This is Biden's America

@Mame,

Mame wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:

I treat EVERY promise made by a politician as a "I would like to..." promise, no matter how it is worded.

I am seldom disappointed.

In any case, it is morbidly naïve to treat them any other way.

I treated the "promises" Joe Biden made that way...and I am not as disappointed as you and others here seem to be.

You are mistaken, sir. I treat them the same way, and I am not disappointed.

Frank Apisa wrote:
It is my opinion that Joe Biden tried extremely hard to fulfill his "promises"...but that the amount of resistance (and the tenacity of the resistors) from within the party was more than he anticipated.

I agree with you. Completely and utterly.

Frank Apisa wrote:
In any case, I am more interested in what the political promises indicate as a trajectory...rather than as actual promises. I am not a Democrat, but the Democrats seem to be on the right trajectory...even if they are overmatched by opposition. I certainly would not trust Republican promises more than Democratic promises...and for the most part, I despise the trajectory of the Republican promises.

Again, agree.

Mea Culpa...or...My bad...as you choose, Mame. I've re-read your posts and I screwed up. My apologies.

Glad we are in agreement on so much.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

De nada, amigo. That's what I assumed. Gotta give the guy a chance. And one cannot compare the way this administration is being run to the last debacle. I hope they nail 45's pants to the wall on the documentation issue.

1 Reply

@neptuneblue,

Making it personal, calling me stupid, but I will let it slide. You don't understand that the ones that have the debt today need relief now. That doesn't somehow bar working to eradicate the program. Why wouldn't I be in favor of that. It can be a two pronged project.

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@Mame,

If they can declare grounds to bar him from holding public office it will be one of the biggest victories of all.

Mame wrote:

De nada, amigo. That's what I assumed. Gotta give the guy a chance. And one cannot compare the way this administration is being run to the last debacle. I hope they nail 45's pants to the wall on the documentation issue.

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@neptuneblue,

neptuneblue wrote:

It sounds like you think you know what you're talking about. And it's very wrong. There's nothing positive about not fixing a broken system. For you to ignore that is stupidity. Erasing student debt will never happen because it's a BAD IDEA. Fixing the issues is a GOOD IDEA.

Surely, you don't subscribe to that old fashioned notion that when one borrows money, one should pay it back.

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@edgarblythe,

Questions: How far back do you go with this school debt forgiveness? Just the recent crop of grads or anyone who still carries debt? How is this fair to those who aggressively paid their debt off? What will you do going forward? Are all school debts included (regardless of type of school or program)?

Problems: 1) your schools charge enormous fees, (perhaps it should be income-based), and 2) if what Neptune said about 1st year students having to live on campus, it should be eliminated - that causes unnecessary hardship on those families. Either that, or it should be income-based. But I think elimination is the best solution. If they can live at home, or share an apartment that is more affordable, why the heck not? She's right - the problems have to be solved. Eliminating the debt doesn't help everyone.

If you want an educated populace, you have to make it affordable.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

I did not call you stupid, Edgar.

I called the idea of erasing all student debt stupid.

Yes, I do have a dog in this fight. I have two children facing this issue right now. I did not raise them to think if they whine and cry enough, the government will save them them. They are REQUIRED to pay back what they borrowed. Just like you, just like me and the millions of others that have bills to pay.

Having said that, there are predatory lending issues that need resolving. A four year degree should not cost $120,000. There can be policies that can be instituted to alleviate some of that burden.

I feel guaranteed student loans (subsidized & unsubsidized Stafford loans) should not had an interest component at all. The Pell Grant can be expanded and a requirement of a percentage of tuition come from grant money can also be explored.

I've listed a couple of issues you have refused to acknowledge.

It seems to me you don't want to actually solve anything, just blame the sitting President for failing to do something that should have been fixed 30 years ago.

1 Reply

For example:

All incoming freshmen are required to live on campus for their first two years. Incoming freshmen who live within a 50-mile radius of the Kent Campus may choose to commute from the permanent address of their parents or legal guardian. Students who choose this option must submit the Mandatory Housing Exemption form, which is available on the Residence Services website. Incoming freshmen who do not have an exemption are required to live on campus.

https://www-s3-live.kent.edu/s3fs-root/s3fs-public/Freshman-Welcome-Packet.pdf

THE 2021 COHORT PRICES PER YEAR:
Undergraduate Ohio resident tuition: $11,923 | Non-Ohio resident tuition: $20,799
Housing for a double room: $7,700
Dining Services blue meal plan: $4,712
* New cohort rates are established each academic year.

TO EXPLORE ADDITIONAL AT-A-GLANCE COSTS, SUCH AS THE GOLD MEAL PLAN OR A SINGLE ROOM, ACCESS:
Tuition Rates
Housing Options
Dining Services Meal Plans

https://www.kent.edu/dining/meal-plans

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@Mame,

I'm talking the program the government put in place to generate the loans in question. I didn't memorize which year it started. When you pay 60,000 of it back but only 20,000 of the 60,000 counts off of the loan, you are talking a lifetime of payments. The program needs to be terminated, but the loans in force at this moment need to be wiped out.

1 Reply

@neptuneblue,

I should have known. Never mind.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

I disagree. Loans should be modified and re-calculated at a zero interest rate, with credit given towards the interest already paid, not terminate the GLS system.

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@edgarblythe,

Yes, you SHOULD have known, before spouting inaccuracies and bullshit. Maybe, after some thoughtful consideration of the information provided, you'll understand how wrong wiping student debt actually is and how to fix it.

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@edgarblythe,

Quote:

It will eradicate the debt for people who have it.

1. Please don't be offended by my response, because that is not my intent.

2. If we eradicate student debts for the people who currently have student debts, should we also fully refund everyone who have (already) paid off their student debts?

3. The people who have (already) paid off their student loans would actually be punished because they can never get that money refunded to them.

4. The reason I ask this question is to point out a certain unfairness to having all current student debts eradicated, while not refunding the students who already paid off their loans.

5. Expanding pell grants and improving financial aid programs would be examples of realistic solutions that are (fair).

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1. Okay. I guess I will bring up and discuss the "elephant in the room"

2. When we enter into a loan we are promising to repay that loan by the agreed upon terms of that loan.

3. That might be a student loan, mortgage loan, car loan, etc.

4. How is forgiving a student loan any different from forgiving a mortgage loan?

5. I'm pretty sure there would be millions of people who would like their 30 year mortgage loan to disappear and get a free house in the process.

6. It's fine to find out if the lender would work with a borrower due to hardship or some other reason.

7. It's fine if someone were to try and get a lower rate and refinance that student loan or mortgage loan.

8. I still believe that expanding pell grants and improving other financial aids and assistance are useful ways of subsidizing someone's college

1 Reply

@Real Music,

Exactly. A college education is an investment. Many people make investments of all sorts - sometimes with borrowed money. They usually pay off the loans - even if the investments do not perform as well as expected.

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There is a way to work out government payment of tuition...tied to some kind of public service after graduation. The military academies all work that way. Students there actually get paid to attend...and then are obligated to military service for a period of years after graduation.

We certainly should be doing that for medical schools and schools for lots of different technical educations...education in areas where there is a public need. All students who qualify for entry into medical or nursing schools, for instance, should also qualify for government payment of tuition...and incur a period of service upon graduation. This could be a win/win for medical students and for the public.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

I seem to remember hearing about this style being used in Europe a while back. It makes sense. We pay your education for four years, you work wherever we send you for four years. I like it.

2 Replies

@Mame,

Nursing and teaching degrees already have a program designed to pay for tuition if you agree to a 5-yr term in a low-income neighborhood.

It's the Library Science, Sports Management or Bassoon Playing degrees that may have difficulty in being placed.

1 Reply

@neptuneblue,

neptuneblue wrote:

It's the Library Science, Sports Management or Bassoon Playing degrees that may have difficulty in being placed.

ha ha ha Yeah, I get it

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@Mame,

Used to be how teacher training was done here in Oz…the government paid your fees and you were bonded to go to places they found it hard to get people to work in. Usually the country.

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This is Biden's America

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