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Thu 1 Sep, 2005 03:44 pm
Shame! The forgotten people in the hurricane evacuation.
There is one big elephant in the room that nobody is talking about, including government and the Media.
The one government that has failed it's citizens are the local city, town and country (parrish) that failed to plan for evacuating the poor. These government officials should have known the situations of a large part of the population that is poor. It's not so much race, it's economic class. The scenes we see on TV make it obvious that the stranded people are largely black and largely poor.
When officials told people to evacuate before the hurricane hit, they failed to realize that many of the poor could not evacuate. They didn't have cars, didn't have money to get transportation or alternative housing.
What local governments must do is to plan how to evacuate poor people who are unable to do it on their own. There have to be special transportation for people without transportation. The poor have to have a way to reach that transportation.
This failure to recognize the needs of the poor is a major failure of government and planning at all levels, but especially at the local level. Had this not happened, the scope of the disaster could have been far less. We would have had property damage, but not so much humanitarian assistance required so fast.
Would this forgotten population happen in your city or town?
BBB
In my city there are too many poor to forget them!
Now, honestly, I don't know the details in N.O. But this happens everywhere: the poorer people are not only more vulnerable but also more ignorant and less likely to heed the instructions of Civil Protection authorities, so they are usually the most struck.
One thing is to be stranded in the middle of the flood because they forgot you, did not warn you or did not take you into a safe shelter; another is to be stranded because you were ignorant and stubborn and didn't want to leave your house.
The New Orleans images are striking: almost all the people left behind are black. It looks bad.
I guess it's a combination of the former causes. But I just don't have the information to see which weighed more.
fbaezer
fbaezer, having met you and spent several hours talking with you last year, I'm not surprised that you have the perception to understand the situation I'm ineptly trying describe.
These people were not well served by their local governments. I doubt that the problem probably didn't occur to local government officials. They were the forgotten population.
Good to hear from you from Mexico City.
BBB
Well currently where I live in West Palm Beach I doubt the poor would be forgotten as there are few of them. Where I grew up in east L.A. in the ghettos however the poor Mexican population would largely be forgotten. There's simply too many with too many needs if a disaster like this hit.
that wouldnt happen anywhere here in NZ, everybody just chips in and help those in need when ever a disaster strikes here.....
I have been watching the News about New Orleans devestation and Im horrified to see all those people who are just left stranded!
What the hell is wrong?? I dont understand why there are no boats anywhere to help the needy......and the dead already...geez great place to live-not.
Extremely good point, BB. It almost seems like an afterthought to send them to the dome. If it was so safe there, why did they make an evacuation order? If they made an evacuation order, one would think that it was for everybody. I do not know the logistics of such a thing, but plans should have been in place.
I can't guarantee what would happen here, but I know that much training and planning goes into disaster preparedness.
It is hard to watch those images on TV. Sick people on the roof of a hospital for a whole day and then they finally send helicopters that can take 2 at a time. Eleven died at that one place alone while waiting for help.
I also agree this is a wake up call for other cities (not only in the US) to develop transportation plans for different scenarios, certainly for those areas likely not to have many cars for the population.
And some of it involves timing. There were a lot of cars floating in some of the photos I saw.
It is potentially very complicated. In a populated city with a big metropolitan area, even those with the fortune to have autos and fuel may get stuck on the few main routes out.
The best laid plans almost always go awry in an emergency. Before 9/11 New York's disaster coordination center was in the World Trade Center. One of the problems in perceptual. The US has not faced a disaster like this in 100 years but we thought we were just naturally better at this sort of thing and every think would work out fine. As a result what seemed to be preparation turned out not to be. We are getting an education about ourselves which the people of New Orleans are paying for.
It seems Bill Clinton's one of the few liberals not playing politics with this disaster:
Quote:MALVEAUX: Let me ask you this: There are some people at the New Orleans Convention Center who say that they have been living like animals -- no food, no water, no power. And they are the ones who are saying: Where are the buses? Where are the planes? Why did it take three days to see a real federal response here? Mr. Bush, you, whether it's fair or not, had gone through some administration criticism about your handling of Hurricane Andrew.
G.H.W. BUSH: I sure did.
MALVEAUX: Do you believe that this is legitimate?
G.H.W. BUSH: Yes, I do. What happened? We all sighed with -- not legitimate. I believe that they ought not to be as upset, but I can understand why they are. We thought, a lot of people thought, that when the hurricane went to the right a little bit, New Orleans was going to be spared. And it was only the next day that, you know, there were these horrible problems with the levee. But, look, if I were sitting there with no shower, no ability to use bathroom facilities, worried about my family, not knowing where they were, I'd blame anybody and so you have to expect that.
MALVEAUX: But do you think this administration responded quickly enough?
G.H.W. BUSH: Of course I do.
CLINTON: Let me answer this. The people in the Superdome are in a special position. And let me say, I've been going to New Orleans for over 50 years. There's no place on earth I love more. They went into the Superdome, not because of the flooding, but because we thought the hurricane was going to hit New Orleans smack dab and they'd be safe in there if they didn't leave town.
What happened was, when the levee broke and the town flooded, what did it do? It knocked out the electricity and it knocked out the sewage. They're living in hellacious conditions. They would be better off under a tree than being stuck there. You can't even breathe in that place now.
So I understand why they're so anxiety-ridden. But they have to understand, by the time it became obvious that they were in the fix they were in, there were a lot of other problems, too. There were people -- they were worried about people drowning that had to be taken off roofs.
MALVEAUX: So you two believe that the federal response was fast enough?
CLINTON: All I'm saying is what I know the facts are today. There are hundreds of buses now engaged in the act of taking people from New Orleans to the Astrodome in Houston. And you and I are not in a position to make any judgment because we weren't there.
All I'm saying is the way they got stuck there, I see why they feel the way they do. But the people that put them there did it because they thought they were saving their lives. And then when the problems showed up, they had a lot of other people to save. Now they've got hundreds of buses. We just need to get them out. I think they'll all be out by tomorrow. Didn't they say they would all be out by tomorrow morning?
G.H.W. BUSH: Yes.
MALVEAUX: OK. Well, thank you very much. I'm sorry. We've run out of time. Thank you.
G.H.W. BUSH: Let me -- I just to want finish. I believe the administration is doing the right thing, and I believe they have acted in a timely fashion. And I understand people being critical. That happens all the time. And I understand some people wanted to make, you know, a little difficulty by criticizing the president and the team. But I don't want to sit here and not defend the administration which, in my view, has taken all the right steps. And they're facing problems that nobody could foresee: breaking of the levees and the whole dome thing over in New Orleans coming apart. People couldn't foresee that.
CLINTON: Yes, I think that's important to point out. Because when you say that they should have done this, that or the other thing first, you can look at that problem in isolation, and you can say that.
But look at all the other things they had to deal with. I'm telling you, nobody thought this was going to happen like this. But what happened here is they escaped -- New Orleans escaped Katrina. But it brought all the water up the Mississippi River and all in the Pontchartrain, and then when it started running and that levee broke, they had problems they never could have foreseen.
And so I just think that we need to recognize right now there's a confident effort under way. People are doing the best they can. And I just don't think it's the time to worry about that. We need to keep people alive and get them back to life -- normal life.
Source
Hopefully I've put this in every one of BBB's numerous "Let's Blame Bush for Hurricane Katrina!" threads .....
It is not the responsibility or the capability of a city to manually carry it's inhabitants to other states in a day's notice.
That they opened such a huge place to the ones who absolutely could not leave was as much as a reasonable person could expect.
If not a legal responsibility, it is sure a good idea if some body/agency/group of citizens worked out an emergency bus system. Sure it would have failed here once the rains came, but it could have helped a lot of people before they did.
I don't know what purview that would fall under, but it makes sense to have plans for it.
I agree, BBB! I also wondered why buses where not supplied for the people who simply had no other means of leaving. It would have been such a simple solution that would have saved hundreds of lives.
Acquiunk wrote:The best laid plans almost always go awry in an emergency. Before 9/11 New York's disaster coordination center was in the World Trade Center. One of the problems in perceptual. The US has not faced a disaster like this in 100 years but we thought we were just naturally better at this sort of thing and every think would work out fine. As a result what seemed to be preparation turned out not to be. We are getting an education about ourselves which the people of New Orleans are paying for.
From an outsider's point of view, I think there's been a shocking lack of leadership from the Bush Administration in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.
Mr. President, it's been four days people are dying, and they have no food or water, no electricity they desperately need help what the hell are you doing
heaven help the USA if you have a massive terrorist attack.
The powers that be should have a couple of large Passenger ships anchored off the coast to supply power and accommodate seniors and children WITH THEIR PARENTS
do something, for Gods sake
.. This is America's shame.
Okay, I can see I need to set a few things straight here. I am from Louisiana. And honestly, I am appalled at the behavior of those still in New Orleans.
There was a city wide MANDATORY evacuation. There were busses offered for people to get out. Some, not all, that stayed, did so because they did not believe the Hurricane wasn't going to be that bad. They stated, "We've been through this before and survived so we can do it again."
I have no problem with those looking for food and water where they can. I do, however, have a big problem with them stealing electronics, guns, etc.
Even if it were the case that adequate preparations were not made, it still does not give ANYONE the right to turn to criminal activity. The rescuers are being shot at. There are snipers. The police force had to be taken off of rescue operations to try to stop the civil unrest. Many New Orleans police have turned in their badges.
The whole country is trying to come to the aid of these people and they are doing absolutely nothing themselves to make the situation any better. Now, they have pulled the race card saying if they were white things would be different.
The ones rioting, looting, shooting, etc., are the only ones that can be blamed for that behavior. No one is forcing them to do it. Women are being raped by criminals, all who are taking advantage of the situation.
These people that are stranded need to pull together and stop blaming everyone and everything else for their predicament. Yes, it's horrific they are stranded there. But the point is, they are there and now they must do what they can to help themselves the best they can while help is trying to get there. Would you really want to risk your life if you knew you were going to be shot at?
I am embarrassed by their behavior. Our churches are full of evacuees, our schools are full of evacuees, we have 18-wheelers leaving our city every three days full of supplies for those in New Orleans. The country is trying to help. The country is trying to band together to help our own. It's just sad that the evacuees (not all of them I realize) cannot resist the temptation to turn to animalistic behavior.
Whoa! All I said was that everyone is responsible for their own actions.
And, I also said that not everyone was able to leave. I said some. Hey, I live here in Louisiana. I know what is going on. I am living it every day.
This has nothing to do with politics. You give me one good reason why these people should be stealing TVs. You tell me why they should be shooting at rescue helicopters.
We, the country, are trying to help them, as we should. I am just saying that shooting at rescuers and looting is not helping the situation.
I am not blaming anyone for anything. I just believe EVERYONE needs to take responsibility for their own actions no matter what situation they are in.
And it doesn't have a dang thing to do with what color they are. I just said that the race card had been brought up and it should not have been.
This is the first I've heard of any buses available for the people. The tourists that were stranded there said they had absolutely no means of getting out of there. They clearly stated that all flights were canceled, all rental vehicles were taken and there was no other trasportation available for them to get out.
The majority of the people who didn't evacuate, simply had no means of getting out, such as cars or money.
Of course I am also frustrated with the ones who simply decided to stay and ride it out, but not nearly as frustrated as they most likely are with themselves, but the majority of the stranded had no way of getting out.
There were no buses for them.
Hey Tico,
Good to hear from you! And frankly, I don't care what they think of me. I know what is going on here in Louisiana. Everyone in Louisiana is living this nightmare. We are uniting together to help these people but now some are afraid to go there to help. My husband will not let me go with our 18-wheelers because of all the rapes and shootings and looting. The behavior being displayed by SOME is hurting ALL.
We will continue our relief efforts because it's the right thing to do. We care about those people. They are OUR neighbors, our countrymen. But, just because they are in a horrible situation, it does not give anyone the right to do wrong or use it to hurt others.
Montana, I know thre were not enough busses or any other transportation for everyone to get out. It's true, some could not get out, and for those, they had the superdome and the convention center, which provided some shelter. I am not saying that these people are to blame for their situation. I am only saying that since they are in this situation, they need to do what they can to help those trying to help them. And shooting at them is just not the way to do it.
anton wrote:From an outsider's point of view, I think there's been a shocking lack of leadership from the Bush Administration in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.
Mr. President, it's been four days people are dying, and they have no food or water, no electricity they desperately need help what the hell are you doing
heaven help the USA if you have a massive terrorist attack.
The powers that be should have a couple of large Passenger ships anchored off the coast to supply power and accommodate seniors and children WITH THEIR PARENTS
do something, for Gods sake
.. This is America's shame.
I agree wholeheartedly.
------
Tico this has nothing to do with Bush haters, absolutely not.
This has everything to do with incompetence and not being able to
prioritize. It was known days beforehand that Katrina is making
landfall in New Orleans - nothing was prepared, nothing was organiszed
and FEMA was nowhere to be seen. It was also known that the levees
won't withstand - nothing was done.
I don't hate Bush, I just hate an incapable, blind leader, regardless of
his name.
Mamma Angel
Mamma Angel, why are you so focused on the small criminal element that is making it difficult for everyone. You appear to only complain about them. What about all the other people?
BBB
Let me ask everyone here a question.
What are YOU doing to help solve the problem in New Orleans? Blaming the mayor, the president, etc., certainly does nothing to help.