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Why does the Bible get misinterpreted so often????

 
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Sat 10 Sep, 2005 10:25 pm
slkshock7 wrote:
Seems like in every debate or discussion with an agnostic or atheist...at some point, the agnostic or atheist will assert that something from the Bible is being misinterpreted...or misused in some way.

What is it with that?



Excellent point, Slkshock7. If one doesn't think that a document as it is written is to be considered reliable and accurate, then on what basis does one assert that it is not being understood correctly?
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 01:55 am
Because people try to interpret it rather than let it interpret itself...
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 02:14 am
Oh?


Pray tell me, how does it interpret itself?
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 02:18 am
slkshock7 wrote:
Seems like in every debate or discussion with an agnostic or atheist...at some point, the agnostic or atheist will assert that something from the Bible is being misinterpreted...or misused in some way.

What is it with that?


Most agnostics and atheists go with what is actually written in your Bible. The people claiming the Bible is being misinterpreted are the theists...not the agnostics and atheists.


Quote:
Frank,
I might be willing to give a little credence to your argument if you could show me a book, any book, that couldn't be misinterpreted or misused.

Especially a book about subjects (gods, heaven, faith, etc) you yourself readily admit can't be proven or disproven.


Yeah...but look at some of the supposed misinterpretations...and you will see that the theists (especially Christians) are always claiming there is a misinterpretation whenever there is a passage that shows their god to be the petty barbarian that it is.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 02:20 am
real life wrote:
slkshock7 wrote:
Seems like in every debate or discussion with an agnostic or atheist...at some point, the agnostic or atheist will assert that something from the Bible is being misinterpreted...or misused in some way.

What is it with that?



Excellent point, Slkshock7. If one doesn't think that a document as it is written is to be considered reliable and accurate, then on what basis does one assert that it is not being understood correctly?


Very easy.

You look at what is written...and comment on what is written.

There is absolutely no reason to suppose one has to consider it reliable or accurate. All we are commenting on is what is actually written in the book.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 02:20 am
dlowan wrote:
Oh?


Pray tell me, how does it interpret itself?
:wink:
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 02:24 am
dlowan wrote:
Oh?


Pray tell me, how does it interpret itself?


There are many principles as to how the bible interprets itself...

to name a few...

1) Study...

2) Where a word has been used before
3) In the verse
4) The context
5) The remote context
6) To whom it is addressed
7) Customs and Orientalisms
9) Figures of speech

to name only a few...

But to just say, "well I think" doesn't always cut the mustard...

People think that they think that they think...

Rather than they know that they know that they know...

Ephesians 3:19
And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

2Ti 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 02:53 am
Okay, Rex.

Here is a passage from the Bible...it is the god of the Bible speaking to Moses:


"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them shall be
put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their
lives." Leviticus 20:13

I cannot speak for all agnostics and atheists...but most agnostics and atheists I know are of the opinion that this passage is clear and unambiguous. It indicates a facet of human behavior...identifies that behavior as repugnant to the god of the Bible...an "abominable deed"...and decrees that the penalty for such behavior should be death.


Now...bring to bear all the things you mentioned...and tell us how "the Bible interprets" this passage.

And I thank you in advance for helping make my point.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 04:06 am
Snorkle.


KILL!! KILL!!!!! KILL!!!!!
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 04:54 am
Quote:
KILL!! KILL!!!!! KILL!!!!!


Yes, God's solution to all problems.

Why would God write a book that makes himself look like a barbaric fool?

Answer: God doesn't write books. Ignorant humans write them. Then other ignorant fools give them a divine status. In the process of doing so they make God look like a divine idiot; a divine barbaric idiot.
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  2  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 05:05 am
Quote:
There are many principles as to how the bible interprets itself...

to name a few...

1) Study...

2) Where a word has been used before
3) In the verse
4) The context
5) The remote context
6) To whom it is addressed
7) Customs and Orientalisms
9) Figures of speech

to name only a few...


So what your saying is a person has to be an expert on the history of the times, know the customs of the civilizations mentioned in the Bible, the language and figures of speech, understand the cultures and religions of all those whom God destroyed.

Once you know that the Bible will interpret itself.

Are you telling us that God expects everyone to have this background of knowledge before they read the Bible so they can understand what he was saying? Otherwise, without this knowledge they would sit there and say, 'I think thisÂ….. or I interpret thatÂ…..'?
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 05:20 am
real life wrote:
slkshock7 wrote:
Seems like in every debate or discussion with an agnostic or atheist...at some point, the agnostic or atheist will assert that something from the Bible is being misinterpreted...or misused in some way.

What is it with that?



Excellent point, Slkshock7. If one doesn't think that a document as it is written is to be considered reliable and accurate, then on what basis does one assert that it is not being understood correctly?


I think you had better take a closer look at your fellow Christians. It is they that point out mistakes in belief and errors in interpretation of the Bible of other Christians more vehemently and scornfully then agnostics and atheists.

Look at the history of your religion. See how many Christians have been persecuted, tortured and killed by other Christians because their belief did not agree with another's.
0 Replies
 
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 08:25 am
Frank Apisa wrote:
slkshock7 wrote:
Seems like in every debate or discussion with an agnostic or atheist...at some point, the agnostic or atheist will assert that something from the Bible is being misinterpreted...or misused in some way.

What is it with that?


Most agnostics and atheists go with what is actually written in your Bible. The people claiming the Bible is being misinterpreted are the theists...not the agnostics and atheists.



So you are claiming that agnostics and atheists are in complete agreement with their interpretation of the Bible???? Come on, I'm new to this forum, but clearly agnostics and atheists only agree with some of what the Bible says, generally those passages of the Old Testament that show a vengeful (and according to you, barbaric) God. Shall we address the agnostic or atheist interpretation of Revelations?

Frank wrote:

slkshock7 wrote:
Frank,
I might be willing to give a little credence to your argument if you could show me a book, any book, that couldn't be misinterpreted or misused.

Especially a book about subjects (gods, heaven, faith, etc) you yourself readily admit can't be proven or disproven.


Yeah...but look at some of the supposed misinterpretations...and you will see that the theists (especially Christians) are always claiming there is a misinterpretation whenever there is a passage that shows their god to be the petty barbarian that it is.


You've concluded that God is a "petty barbarian" and thus Christians are misinterpreting the Bible. I conclude that God is loving, just and often incomprehendable and thus agnostics and atheists are misinterpreting the Bible (or at least misinterpreting God). I'm afraid that you and I are now and always will be at an impasse on this issue.
0 Replies
 
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 08:59 am
xingu wrote:
real life wrote:
slkshock7 wrote:
Seems like in every debate or discussion with an agnostic or atheist...at some point, the agnostic or atheist will assert that something from the Bible is being misinterpreted...or misused in some way.

What is it with that?



Excellent point, Slkshock7. If one doesn't think that a document as it is written is to be considered reliable and accurate, then on what basis does one assert that it is not being understood correctly?


I think you had better take a closer look at your fellow Christians. It is they that point out mistakes in belief and errors in interpretation of the Bible of other Christians more vehemently and scornfully then agnostics and atheists.

Look at the history of your religion. See how many Christians have been persecuted, tortured and killed by other Christians because their belief did not agree with another's.


Xingu,

Please do tell me how many Christians have killed other Chrisitians because of their doctrinal beliefs. I'll even help (Ireland 4000, Inquisition 5000-100,000).

And after you're finished with that, please go on and look at the rest of world history and please tell me how many atheist-professing people have killed other atheist-professing folks because they did not agree with each other (I'll help here too, Hitler's Germany (6,000,000),Stalinist Russia (17,000,000), Cambodia (2,400,000) and Maoist China (40,000,000), just to start).

Next why don't you do a comparison of how many lives atheist-professing organizations have saved because of their ideology versus how many lives Christian organizations have saved because of their beliefs. I'm willing to do this with you. You identify the atheist-professing organizations (of course, they must truly profess atheism as the root of their benevolence), and I will do the same for Christian organizations. Then we'll get estimates of lives saved and compare. What do you say, are you game?
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 09:41 am
AHHHH, but atheist do not take the holier than thou position that they follow Jesus' teachings.

They don't pretend to walk on water, spouting their higher morality. They don't kill in the name of God.

Also I am not selling atheism. I am not an atheist so I see little value in anything you say about atheism.

By the way, Hitler, Himmler and Goebbles were raised Catholic. They believed they were doing God's work. Hitler's Germany was a Christian nation, not atheist.

I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews I am fighting for the Lord's work.
― Adolf Hitler, Speech, Reichstag, 1936

And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly, it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people. And when I look on my people I see them work and work and toil and labor, and at the end of the week they have only for their wages wretchedness and misery. When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very devil, if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom today this poor people are plundered and exploited.
― Adolf Hitler

I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so
― Adolf Hitler
0 Replies
 
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 10:20 am
xingu wrote:
AHHHH, but atheist do not take the holier than thou position that they follow Jesus' teachings.

They don't pretend to walk on water, spouting their higher morality. They don't kill in the name of God.

Also I am not selling atheism. I am not an atheist so I see little value in anything you say about atheism.

By the way, Hitler, Himmler and Goebbles were raised Catholic. They believed they were doing God's work. Hitler's Germany was a Christian nation, not atheist.



No, atheists take the perspective that they themselves (or society, or the party) are "better" than anyone else and this justifies their murders. And I don't find it surprising that atheists "don't kill in the name of God". Laughing

I am somewhat with you. So-called Christians have done some terrible things in the past in the name of Christ. But I judge those individuals in error, not the entire Christian religion. To be fair, you should do the same.

Since you are not atheist, please modify my challenge by replacing the XXXXX to the ideology of your choice. I eagerly await your response.

slkshock7 should have wrote:
why don't you do a comparison of how many lives XXXXX organizations have saved because of their ideology versus how many lives Christian organizations have saved because of their beliefs. I'm willing to do this with you. You identify the XXXXX-professing organizations (of course, they must truly profess XXXXX as the root of their benevolence), and I will do the same for Christian organizations. Then we'll get estimates of lives saved and compare. What do you say, are you game?


Oh...I've heard those quotes of Hitler before and there are just as many quotes that express Hitlers aversion to Christianity (see http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/mischedj/ca_hitler.html). Unfortunately for me, this webpage concludes that Hitler was neither Christian nor atheist. So lets take Hitlers 6,000,000 out of the total. You've still got another 60,000,000 or so to account for.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 10:35 am
Frank Apisa wrote:
Okay, Rex.

Here is a passage from the Bible...it is the god of the Bible speaking to Moses:


"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them shall be
put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their
lives." Leviticus 20:13

I cannot speak for all agnostics and atheists...but most agnostics and atheists I know are of the opinion that this passage is clear and unambiguous. It indicates a facet of human behavior...identifies that behavior as repugnant to the god of the Bible...an "abominable deed"...and decrees that the penalty for such behavior should be death.


Now...bring to bear all the things you mentioned...and tell us how "the Bible interprets" this passage.

And I thank you in advance for helping make my point.



The Bible interprets itself because you are a bigot...

Is that clear enough
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 10:40 am
The Bible also says "There is no God" Frank...
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 10:44 am
That is... "The foolish man says, "there is no God."

You take scriptures out of context and use them for your bigotry...
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Sep, 2005 10:51 am
The Bible also say THERE IS NEITHER MALE NOR FEMALE but all are one in Christ...

Is that clear and unambiguous to you atheist and aggies???

You have been told this scripture yet you gravitate toward bigotry of the OT... that in itself is revealing of your character...

The Bible is an acid test to weed out people like you who cannot LEARN...
0 Replies
 
 

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