0
   

We will be way better of without a government!

 
 
vikorr
 
  3  
Sat 15 Aug, 2020 07:45 pm
Palandre by default (ie default of absence of government), supports (the free reign, growth, or existence of):

1. Lawlessness (because laws require codification to work, which requires agreement. And they require enforcement)
2. Corruption (lack of corruption requires laws for even-handedness. And because without enforcement, corruption always flourishes)
3. Domestic Violence (because without laws it becomes acceptable, and without enforcement, very few people want to intervene)
4. Pedophilia (because there would not be investigators to track them down)
5. Exploitation of unskilled workers (this should be incredibly obvious)
6. Schooling only being for the elite (Because hundreds of millions of children would no longer go to State Schools, and many parents aren't capable of, or willing to, or have the time to teach their children to the required extent to make education useful)
7. No free health services
8. Environmental free for all by corporations
9. Suppression of small competitors by corporations (nothing to prevent them)
10. No workplace health and safety (and the unskilled workers will certainly not be able to pick and choose where they work)
11. No more building codes, no fire safety standards, no electrical standards etc
12. Many more, and larger ghettos (should be obvious from the list above)
13. No more aircraft engineering requirements, or inspection requirements
14. No more car safety standards
15. No more electrical safety standards for appliances
16. No more investigations or penalties for businesses/landlords who don't meet standards, or whose products cause deaths etc

etc...etc...etc

An ugly list, but all are quite literal outcomes of removing government. ... looks like a real utopian paradise.

Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 12:57 am
@vikorr,
Quote:
Palandre by default (ie default of absence of government), supports (the free reign, growth, or existence of):


What a nonsense, and you keep repeating it, despite I have told you a few times that we need no criminal organisation('government') for that! You are talking like it is good we have to pay the mafia so we will be protected. It is really insane wat you are doing I don't blame you for that, it is what years of indoctrination does with someone.

Would you support the mafia because they 'protect' you so very good?
Yeah, show the good stuff they do for us, that makes it all allright.
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 01:03 am
@vikorr,
Quote:
You do understand that Palandre has no answer for such questions?


But I have. Get rid of 'government'. Solve the problems in other ways.
It can be done and done better.
But, to be fair, not only get rid of 'government', but to get rid of the IDEA of 'authority' and/or 'government'.

Statist usually freak out and start getting nightmares when one tells them to get rid of 'government'. They kind of get in panic mode.

They don't see that that is just what it is is, a kind of hallucination of what could go wrong.

Well, they have got you, then, eh!?
0 Replies
 
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 01:23 am
And, again, 'government' /'authority' can't exist at all.

It is an illusion, a superstition.

Whatever one says, it still will be an illusion, a superstition.
Yes, even a very dangerous superstion.

I know it sounds strange if one hears this for the first time, but it is true.

0 Replies
 
mark noble
 
  1  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 03:50 am
@vikorr,
Absolutely, Vikorr.
He doesn't pay any attention, whatsoever, to societal dynamics - What any of us say, or alert him untoward.

A 'household' works best - When each and all its occupants share common ideals/accords/interests, and employ each occupant in their best-fitting role/s - One of which is 'overseership' (New word) of the group.

Not 'Governance', but 'representitive' based.

I have a feeling he means well.
Mark
vikorr
 
  2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 06:24 am
@Palandre,
Quote:
What a nonsense, and you keep repeating it, despite I have told you a few times that we need no criminal organisation('government') for that!
So you say, and yet you have never offered a workable alternative. You say there is one, but you never offer:
- specifics, nor
- how each specific replacement would work, nor
- why the unnamed persons you claim would do each specific function better would want to; nor
- why they would want to fork out their own money to 'do it better'.
- nor what qualifies them to do it better
If there is no workable alternative, then the one that works is the best method. Ie. If you can't offer & explain workable alternatives, don't blame others for not buying into your delusions.
vikorr
 
  1  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 06:26 am
@mark noble,
Quote:
I have a feeling he means well.
Mark
There's nothing to say otherwise.
0 Replies
 
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 07:51 am
@vikorr,
Quote:
So you say, and yet you have never offered a workable alternative. You say there is one, but you never offer:


Well, I have put it here before, but because it seems you don't read all my postings.(actually I think you lie a lot.)
But, actually, it isn't even needed here, because again, 'government' CAN NOT AND WILL NOT EXIST. It is an impossibility.
You don't really get that. I told you why.

But if you really really and very desperately need some, here it is:

https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1387709246l/7421908.jpg
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 07:57 am
@mark noble,
Quote:
He doesn't pay any attention, whatsoever, to societal dynamics - What any of us say, or alert him untoward.


I do pay attention and I even react on it. But it isn't that important.
Again, 'government'/ 'authority' can't exist.
So every argument about it being good or bad is of no use at all.
There is no 'government'/ 'authority' and the one who call themselves 'government' are nothing more then members of a criminal organisation.
Any socio-dynamics and whatever can't change this fact.
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 08:59 am
A short summary of the book mentioned above:

Quote:
Some great books are the product of a lifetime of research, reflection, and labored discipline. But other classics are written in a white heat during the moment of discovery, with prose that shines forth like the sun pouring into the window of a time when a new understanding brings in the world into focus for the first time.

''The Market for Liberty'' is that second type of classic, and what a treasure it is. Written by two authors-Morris and Linda Tannehill-just following a period of intense study of the writings of both Ayn Rand and Murray Rothbard, it has the pace, energy, and rigor you would expect from an evening's discussion with either of these two giants.

More than that, these authors put pen to paper at precisely the right time in their intellectual development, that period rhapsodic freshness when a great truth had been revealed, and they had to share it with the world. Clearly, the authors fell in love with liberty and the free market, and wrote an engaging, book-length sonnet to these ideas.

This book is very radical in the true sense of that term: it gets to the root of the problem of government and provides a rethinking of the whole organization of society. They start at the beginning with the idea of the individual and his rights, work their way through exchange and the market, expose government as the great enemy of mankind, and then-and here is the great surprise-they offer a dramatic expansion of market logic into areas of security and defense provision.

Their discussion of this controversial topic is integrated into their libertarian theoretical apparatus. It deals with private arbitration agencies in managing with disputes and criminality, the role of insurers in providing profitable incentives for security, and private agencies in their capacity as protection services. It's for this reason that Hoppe calls this book an ''outstanding yet much neglected analysis of the operation of competition.''


Have a good read, Vikorr !
mark noble
 
  2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 09:40 am
@Palandre,
How will 'we be better off without a government' - You now claim 'doesn't exist'?
I know they're a bunch of salesmen & many of them are crooked - So are many heads of state, heads of industry, commerce, education, science - So are millions of others from all walks of life.

In fact - I have yet to meet a completely honest human being.

So - What's your FIX for this?
Mark
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 09:52 am
@mark noble,
Quote:
I know they're a bunch of salesmen & many of them are crooked - So are many heads of state, heads of industry, commerce, education, science - So are millions of others from all walks of life.


So - What's your FIX for this?


Please explain why I have to fix this?????????????????

Quote:
In fact - I have yet to meet a completely honest human being.


That is a pity, I know quit a few.
mark noble
 
  2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 10:17 am
@Palandre,
You don't have to Fix anything.
But how do you intend to prove your OP?

Seriously though - I'm bored with this thread - And I have gained nothing of interest by participation hereat.

Have a lovely day
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  3  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 05:11 pm
@Palandre,
Quote:
But if you really really and very desperately need some, here it is:
You do realise that you are the one who is trying to sell your delusion to others? And not a single one of us is buying? I'm pointing out that a contributing factor to that is that you have no argument or evidence whatsoever for your delusions, thereby giving no one any reason to buy your delusion at all.

As for the book - as I said after the last shemozzle that you posted as 'evidence' (some video of a lecture, which I actually bothered to look at), you need to show you can think for yourself. You accuse others of being indoctrinated, but frankly:

- you wouldn't know if others are indoctrinated, because you can't offer, of your own accord, a logical argument....and as you won't understand why that is an issue...

- if you can't offer logical argument of your own accord (particularly one that looks at all sides of the issues), then you will have no clue if it is in fact you who is indoctrinated.

- And of course, if you can't bring yourself to acknowledge the good of government, then you show signs of being indoctrinated; and

- if you say some unknown entity can do <specific govt function> better, but won't ever, when challenged explain who, why, or how of your own accord....then you show signs of being indoctrinated

- If you can only acknowledge the bad of government (thereby admitting it exists), but call any good of government irrelevant saying it doesn't exist, and sticking to that hypocritical view...then you show signs of being indoctrinated.

So a book is useless. The evidence, to show that you can think for yourself, and are not indoctrinated, can only come from you. Frankly it appears to me that you have been projecting your fears and flaws onto others this whole time.
Palandre
 
  -3  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 08:16 pm
@vikorr,
Quote:
You do realise that you are the one who is trying to sell your delusion to others?


I am not trying to sell anything. Furthermore, it is only a delusion for people who are deeply indoctrinated in the religious belief of 'government'.
Quote:

And not a single one of us is buying?


Well, again, I an not selling.
And that 'none is 'buying' is only telling me how deeply and religiously people are attached to the religion of 'government'.
Yes, even more then to a 'normal' religion.

It is exactly as to be expected.

Quote:
you have no argument or evidence whatsoever for your delusions,

Nope, no delusion. The one with delusion is the one who thinks 'government'
is real.
I have given enough, but you are not able to see or graps it.

Have you read the book yet?
Palandre
 
  -2  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 08:19 pm
@vikorr,
Quote:
So a book is useless. The evidence, to show that you can think for yourself, and are not indoctrinated, can only come from you. Frankly it appears to me that you have been projecting your fears and flaws onto others this whole time.


lol. First you even haven't read the book. Secondly, I can't put the whole content of a book here, and you know that.
You are asking for things, I show you, then you deny. You are becoming cheap now, You aren't really interested at all.
And projecting my fears????? You are funny, the one who sees scary things if there is no 'government' is you. So, your last sentence is rather strange.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  3  
Sun 16 Aug, 2020 09:25 pm
@Palandre,
Quote:
I am not trying to sell anything.
Of course you are - you started a thread entitled "We will be way better off without a government". And every word you have said since backs up that you are trying to sell such.

Quote:
Have you read the book yet?

First you even haven't read the book. Secondly, I can't put the whole content of a book here, and you know that.
You do realise this a forum, rather than a book exchange club, right? And on forums people exchange ideas? So in case it wasn't utterly obvious in my last reply (and it should have been) - I'm not interested in reading your book. What I have been interested in, is whether or not you are capable of thinking for yourself. Linking a book doesn't show that you can think for yourself. Unfortunately, at every single turn, you provide evidence (in major avoidance, hypocrisy, and lack of logical argument etc) that you are not able to think for yourself on this topic.

Palandre
 
  -3  
Mon 17 Aug, 2020 02:47 am
@vikorr,
Quote:
Of course you are - you started a thread entitled "We will be way better off without a government". And every word you have said since backs up that you are trying to sell such.


lol, nope, I am not selling, I am telling.

Quote:
You do realise this a forum, rather than a book exchange club, right? And on forums people exchange ideas? So in case it wasn't utterly obvious in my last reply (and it should have been) - I'm not interested in reading your book. What I have been interested in, is whether or not you are capable of thinking for yourself. Linking a book doesn't show that you can think for yourself. Unfortunately, at every single turn, you provide evidence (in major avoidance, hypocrisy, and lack of logical argument etc) that you are not able to think for yourself on this topic.


Please, you asked for sources, I gave, you reject. It is a very cheap game you are playing.

But it is very simple. If you are really, really interested , you can read the mentioned book, it is free as pdf, so no problem there,
But the thing is, you are not very interested at all.
You just want to cling religiously to the religion of 'government".
And, that is ok with me. Everybody is free to choose. Even you. Wink
vikorr
 
  3  
Mon 17 Aug, 2020 05:49 am
@Palandre,
Telling is no different to selling when you want to spread your message - word games that end up with the same intent. Unfortunately for you no one is buying...but you can't seem to work out why. You lie to yourself and call the reason no one is buying it indoctrination...but that is just you talking to yourself in the mirror.

Quote:
Please, you asked for sources, I gave, you reject.
Care to quote where I asked for sources?

What I asked for, many times, was for your to provide:
- examples (which you never do)
- explain how (which you never do)
- explain why people would do what you say they would (which you never do)
- engage in your own logic (which you never do)
- provide evidence of your claims (which you never do)
- acknowledge the good done by govt (which you never do)
- not to engage in hypocrisy (which you continue to do)
- etc
I even gave you the format for an argument - and multiples times I have said the purpose of asking you to provide such - is to show that you can think for yourself. All you continue to do is is prove you can't think for yourself.

vikorr
 
  3  
Mon 17 Aug, 2020 06:05 am
@Palandre,
There are people in this world who are unable to cope with anything outside of the box they wish to reside in. Are you one of those? If so, that would explain this very, very odd behaviour that you have been exhibiting. Which would mean also that there is no point continuing this conversation, for either of us.
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.07 seconds on 12/23/2024 at 10:18:46