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94% OF YOU BELIEVE DIANA WAS MURDERED

 
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Fri 5 Oct, 2007 04:36 am
Sglass wrote:
Walter what is M16?


M16 is an American assault weapon

MI 6 is a branch of British Military Intelligence
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 8 Oct, 2007 07:34 am
hey just noticed the poll got 50 votes

thanks everyone

(no need for an inquest now!)
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 11 Oct, 2007 10:56 pm
At least, noq I understand what's all about ...

The Diana inquest is just another trip on the great British legal gravy train
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Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Oct, 2007 10:51 pm
Re: 94% OF YOU BELIEVE DIANA WAS MURDERED
Steve 41oo wrote:
...so runs the front page headline in today's Daily Express.

(Self proclaimed World's Greatest Newspaper).

as I cant find the website, story begins

The pressures facing detectives investigating the death of Princess Diana were illustrated yesterday when a Daily Express poll showed that 94 percent of people think she was murdered...
...................................................................................


That might be the percentage amongst respondents to a (British) Daily Express readership poll (Express targets mainly women) but I wonder what would be the percentage elsewhere?

How many of you think she was murdered, and why do you think that?


Good to see that the current A2K poll result shows over 60% believing it was just an accident.

It is very hard to imagine that 94% of Brits think she was murdered. If this is true, I renounce my status as anglophile with great sorrow. There's only so many disappointments I can take. Winston is rolling over in his grave.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Oct, 2007 02:39 am
I was careful how I posted this thread Finn

94% refered to you i.e. Daily Express readers who bothered to reply to a poll. It probably says much more about DE readers than it does about the death of Diana.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Oct, 2007 07:14 pm
Steve 41oo wrote:
I was careful how I posted this thread Finn

94% refered to you i.e. Daily Express readers who bothered to reply to a poll. It probably says much more about DE readers than it does about the death of Diana.


So you were, and I was careless in responding. It's a jocular post after all --- is it not?
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Oct, 2007 04:36 am
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
I was careful how I posted this thread Finn

94% refered to you i.e. Daily Express readers who bothered to reply to a poll. It probably says much more about DE readers than it does about the death of Diana.


So you were, and I was careless in responding. It's a jocular post after all --- is it not?
Not entirely. I dont think Diana's death was funny. And I would like to know the truth about what happened. Why if it was a simple accident has it taken 10 years and 3 coroners and still not come to the simple verdict accident? Where did the carbon monoxide come from in Henri Paul's blood? It was so high he should have been unconscious, not driving a car. Who gave the order to have Diana's body embalmed and why? What role did the white fiat uno play if any, and why has it never been found? What exactly were British secret service personnel doing in paris that night? How does one account for the catastrophic mix up in the number of blood samples taken from Henri Paul? Either it was 3 or 5, not 3 retrospectively changed to 5. What on earth did HM Queen mean when she said to Paul Burrell, "there are forces at work in this country about which we know nothing"? (On that latter point, I will of course be entirely satisfied by the verdict of accidental death, just give us a bloody verdict)
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Oct, 2007 04:35 pm
Steve 41oo wrote:
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
I was careful how I posted this thread Finn

94% refered to you i.e. Daily Express readers who bothered to reply to a poll. It probably says much more about DE readers than it does about the death of Diana.


So you were, and I was careless in responding. It's a jocular post after all --- is it not?
Not entirely. I dont think Diana's death was funny. And I would like to know the truth about what happened. Why if it was a simple accident has it taken 10 years and 3 coroners and still not come to the simple verdict accident? Where did the carbon monoxide come from in Henri Paul's blood? It was so high he should have been unconscious, not driving a car. Who gave the order to have Diana's body embalmed and why? What role did the white fiat uno play if any, and why has it never been found? What exactly were British secret service personnel doing in paris that night? How does one account for the catastrophic mix up in the number of blood samples taken from Henri Paul? Either it was 3 or 5, not 3 retrospectively changed to 5. What on earth did HM Queen mean when she said to Paul Burrell, "there are forces at work in this country about which we know nothing"? (On that latter point, I will of course be entirely satisfied by the verdict of accidental death, just give us a bloody verdict)


Oops - obviously not jocular.

No one's death is jocular (except maybe Elvis) but insisting it was murder is.
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Oct, 2007 08:57 pm
The Observer's Mary Riddell, a while back, on the Diana inquest...

Quote:
Room 73 at the Royal Courts of Justice, with its magnolia paint and Nasa technology, is not normally to be mistaken for a liposuction seminar. Nor is its distinguished current incumbent, Scott Baker, a subscriber to the Simon Cowell school of jurisdiction. Yet the first week of his impeccably run inquiry into the deaths of Diana, Princess of Wales, and Dodi al-Fayed has veered into details too intimate and plots too wild for lesser reality programmes to countenance.

Diana was on the pill, the inquest heard. The Queen had been about to abdicate, and Prince Charles may have hoped to marry his children's nanny, Tiggy Legge-Bourke. Or so Diana had told her lawyer, the late Lord Mishcon. Queen Tiggy, though, seemed hardly more bizarre than the conspiracy theories advanced by Mohamed al-Fayed in his 10-year campaign to prove a plot to kill Diana and Dodi.

In his assertion, the princess was about to become engaged to his son and bear his child. Her body was embalmed to hide her pregnancy. The driver of the car in which she died, Henri Paul, was sober, the blood tests fixed and the route from the Paris Ritz altered; all by M16. In a statement read out by the coroner, Fayed claimed: 'My son and Princess Diana were murdered by the British Security Services on the orders of Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.'

The coroner, who has already appeared sceptical over some of these allegations, seems poised in a limbo between Tudor England, when agents of the state could dispose of unwanted royal spouses with impunity, and Tomb Raider. Part computer game, part film noir, this is the strangest inquest of modern times. In Court 73, heat magazine and jurisprudence collide. [..]

But this is also the toughest of assignments for the fourth coroner appointed since Diana's death. The price of his hearing is estimated at £10m, for legal fees, simultaneous transcription, a silicon valley of technology and a website. Tomorrow's French trip, with photo-opportunities built in, will be the first time a jury has left British soil since a visit to Belarus during the trial of Anthony Sawoniuk, the only man to be convicted here of Nazi war crimes. [..]

Today's system [of coroner's investigations] is barely changed since 1836, when the rise of epidemics demanded better investigation into how many people were dying, and why. Loopholes, such as the one that allowed Harold Shipman to kill unnoticed by filling in his patients' death certificates, prompted a major shake-up.

The result, the Coroners' Bill of 2006, is expected to become law in this parliamentary session. That makes the Diana inquest not only the biggest showcase inquest of all time, but the last of its kind. In the existing system - the most dilapidated branch of justice - Diana gets an eminent former judge to investigate, at mad expense, conspiracy theories widely believed to exist only in the feverish fantasies of Mohamed al-Fayed.

Meanwhile, other families whose loved ones genuinely fell foul of the state wait for answers. The relatives of Jean Charles de Menezes, killed by police marksmen, have had to settle for a health and safety court case, being conducted quietly across London [..]. Some obscure victims of truly murky deaths may get a good coroner; others make do with a poorly-trained official of limited competence. [..]

Eric Metcalfe, director of human rights policy at the all-party parliamentary legal group Justice, says the cost of the Diana inquest is 'approaching absurdity, if not already there'. Deborah Coles, of Inquest, points out that families of children who die in custody have to wait, sometimes for years, for pitifully funded inquests. 'The rooms are shabby, and there is no private space for families huddled in with those who may be responsible for the relatives' deaths. Some coroners don't have computers or even photocopiers.'

Even Lord Falconer and Harriet Harman, the ministers responsible for the reform bill, admitted last year that the inquest system is 'fragmented, non-accountable, variable in its processes and its quality, ineffective in part [and] archaic in its statutory basis'. [..]

On the second day of the Diana hearing, an inquest opened in Yorkshire on Stephen Hart, aged 18, a schizophrenic patient who removed his clothes and stepped into the path of a car after walking out of a psychiatric ward. According to Inquest, he spent the many hours before his death wandering penniless in unfamiliar countryside, lonely, lost and trying vainly to find his way home.

His demise provoked no global outcry, no conspiracy theories, no whisperings about dark forces. But nor, disturbingly, is there any wave of public anxiety about those deaths where the state is clearly implicated. The plotlines that will unfold, over the next six months, in Court 73 do matter, less for any light they can shed on Diana's end than for what they say about the way we treat the deaths of others. [..]
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Oct, 2007 02:47 am
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
I was careful how I posted this thread Finn

94% refered to you i.e. Daily Express readers who bothered to reply to a poll. It probably says much more about DE readers than it does about the death of Diana.


So you were, and I was careless in responding. It's a jocular post after all --- is it not?
Not entirely. I dont think Diana's death was funny. And I would like to know the truth about what happened. Why if it was a simple accident has it taken 10 years and 3 coroners and still not come to the simple verdict accident? Where did the carbon monoxide come from in Henri Paul's blood? It was so high he should have been unconscious, not driving a car. Who gave the order to have Diana's body embalmed and why? What role did the white fiat uno play if any, and why has it never been found? What exactly were British secret service personnel doing in paris that night? How does one account for the catastrophic mix up in the number of blood samples taken from Henri Paul? Either it was 3 or 5, not 3 retrospectively changed to 5. What on earth did HM Queen mean when she said to Paul Burrell, "there are forces at work in this country about which we know nothing"? (On that latter point, I will of course be entirely satisfied by the verdict of accidental death, just give us a bloody verdict)


Oops - obviously not jocular.

No one's death is jocular (except maybe Elvis) but insisting it was murder is.
I'm not insisting it was murder Finn. Just insisting on due process of law, and examination of some of the questions I listed in order to come to a verdict. I'll accept any verdict. Just for the point of argument, would you accept a verdict of unlawful killing? Or would you insist the jury is joking?
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 24 Oct, 2007 04:39 pm
Come up for air steve

I didn't suggest you personally are contending it was murder.

I do, nevertheless, find it amusing that there are still people who do, but then I find it amusing that there are people who believe aliens have been visiting earth and taking samples of cattle rectums.

I do hope the poll you cited is not representative of the larger UK opinion though.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Oct, 2007 02:27 am
The 94% figure was a private poll for the Daily Express. It certainly doesnt reflect nationwide opinion. But I posted this thread because that figure was shocking in itself.

There are three factors in this case which will never go away. Diana died young and died pretty and famous. She was treated appallingly by the family she married into....(perhaps not entirely their fault, they are pretty dysfunctional). Her death was embarrassingly convenient for the Royals and the Establishment, who dreaded her starting a rival "royal"/superstar dynasty with someone else.

Its not surprising that many people have put 2 and 2 together and come to a certain conclusion. And its not helped by the inordinate delay and departure of coroners who read themselves into the case. It was supposed to be a straighforward accident. People like me just want a verdict "accident" then we can collectively heave a sigh of relief and start conspiracy theories about something else Wink.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Oct, 2007 04:36 am
The rushed embalming was odd. They've got no fridges in French morgues?
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Oct, 2007 05:21 am
All conspiracy websites deal with that.

Authorisation to embalm the body came on the official side from the police (because the crash happened early in the morning), and the final decision was taken by Diana's personal secretary, Michael Gibbins, and Colin Tebbutt, a former royal protection officer who was working as a security consultant for the princess.

At least that's what the jury has been told.


Actually, Lord Stevens, had already spent endless time and millions of pounds in investigating, and had produced a 700-page report. He found out - that this was an accident.

But whatever verdict by the inquest, it will neither satisfy Mohamed al-Fayed nor millions of Diana-conspiracy-theories-followers.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 25 Oct, 2007 10:17 am
Steve 41oo wrote:
The 94% figure was a private poll for the Daily Express. It certainly doesnt reflect nationwide opinion. But I posted this thread because that figure was shocking in itself.

There are three factors in this case which will never go away. Diana died young and died pretty and famous. She was treated appallingly by the family she married into....(perhaps not entirely their fault, they are pretty dysfunctional). Her death was embarrassingly convenient for the Royals and the Establishment, who dreaded her starting a rival "royal"/superstar dynasty with someone else.

Its not surprising that many people have put 2 and 2 together and come to a certain conclusion. And its not helped by the inordinate delay and departure of coroners who read themselves into the case. It was supposed to be a straighforward accident. People like me just want a verdict "accident" then we can collectively heave a sigh of relief and start conspiracy theories about something else Wink.
Such as the murder of Dr David Kelly. Heard George Galloway (yes him) say it was Britain's Watergate this morning.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:42 am
and now the Guardian reports

Quote:
Mohamed Al Fayed will today seek permission for a judicial review to force Prince Philip to give evidence into the deaths of his son, Dodi, and of Diana, Princess of Wales.

He also wants the Queen to be asked questions arising from the evidence, although he does not want her to appear in person.

Fayed has accused Philip of being "a Nazi". He has alleged that Dodi and Diana were murdered in a conspiracy initiated by the royal family, authorised by Tony Blair and executed by the security services and photographers.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:52 am
Lord Justice Scott Baker had ruled that it was not expedient to call Prince Philip and that the Queen should not be asked to answer questions.
His ruling stated that "neither step" would "further the inquest process".



The latest legal move, if successful, could prolong the inquest, which had been drawing to a close as the last few witnesses were being heard.

Quote:
However, BBC Royal Correspondent Daniela Relph said Mr Al Fayed's legal team "are particularly keen to stress that they do not want this to be perceived in any way as a delaying tactic" and "do not anticipate that it will cause any delay".

"They say that they believe the Duke of Edinburgh and the Queen have information which they alone can give this inquest," she said.

She added that Mr Al Fayed's team "believe they have a valid legal argument", adding that "the Duke of Edinburgh is a subject of the crown, just like you and me".
BBC
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2008 09:59 am
Judge says no evidence royals plotted to kill Diana

Quote:
Scott Baker set out the possible verdicts the jury could reach, but stressed: "It is not open to you to find that Diana and Dodi were unlawfully killed in a staged accident."

He said possible verdicts included unlawful killing through gross negligence either by Henri Paul, by the paparazzi pursuing the princess' car, or by both.

Other possibilities were accidental death, or an open verdict if the 11-member jury felt there was insufficient evidence to support any substantive verdict.

"Whatever you may think about motives or alleged hostility to Diana, they cannot be used to prove that something untoward happened that night in Paris," the judge said.



I guess a lot of apologies are owed to the Royals at this point.

Who's going to be stand-up about it?
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2008 03:09 pm
ehBeth wrote:
Judge says no evidence royals plotted to kill Diana

Quote:
Scott Baker set out the possible verdicts the jury could reach, but stressed: "It is not open to you to find that Diana and Dodi were unlawfully killed in a staged accident."

He said possible verdicts included unlawful killing through gross negligence either by Henri Paul, by the paparazzi pursuing the princess' car, or by both.

Other possibilities were accidental death, or an open verdict if the 11-member jury felt there was insufficient evidence to support any substantive verdict.

"Whatever you may think about motives or alleged hostility to Diana, they cannot be used to prove that something untoward happened that night in Paris," the judge said.



I guess a lot of apologies are owed to the Royals at this point.

Who's going to be stand-up about it?



I do not think any process of law, logic or empirical elucidation exists which is capable of altering the opinions of a diehard conspiracy theorist.

The conspiracy becomes an organism capable of assimilating and using as fuel any substance, especially any that seems reasonably certain to destroy it.

In this case, the legal process will simply be assumed to form part of the conspiracy.


Wotcha bet I'm right?
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2008 03:59 pm
I think you're right.

I don't expect the conspiracy fans to apologize, though I think they should.
0 Replies
 
 

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