What's up with major designer brands and other companies making RACIST clothes, other goods and ads?

@izzythepush,

Some people WANT to misunderstand others so badly that no amount of precise wording will ever help. They will always get lost because such is their wish. Who would I be to try and deprive them of the pleasures of confusion, conflation and approximation?.. :-)

According to you, calling a "white" man "monkey" cannot possibly be racist, while calling a "black" man such is always racist. On the contrary, my policy is to NOT take people's ethnic background into consideration when I write to them. So I write to a Jew just the same way as I write to a Goy, to a "white" man as to a "black" man, etc. Doing it any other way would be racist, in my book.

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@Olivier5,

Don't talk rubbish. You think your attitudes are superior to others so you belittle them.

You have no idea what it's like to be black, so before you start accusing people of misunderstanding things maybe you should think how you'd feel.

White football players don't get bananas thrown at them or monkey chants yelled at them when they're on the ,pitch. Black players do, and it's a long worn out racist theme of making them less than human.

It's not racist to call a white man a monkey because white men haven't been subject to that particular form of abuse.

I understand perfectly, you may kid yourself that you're being out there and daring by refusing to treat other races decently, but you're just being racist.

You know that anyway, you just don't like people pointing it out.

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@izzythepush,

If thinking that makes you happy, be my guest. But don't forget that your own anti-Frenchism is a form of racism as well.

Also at some point, you may want to think about the following issue: how one can possibly and objectively tell the difference between a "white" and a "black" man, when there are millions of shades of skin color? Where do you draw the line between the "colored" and the "uncolored", when we are all, objectively, somewhat colored?

Nobody is actually white or black objectively. We are all somewhat colored and mixed. Races do not actually and objectively exist.

So how is one supposed to tell if it's okay to make a monkey joke on person X, if telling that depends on the person's race, and there's no such thing as an objective race?

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@Olivier5,

It's about what's decent, and that's something you'll never be. This is no different from when you defended that grubby little publication Charlie Hebdo for publishing a picture of a black female government minister as a monkey.

You can pretend all you want, it's not radical, chic or thinking outside the box it's just racist.

What would make me happy is if racists like you dropped the mealy mouthed justifications and stopped using racist language altogether.

You may be in denial, I'm not.

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

If thinking that makes you happy, be my guest. But don't forget that your own anti-Frenchism is a form of racism as well.

Also at some point, you may want to think about the following issue: how one can possibly and objectively tell the difference between a "white" and a "black" man, when there are millions of shades of skin color? Where do you draw the line between the "colored" and the "uncolored", when we are all, objectively, somewhat colored?

Nobody is actually white or black objectively. We are all somewhat colored and mixed. Races do not actually and objectively exist.

So how is one supposed to tell if it's okay to make a monkey joke on person X, if telling that depends on the person's race, and there's no such thing as an objective race?

So, when football fans throw bananas on the pitch at black players they're not doing it because of their race?

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@InfraBlue,

Racist people tend to believe in races, that's a fact. But I don't agree with them.

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@izzythepush,

"Decent" is just as subjective as "white" or "black" when applied to a human being. What's decent to you may be indecent to me.

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@Olivier5,

Racist people use racist language and sometimes they spout a load of bollocks about not being able to see race.

When did the French and English become separate races? I must have missed that.

I'm not anti French because I refuse to swallow your bollocks or pay deference to your fragile little ego.

If anyone's anti French it's you. You're the one who insists on acting like some outdated garish stereotype.

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@izzythepush,

And sometimes, a2kers use accusations of racism tactically, just to tar an opponent who is not actually racist... In doing so they trivialize racism.

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Racist people tend to believe in races, that's a fact. But I don't agree with them.

The point is they do these acts as racist gestures. These acts aren't meaningless. That you don't believe in races is immaterial. Likewise, to use racist metaphors against people of that race is, at the very least obtuse and insensitive, and at worst deliberately racist.

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@Olivier5,

There's nothing tactical about it. I pointed out your use of racist language to another member. You could have said sorry, didn't realise, wasn't thinking, didn't mean to cause offence, something like that and moved on.

Arrogant as always, you then justified your racism and claimed not to see race because you're inherently superior.

Sounds pretty racist to me. And you brought it on yourself so stop whining.

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Racist people tend to believe in races, that's a fact. But I don't agree with them.

I don't know you enough but you sound like one of those disingenuous douchebags who claim they don't see color when in fact... they're using their vile behavior against others (and seizing what they see as a loophole to escape ... being called a racist).

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@InfraBlue,

I have no idea what Goldman's "race" is, ie what he self-identify as, if any.

I agree that racist people exist. My question was not about that. It was about how it is possible for an antiracist to apply the concept of race, one that is foundamentally irrational, stems from racist thinking, and has only a meaning within a racist frame of reference.

To me, an antiracist should treat everybody the same, logically, or at leadt try to do so, rather than codify certain ways of speaking as appropriate for "whites" but not for "blacks" or vice versa. I see that latter idea as dangerous, as entrenching racism.

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

I have no idea what Goldman's "race" is, ie what he self-identify as, if any.

You are so full of ****. From the opening post at the beginning of the thread.

JGoldman10 wrote:

I'm an African American. If you can't respect your customers, you shouldn't be in business. Seriously.

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@tsarstepan,

I do see skin color, if that's the question. It's just that I know that it's skin-deep, that it's just one physical characteristic among millions, that below the darkest skin, are bones with the same color than mine, and blood equally red than mine. Also I have lived in Africa and Sia long enough to know for a fact that those people you classify as "black" see themselves as belonging to very different ethnic groups. I know some people whith very dark skin who are considered "white" (eg the saed in Sahel) while some other people whose skin is very light but are classified as "black".

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@izzythepush,

Alright, i should have read the OP better. Sorry about that.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

There's nothing tactical about it.

Thanks for the laugh.

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@Olivier5,

That's your ego and paranoia talking. You're not that important, I'd rather not have anything to with you at all. When you, or anyone uses racist language I'll point it out.

That's all it is, I'm not waiting for cracks to appear in your armour so I can jump on you. Your armour went to the scrapheap years ago, and you don't need tactics when you're shooting fish in a barrel.

You said something racist. I thought it may have been inadvertent so I pointed it out. Only after you continued to justify your use of racist language did I call you a racist.

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@izzythepush,

Yes, you did call me a racist. And then I called you a racist too. So I guess we're even...

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

People get killed, raped, and robbed every single day. Hundreds of them, if not thousands. We are making the climate unlivable for our children and grandchildren... Meanwhile, all you've found to get angry about is a couple of sweaters? You must be the funniest monkey in the jungle.

Who said I was angry? I was questioning the integrity of the bigwigs at the designer clothing companies who produced the sweater and the hoodie and the ad featuring the hoodie.

If you have an ad featuring a little Black kid wearing something that says "monkey" on it, people would construe that as RACIST.

I don't know if you're using the term "monkey" like some kind of racial or ethnic slur, pejorative, appellation or epithet, but if you are, that's OFFENSIVE. I indicated in the beginning of this thread that "African American" is my ethnicity. Meaning I am an American that has Sub-Saharan African ancestry.

It's more accurate and correct to say there is more than one CULTURE of people. RACE is a SOCIAL construct.

1 Reply

What's up with major designer brands and other companies making RACIST clothes, other goods and ads?

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