well, that covers the kingdom of God. Now what about the kingdom of heaven? Surely you have some thoughts on it or you would say they were two different things.


The kingdom of heaven today is now in total submission to Christ Jesus...

It takes a world to "believe" this...

When "God" is ready for paradise (the fullness of time) GOD shall act upon these forces (or other, these forces shall implode upon themselves) and all shall be subdued unto the father (Why is God our father? Because he fathered us...) Smile Spiritual seed/Born again... But it takes faith and action to realize this fully in our day and time... Doubt is simply enough for defeat...

The earth is still under free will...

Christ by free will was and is obedient to the father... but God never possesses.

"I always do the will of the father" "I and the father are one"... (in will and purpose) "not my will but thine be done". By the choice of Christ we are enabled to be saved.

The lord of LORDS...

The son of God...

God the LORD of lords and Christ the lord of all people...

God is ultimately our SAVIOUR because he made the "plan" of redemption and planned his son to be our atonement....

God rescued us from sin...

The kingdom of heaven is our destiny and the Bible prophesies the kingdom of heaven shall be subdued to christ and christ subdued to God our SAVIOR...
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 02:58 am
I know some folks...admittedly very young folks...who "believe" there is a Santa Claus who brings them presents at Christmas time. I know some who "believe" there is an Easter Bunny...and a Tooth Fairy.

I know others who "believe" there are no gods...

...and of course, I know some who "believe" there is a God.

There is a huge problem with "believing."

Do any of you know what that problem is?
0 Replies
 
Cyracuz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 06:02 am
I'm curious
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 12:27 pm
Cyracuz wrote:
I'm curious


Ya can "believe" anything ya want!
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 03:46 pm
RexRed wrote:
There is a difference between the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God...


What is the difference here?

19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.

19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
0 Replies
 
mesquite
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Sep, 2005 08:03 pm
I would say no difference, since the same two sentiments in the book of Mark both use kingdom of God.

23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly [with difficulty] shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Makes one wonder how George Bush translates that into tax cuts for the wealthy.
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Sep, 2005 03:58 pm
mesquite wrote:
I would say no difference, since the same two sentiments in the book of Mark both use kingdom of God.

23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly [with difficulty] shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Makes one wonder how George Bush translates that into tax cuts for the wealthy.


Are you saying that somehow you believe it is Bush's responsibility to tax the rich so as to reduce their wealth, thus somehow making it easier for them to go to heaven?

I thought you were all about SEPARATION of church and state. Apparently not.

Anyway the answer is in the quotation from Mark that you provided. It is difficult for those who TRUST IN their riches to go to heaven. It is not unspiritual to be either rich or poor. It is sinful to trust in your money no matter how much , or little , you have.

Better luck next time, Mesquite. Laughing
0 Replies
 
 

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