Intelligent Design Theory: Science or Religion?

@Arella Mae,

Arella Mae, I can't speak for farmerman, but I truly believe you are a very gentle lady who doesn't have a mean bone in your body.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

I wish that were true C.I. but I can get pretty mean and I end up realizing it and have to apologize and get up on that horse and try not to fall off again. Thank you for the kind words. They are much appreciated.

1 Reply

@Arella Mae,

When you understand that you have to apologize, that's a good sign of what I said.

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@cicerone imposter,

My post disappeared. But I responded that is probably one of the kindest things ever said about me. I am truly touched.

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If there is intelligent design by a god, well I can only see two ways it could have happened.

(1) A "god" created everything and controls everything. (This is your basic religious view, is it not.)
(2) A "god" created everything and then let it find it's own path.

If (1) is right then "god" is one harsh bastard to torture his creations as he does when if he is so powerful he could have created a utopia for them or just have sent them straight to heaven & bypassed all the pain & suffering. So if (1) is right, then "god" must be a sadist.

If (2) is right, then "god" just rolled the dice and said c'est la vie, he's sitting somewhere maybe smoking a cigar & saying to himself "Whatever".

So he's either a bastard or doesn't give a **** one way or the other.
So WHY oh WHY do some people worry so much about him.

I know the "god" squad will disagree or even be offended, but it's pretty basic, if there is intelligent design then it's either (1) or (2), there is no (3).
Or I suppose you could go with the "god acts in mysterious ways" line, but that still comes under (1).

I know I'll kick myself for getting involved in this crap.

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@eurocelticyankee,

but, but, but,...who created god? If god existed before anything, where did he come from? How long did he live before creating all this watchamacallit? Did time and space exist before?

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@cicerone imposter,

Not my point, "god" could be a scientist in some other reality, or Jabba the Hut,
either one could be responsible for intelligent design.
My point is, IF there is intelligent design then what I said, stands.
I'm not saying there was intelligent design.
I'm just commenting on the designer if there was one.

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@eurocelticyankee,

Quote:

A "god" created everything and then let it find it's own path

.
Then we wouldnt call it Intelligent Design, it would just be theistic evolution. Thats been sort of an "Argument"for most
Christians for a century

Quote:

I know I'll kick myself for getting involved in this crap.

That would be an example of punctuated equilibrium

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@farmerman,

So what you're saying is someone with intelligence has never
designed something and then let it run it's own course.

Remember you're on a computer saying this. Wink

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@eurocelticyankee,

Now, you're saying a man created everything? Well, come to think of it, that's not too far-fetched.

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@cicerone imposter,

No I'm not saying anybody or "god" for that matter created the universe,
I'm just asking those who do believe in intelligent design why they would
worship such a harsh or callous designer.

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@eurocelticyankee,

To save Arella Mae I'll reply for her , as she would have to be the nice's, sweetest and devote Christian worshiper I know and if she can answer a Gody question, having all her deep unswerving biblically knowledge --- she will will tell you, Wait for it ----- "her God works in mysterious ways". She has yet to explain how her God mysteriousness works though, though it seems to work for her.... I wonder why.

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@tenderfoot,

That's why I knew I'd regret getting involved, because I
don't like insulting people or their beliefs and I know this
woman is a good person.
But I believe you can be a good person with or without
religion, but as the saying goes "to each their own".

So I'll bow out and may your god go with you.

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@tenderfoot,

Just so's ya know . . . that's not biblical. "God moves in a mysterious way his wonders to perform" is from a poem by William Cowper.

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@eurocelticyankee,

Quote:

So what you're saying is someone with intelligence has never
designed something and then let it run it's own course.

I love it when people, talikng about a single issue like evolution, try to admix it with invalid examples.
What I didstinctley said was that your observation was the basis for "theistic evolution" a very popular "theory" of various Christian sects in the early to mid 20th century.

A computer hardly fits "Intelligent design" conditions, specially since most "APPS" and structural changes(including software) generally anticipate needs,
Evolution , based on all the evidence so far, is kind of a lock step adaptation to environmental and geologic events . Dinosaurs werent really a bad idea, they fit relly well in theoir times, but, due to several issues that occured in the environment, they couldnt succesfully carry on after these events happened, whereas 3 of the available mammal orders and most birds, as well as ornithischian reptiles fish and most all arthropods could. SUbject to the vagaries of environmental changes, evolution doesnt appear to be following any base plan that could conjur up a belief in ID or theirstic evolution.

In my arena, we just dont recognize that a god was actually needed so not very much time is wasted in conjuring him up for a paper.

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@eurocelticyankee,

I carry on discussions with Arella Mae and I dont think Ive been guilty of walking on eggshells with her. SHes not made of sugar so shell melt. True "Respect" for peoples beliefs requires only letting em recognize that you are trying to disgaree without being purposely insulting. (That does rear its head too often though, and Im probably as guilty as anyone).

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@Arella Mae,

CATCHING UP FROM THE LAST PAGE

Quote:

I wasn't trying to be smart alecky or anything. You addressed me and I felt it was right to respond. I am sorry if I offended you. I would not intentionally do that.

I understood your position. I dont share it , but I inderstand it.
We see the answer to that question in two separate arenas. You are certain that a god was involved, I say that evidence doesnt support any such conclusion.

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Arguments from design are either a product of human conceit (nothing exists unless it was created, which we know by analogy because we, too, are creators), or are a product of human incomprehension (we only understand things to be creations, because we only ever see new things when we create them).

If you turn on a computer (leaving aside the issue of applications and hardware modifications), it doesn't run eternally thereafter, because either you have to keep paying the electric bill, or the battery needs to be recharged (which once again calls for paying the electric bill). Furthermore, computers are not self-repairing nor self-replicating. Nature, however, is filled with plants and animals which both repair themselves (replace cells) and replicate themselves. Analogies derived from the example of human creations fall down on those two issues.

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@tenderfoot,

tenderfoot wrote:

To save Arella Mae I'll reply for her , as she would have to be the nice's, sweetest and devote Christian worshiper I know and if she can answer a Gody question, having all her deep unswerving biblically knowledge --- she will will tell you, Wait for it ----- "her God works in mysterious ways". She has yet to explain how her God mysteriousness works though, though it seems to work for her.... I wonder why.

I am sorry you feel such comments are necessary.

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

CATCHING UP FROM THE LAST PAGE

Quote:
I wasn't trying to be smart alecky or anything. You addressed me and I felt it was right to respond. I am sorry if I offended you. I would not intentionally do that.
I understood your position. I dont share it , but I inderstand it.
We see the answer to that question in two separate arenas. You are certain that a god was involved, I say that evidence doesnt support any such conclusion.

Yep.

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Intelligent Design Theory: Science or Religion?

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