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Monitoring Biden and other Contemporary Events

 
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 09:15 am
@izzythepush,
There was a programme called The Burke Special over here in the 70s.

It was a mash up of popular science and sociology.

One episode looked at newspaper headlines and looked at a bombing in London by the IRA that was front page.

Bombings in Northern Ireland were relegated to other news.

The message of the programme was that if we carried on the way we were going bombings in London would no longer be worthy of the front page.

Unfortunately we carried on for about twenty years before The Good Friday Agreement made significant changes.

That's where America is with gun violence.
Frank Apisa
 
  3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 09:24 am
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

There was a programme called The Burke Special over here in the 70s.

It was a mash up of popular science and sociology.

One episode looked at newspaper headlines and looked at a bombing in London by the IRA that was front page.

Bombings in Northern Ireland were relegated to other news.

The message of the programme was that if we carried on the way we were going bombings in London would no longer be worthy of the front page.

Unfortunately we carried on for about twenty years before The Good Friday Agreement made significant changes.

That's where America is with gun violence.


I will word this as carefully as possible, but I suspect many will find it off-base no matter what.

I am concerned about the mass shooting, just as any sane person would be, but if I were to pick the worst aspect of America right now, it would have to be that we spend considerable more per person on healthcare than any other developed country...and we get poorer result than almost all of them.

It seems reasonable to suppose the same factors are at work in the our healthcare issues as in our gun violence ones, but I cannot see what they are...other than moronic level complacency.
izzythepush
 
  3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 09:30 am
@Frank Apisa,
Those are the two aspects of American society that surprise the rest of the developed world.

I cannot understand the outright hostility towards UHC in some sectors of American Society.
revelette1
 
  3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 09:37 am
Quote:
Why do people use guns when they commit mass murder?

There's solid evidence that nearly half of all mass shootings are associated with suicide by perpetrator, or what they call “suicide by cop.” Guns are the most successful method of killing oneself.So, one main reason people choose guns is they want to die. In about 30% of mass shootings, perpetrators kill themselves with their own gun; about 10% are suicide by cop. However, while guns are the most effective method of suicide, they’re not as effective at killing a large number of other people. Mass murder committed with means other than firearms, such as bombing, arson, vehicles, even stabbings, is about two and a half times more deadly than mass murder committed with firearms.

Another reason people use firearms to carry out mass shootings (aside from availability) is our cultural romanticization of violence. As a result, the movie, television, music, and video game industries will have to play a role in any efforts to decrease gun assaults.

What tends to be the motivations behind mass shootings?

First, understand that mental illness as the primary cause of any mass murder, especially mass shooting, is uncommon. Half of all mass shootings are associated with no red flags—no diagnosed mental illness, no substance use, no history of criminality, nothing. They’re generally committed by middle-aged men who are responding to a severe and acute stressor, so they're not planned, which makes them very difficult to prevent. So, we must look much further upstream.

This is why it is important to consider ways to manage gun availability, for example. The yearly prevalence of the incidence of mass murder was stable at about 7 per billion people, or seven mass shootings for every billion people, between 1900 and about 1970. Then between about 1970 and 2019, the incidence increased by four times, so now mass shootings occur about 28 times per billion people around the world. One might say that this is because of the availability of guns in general, and automatic weapons, in particular, especially in the U.S. where these weapons became more available to the general population during this time period. Mass murder committed with means other than firearms also grew, but at a slightly slower rate. The other thing that one must consider is that most mass shootings are committed with non-automatic weapons, making them the weapons of choice, and supporting the notion that gun availability is a primary contributor to method of mass murder.

You have said that the media’s publishing personal details about the perpetrators encourages violent behavior and is harmful. Please explain.
If we’re talking about the mass shooters that we hear the most about, such as school shooters and other individuals who commit such public crimes, we have examined a number of these cases and are seeing a pattern. As opposed to most mass shooters, these perpetrators tend to be younger males who are often nihilistic, empty, angry, feel rejected by society, blame society for their rejection, and harbor a strong desire for notoriety. They want to make their mark on the world that will elevate them to the status they believe they are entitled to and deserve.

Sensationalized headlines, photographs, and breaking personal information about the shooters, victims, and acts themselves provide the notoriety perpetrators of mass shootings crave and can spark others to carry out similar acts. Refraining from publishing any personal information about mass shooters may be one of the easiest, quickest, and most effective interventions for decreasing mass shootings, especially school and other public shootings, which comprise about 10% of all mass shootings.



https://www.columbiapsychiatry.org/news/mass-shootings-and-mental-illness

I posted the above again because I am really struck by the link the study draws between sensationalized headlines having a factor in increased mass shootings.
0 Replies
 
revelette1
 
  4  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 09:40 am
@izzythepush,
I was against it because I couldn't see it ever passing. Look at how much trouble we had passing and keeping Obamacare. But, now after a few years of the Affordable Care Act, I see it hasn't gone far enough, and I think perhaps the public if not the republican leaders are ready to accept UHC. I know I am.
snood
 
  2  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 09:44 am
It is basically the same class of people - those who keep any meaningful gun legislation from happening, and those who resist UHC. It is people who turn a profit from unlimited gun manufacturing and marketing, and people who turn a profit from the strict control of how we can purchase healthcare. This class of people employs politicians and PR people who keep the stupid Republican masses in line by lying to them. They are told UHC is EVIL SOCIALISM, and they believe it. They are told that any attempts to put any limits on guns is THE FASCIST DEMOCRATS CONING TO DISARM AND ENSLAVE YOU and they believe it.

This is what the sane people of America are up against. It’s why we cannot waste time and energy trying to argue with them or win them over. They must be defeated at all levels of government. That’s all we’ve got.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 10:11 am
@revelette1,
I remember Lash commenting on a doctor's strike over here a few years ago and blaming it on the system.

(I know Lash is a law unto herself, but it demonstrates a key aspect of disinformation.)

The NHS is incredibly efficient, the problem is lack of funding and Tory corruption.

Tory peer Michelle Mone pocketed £2million from the sale of dodgy PPE gear of approx £30million. None of that has been paid back.

There are lots of strikes going on over here including NHS workers, none of them are protesting about the system, they are all protesting against funding.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 10:26 am
We have a similar situation over here with Brexit.

It was a self inflicted wound based on lies and disingormation, and nothing good has come of it.

Yet none of this will be an issue at the next election, Labour will not attack Brexit, but the way the Tories dealt with it.

Starmer will try a new approach which will make things better, but still no way near as good as they were when we were in the EU.

It may be an issue at the subsequent election around 2029, but I doubt it, it won't be until the one after that, and then it will be big.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:04 am
@revelette1,
revelette1 wrote:

Yes.

Quote:
Are people with mental health disorders more likely to commit mass shootings or mass murder?

The public tends to link serious mental illnesses, like schizophrenia or psychotic disorders, with violence and mass shootings. But serious mental illness—specifically psychosis—is not a key factor in most mass shootings or other types of mass murder. Approximately 5% of mass shootings are related to severe mental illness. And although a much larger number of mass shootings (about 25%) are associated with non-psychotic psychiatric or neurological illnesses, including depression, and an estimated 23% with substance use, in most cases these conditions are incidental.



Columbia University Department of Psychiatry


I didn’t say schizophrenia, I said mental illness.
Suicide by cop isn’t how a sane person commits suicide—and only a very small percentage of people who commit suicide can be considered mentally healthy.

Don’t always accept the premise.
Most mass murderers are mentally ill.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:08 am
So what do you expect us to do?

It's your country, your democracy, your vote.

You know what to do, but as a country you refuse to do anything about it.

Until its gun laws are in keeping with the rest of the developed world I don't intend to visit America at all so a visit to Snood's gaff is not on the cards at all.

I resent the attitude that expects us to go around in sackcloth and ashes mourning the deaths of innocent Americans when you won't do anything about it yourselves.

We're not to blame for your shootings.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:13 am
If the US

1. SHUTS DOWN businesses that don’t perform background checks.
2. Vigorously prosecutes parents or roommates of shooters who loaned guns or didn’t secure guns properly—or had knowledge of mentally ill family members who legally acquired fire arms
3. creates a background assessment that list all former cons, all people who’ve been noted as the aggressor in domestic violence cases, and all citizens who’ve received treatment for mental illnesses—including former military

shootings would plummet.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:21 am
But our govt doesn’t want shootings to plummet.
So they don’t address the problem.
They just grandstand after every event.
The families of mentally ill people cannot afford the care necessary for safety. The mentally ill roam the streets, becoming dangerous to themselves and our society.
Our corrupt govt intentionally allowed this situation to fester—so they can use it to disarm our populace and encroach on additional ‘freedoms’.

It’s intentional.
izzythepush
 
  6  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:26 am
@Lash,
I don't think this particular administration is responsible for the current gun laws.

It's republican policians who take money from the NRA, and Republican controlled states where the gun laws are most lax.

I'm sure there's some democrats who take money from the gun lobby but overall it's a right wing phenomenon.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:33 am
https://www.treatmentadvocacycenter.org/key-issues/violence/3626-serious-mental-illness-and-mass-homicide

SUMMARY

Studies of mass killings strongly suggest they began to increase in incidence in the *1980s, and that the incidence is increasing. The most comprehensive survey of mass homicides in the 20th century reported 73 such killings from 1990 to 1999. In 2017, nearly one incident meeting the federal government’s definition of “mass shooting” occurred each day. As to the percentage of mass homicides in which the perpetrator had an untreated serious mental illness, the answer varies based on how serious mental illness and mass killings are defined, the time period covered and other factors. In general, however, it appears that at least one third of mass killings are carried out by individuals with untreated serious mental illness, even when **narrowly defined.
_______________

*Reagan dumped institutionalized mentally ill people out in the streets or on ill-equipped families in the early 1980s.

**Defined realistically, and that percentage skyrockets.

This is our problem.


0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  4  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:34 am
@Lash,
Quote:
Most mass murderers are mentally ill.

This is what the right-wing gun zealots and the firearms industry want us to believe. Don't try to control the supply of guns and ammo – just make sure everyone's mentally stable. And then they'll fight any "red flag" law which seeks to remove guns from the homes of mentally disturbed individuals. Especially veterans.

Now, it's true; by definition one could say that any gun-wielder who would engage in the mass slaughter of innocent people is "mentally ill". But that's more of a moral judgment than a clinical diagnosis. Evil people can function very well in society. A mass shooting may be the result of rational deliberation. A mass murderer may very well weigh the likelihood of being caught or killed and deduce that the act is worth it.
Lash
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:38 am
@hightor,
The govt refuses to take the steps to stop gun violence because they want to disarm the populace.

They create the crisis and their solution is more encroachment against the peoples’ rights.

So, no. They should enforce the laws on the books already.
izzythepush
 
  5  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:42 am
@Lash,
Disarming the population is how you stop mass shootings.

What's your solution, more guns, and lies about how all shooters are mentally ill?
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  3  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:44 am
@Lash,
Quote:
So they don’t address the problem.

The "problem" is the Second Amendment.
Quote:
The govt refuses to take the steps to stop gun violence because they want to disarm the populace.

And what steps would those be? Do you really think it's realistic to "disarm" the people when there are 400 million guns in people's homes?
Quote:
Studies of mass killings strongly suggest they began to increase in incidence in the *1980s, and that the incidence is increasing.

There wouldn't be any correlation between this increase and the number and types of weapons being sold, would there?
blatham
 
  5  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:52 am
@hightor,
Quote:
Quote:
@Lash,
Quote:
Most mass murderers are mentally ill.


This is what the right-wing gun zealots and the firearms industry want us to believe.

Yes. Perhaps more accurately, it's what they want people to talk about rather than the correlation between gun ownership and deaths caused by the proliferation of gun not to mention that Right-wing extremists committed every ideologically driven mass killing identified in the U.S. in 2022, with an "unusually high" proportion perpetrated by white supremacists, according to a new report published Thursday. It's a distraction.


In a discussion with an American conservative who made this "mental illness is the cause, not guns" argument elsewhere recently, I made the obvious point that if such a correlation was the case, then it must be true that American citizens are many times more insane than citizens in any other western nation.
Lash
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 8 Apr, 2023 11:53 am
@hightor,
hightor wrote:

Quote:
So they don’t address the problem.

The "problem" is the Second Amendment.
Quote:
The govt refuses to take the steps to stop gun violence because they want to disarm the populace.

And what steps would those be? Do you really think it's realistic to "disarm" the people when there are 400 million guns in people's homes?
Quote:
Studies of mass killings strongly suggest they began to increase in incidence in the *1980s, and that the incidence is increasing.

There wouldn't be any correlation between this increase and the number and types of weapons being sold, would it?

Steps
https://able2know.org/topic/555216-622#post-7314578
0 Replies
 
 

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