Why does the Bible get misinterpreted so often????

Now how do you reach this conclusion, CI, since you don't interpret what the Bible says specifically because all such interpretation is subjective.

Those were your words, remember?

I

How often do I need to mention the fact that I am not an expert on the bible. All I can do is post articles that supports what I have said. It's for you to refute these posts with your own arguments. I'm not the author of these claims.

As christians, I would presume that you know the bible quite well, but some of you seem to challenge what is posted by "bible experts." That's not my problem.

who believes Wikipedia anyway? more authors and editors than the bible

I have quit reading anything that isn't his own words. He doesn't believe in the Bible but he will post what Bible scholars say? I haven't got a clue as to what he really thinks.

Don't you have that backwards, C.I. You don't post articles to support what you said. You post articles and then post other articles to support those articles. You never say anything.

Whether you believe what Wikipedia says or not is not my problem. If you wish to challenge their statements, please feel free to do so - with Wikipedia.

Agreed Intrepid.

Perhaps you should check your sources more carefully, C.I.

don't need to others have already show the weakness in how it works

I'm not sure about others, but I feel less than energetic about refuting posts where the person posting the post (you) isn't at least somewhat vested in carrying on a two-way conversation. When you present someone else's argument as your own, expect people to argue with you as if it is your own.

Simply claiming "but that's not my argument, it is someone else's" isn't likely to get you off the hook.




I suspect any Christian is going to challenge anything they disagree with. The problem here is that there is nobody at the other end of the challenge to respond.

I

Implicator,
Bingo! You have hit the nail on the head.

I second that!

CI, stirring the pot up once again.

Some would suggest that the overabundance of material and items being challenged would point towards a flimsy belief system.

Questioner,

We are trying to help C.I. with that. :wink:

Isaiah 9:
7. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even forever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Jesus failed to ascend "the throne of David", much less "establish" a government "with justice and peace".

Luke 12:
49. I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled? (Words of an arsonist, certainly not a peacemaker!)
50. Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: (Jesus denies that he is a peacemaker!)
51. For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. (Jesus divides people)

Matthew 10:4
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace on earth, but a sword.

Jesus was NOT the Prince of Peace but an angry man.

But the Proverbs 22:24-23 warns "Make no friendship with an angry man; and with a furious man thou shalt not go: Lest thou learn his ways, and get a snare to thy soul."

Matthew 16:
15. He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16. And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17. And I say unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
18. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Mark 8:
27 "...Whom do men say I am? (Jesus does not know what people think of him so he asks his disciples.)
29 And he saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ.

Jesus did not know what people thought of him nor his disciples thought of him so he enquired. He liked Peter's answer very much and gave him the keys to his church.

Matthew 16:23
But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offense unto me:" (Jesus showed no loyalty to his strongest supporter.)
Jesus went further and mentioned about being killed. Peter instantly rebuked him for such a suggestion and would not have it. Jesus getting angry at Peter for not going along with his sacrificial mission called Peter "Satan". How ephemeral Jesus moods and loyalties were. So, Peter, who is Satan, built Jesus' church!

Luke 12:53
The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, the daughter against the mother; the mother-in-law against her daughter-in-law. and the daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. (Fifth Commandment!?)

Matthew 10:37
He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. (Jesus preached to "dishonor" filial relationship!)



Exodus 20:12
Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee. (Fifth of the Ten Commandments.)

Matthew 4:
17. Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. (Strange way of fulfilling a law by preaching to break it! Another case of two-faced hypocrisy?)
18. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus contradicted himself with his own words here. He was teaching to break one of the BIG laws, none other than the Ten Commandments. One can only infer that Jesus by his own words would not be called "great" in the "kingdom of heaven".

Isaiah 9:
1. "...and afterwards did more grievously afflict her by the way of the sea, beyond Jordan, in Galilee of the nations." (How true, Jesus unleashed such a powerful hatred for his own people that Israel and the Jewish people have not been "more grievously afflicted" than by this same Galilean!)
The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light: they that dwelled in the land of the shadow of death, upon them hath the light shined.

From Jesus' comments he appeared to be a politician saying different things to different groups to cobble together a coalition.

Reference: King James Version

Isaiah 14:
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning!
How art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart,
a) I will ascend into heaven,
b) I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:
c) I will sit also upon the mount of the Congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 d)I will ascend above the heights of the clouds:
e)I will be like the most High.


COMPARISON:

OLD TESTAMENT
1) Isaiah 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
(Note: Lucifer is Latin for bright.)

NEW TESTAMENT
Revelation 22:16
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. (How arrogant, naming himself after such a lustrous heavenly body!)

OLD TESTAMENT
2) Isaiah 14:13 I will ascend into heaven


NEW TESTAMENT
Luke 24:51
And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven. Mark 16:19
So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

OLD TESTAMENT
3) Isaiah 14:13
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:

The stars of God are the Israelites. (See Numbers 24:17 "...there shall come a Star out of Jacob,...")

Genesis 15:5
And he brought him forth abroad, and said,
Look now towards heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him,
So shall thy seed be.

Deuteronomy 10:22
Thy fathers went down into Egypt with threescore and ten persons, and now the LORD thy God hath made thee as the stars of heaven for multitude.

NEW TESTAMENT
Matthew 19:28
And Jesus said unto them,
Verily I say unto you,
That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his the glory, ye also shall sit upon thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

OLD TESTAMENT
4) Isaiah 14:13
I will sit also upon the mount of the Congregation, in the sides of the north.
[Note:
a) Mt. Ophel, just south of the Temple Mount, has been identified as Mt. Zion. Jesus as a child sat in the Temple.
b) Location of the Last Supper is just north of (Mt. Zion?)]

Psalm 48:2
Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the north, the city of the great King.

NEW TESTAMENT
Luke 2:46
And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.

Matthew 26:20
Now when the even was come, he sat down with the twelve.

Luke 22:14
And when the hour was come, he sat down, and the twelve apostles with him.

5) Isaiah 14:14
I will be like the most High.

God says He is the first and the last in the following passages:-

OLD TESTAMENT
Isaiah 41:4
Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he.

Isaiah 44:6
Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of Hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

NEW TESTAMENT
Jesus says that he is the first and the last in the following passages:-

Revelation 1:11
Saying, I am the Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and untoLaodicea.

Revelation 1:17
And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

Revelation 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

God's garments are sprinkled with blood in the following passage:-

OLD TESTAMENT
Isaiah 63:3
I have trodden the wine press alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.

Jesus' garment is dipped in blood in the following passage:-

NEW TESTAMENT
Revelation 19:13
And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

OLD TESTAMENT
In Isaiah, new heavens and new earth are mentioned in the following passage:-

Isaiah 66:22
For as the new heavens and new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

NEW TESTAMENT
In Revelation, a new heaven and a new earth are mentioned in the following passage:-

Revelation 21:1
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away: and there was no more sea.

OLD TESTAMENT
God is the bridegroom of His people in the following:-

Isaiah 62:5
For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee: and as the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee.

NEW TESTAMENT
Jesus is the bridegroom of his followers in the following:-

Matthew 9:15
And Jesus said unto them, Can the chilren of the bridechamber mourn, as long as the bridegroom is with them? but the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken from them, and shall they fast.

Mark 2:19.
And Jesus said unto them, Can the children of the bridechamber fast, while the bridegroom is with them? as long as they have the bridegroom with them, they cannot fast.
20. But the days will come, while the bridegroom shall be taken away from them, and then shall they fast in those days.

Luke 5:34.
And he said unto them, Can ye make the children of the bridegroom fast, while the bridegroom is with them?
35. But the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken away from them, and then shall they fast in those days.

Revelation 19:7.
Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
9. And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

Revelation 20:9.
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

Isaiah 14:19
"But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch,..."
Note: The image of Jesus on the cross confirms it for there is no gravesite of him.

Jesus fits the descriptions of Lucifer almost to a T.
So is Jesus God or Lucifer?

Some might suggest that the hang nail on my left big toe would point towards a flimsy belief system. The challenge for such people doing said suggesting is to support their suggestion.

I

Alright.

Let me pose it to you this way:

You are about to board an airplane. You see your pilot at the gateway and immediately recognize him as the single best pilot in the world. Just the mere sight of this pilot fills you with ease.

From your vantage point you can also see the airplane on which you will be flying. It only has 1 wing, a rather obvious oil leak, a hole about 2 feet in diameter in the fuselage and several missing windows.

The question: Do you trust the pilot enough to ignore the condition of the plane in which you will be entrusting your life? Do you believe in his abilities to force that plane to hold together?

The bible is the airplane. It is riddled with contradictions and ambiguity, yet you(generalization) are content to merely argue semantics and what you 'disagree' with, all the while strapping on the seatbelt and taxiing to the runway. I consider this to be idiocy of the highest order, yet it is labeled 'faith'.

The fact that there are so many 'challenges' to be had points directly to the fact that for all the arguing, bickering, debate, and what-not amongst theologians, scholars, and your average believer, the thing you believe in is about as solid an airplane with one wing.

Q, I understand the point you are making all too well. Your analogy does a fantastic job of further clarifying for me just what your perspective is. But all the descriptive language in the world is not sufficient in itself to move your perspective from a belief to fact.

To demonstrate a contradiction exists in any text, one must first justify the interpretation of the text in question that is used to demonstrate the contradiction. If not, the most a person can say is "this particular interpretation of the text is problematic."

Now that's actually a fine tack to take, especially if Christian shares with you their interpretation. At that point you don't need to demonstrate some objective understanding of the intent of the authors of the text, you can simply refer to the Christian's interpretation, assuming you have made sure you aren't misrepresenting what they are saying.

I

Ah, but here's the rub. I'm not trying to move anyone's perspective from belief to fact. Having once been a believer myself, all I am currently looking for is some semblance of cohesion within the main reference material provided.



In this instance, are you including separate books of the bible under your label of 'text'?



I can't really tell if you're implying something with this, so I'll just leave it alone.