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Intelligent Design Theory: Science or Religion?

 
 
spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 01:46 pm
c.i. wrote-

Quote:
Then, why do you keep returning?


It isn't on your behalf c.i. I can assure you of that.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 01:55 pm
But I do continue to return on your behalf; you're a hoot!
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Joe Nation
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:01 pm
Quote:
I don't have any bloody beliefs you silly moo.


Joe(Ah. A clear mind. No. An empty one then.)Nation
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farmerman
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:05 pm
Chinese New YEars resolution. Spendi is dead to me. I miss his posts.They are funny, not ha ha though.
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wandeljw
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:17 pm
http://www.businessinnovationinsider.com/Wallace%20Gromit.jpg

(me and spendi when we were still talking to each other)
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TheCorrectResponse
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:18 pm
Spendi...man's best friend!?

I'd like to think NOT!
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:20 pm
They are the same thing really Joe.

If your mind is full it is likely to be with jolly robbins.

I wrote a song once. A long song. It had this in it.

"I took a quick trip down to Treatment Town
Passed the library, shops and all
I'm strapped to a bed by a smiling nurse
And plugged into the wall.

A fast dream takes place right there and then
Fire works in the dark, and the Dead
The sky falls off and my kneecaps chime
An' I wake up with an empty head."

It's called Happy Landings.

It's 20 years old. I've moved on since then.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:22 pm
You may "think" you've moved on since then, but that's highly questionable.
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:31 pm
c.i.-

Where are the photos from your Hawaii gig?

I like seeing pics of A2Kers.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 02:35 pm
Embarrassed

http://www.able2know.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=111160&start=0&sid=4fd703ea3ed555a90cb6e8615042aea7
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 03:07 pm
Well I don't think that lot much good. Scenery is not as interesting as people. We have scenery here. When scenery becomes interesting merely because it's not here you have lost the plot in my view.

The only one showing the A2kers doesn't identify people. And they don't look too cheerful I must say. They look like they are all holding their dominion.

Would it be too much to expect for you to put names to the faces c.i.?

It's the pic where you are all waiting for a boat I think it was.
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 03:15 pm
Who are the ladies at meat? From left to right.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 05:51 pm
From memory: Sglass, Charlotte, Mrs yitwail, and Mrs ci.
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 06:14 pm
Well I hope they enjoyed the nosh.
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 06:21 pm
but, of coarse!
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 06:36 pm
"Coarse" is perfect there see eye.

Chomping through the nutrient bed is quite a coarse activity when you examine it with keen scientific empiricism.

It struck me from the pics that English might not be your first language. Is that the case or not?
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 06:39 pm
American English; with all the changes since I first attended school at the age of five. I still garble the grammar - but not as bad as your English English.
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spendius
 
  1  
Fri 22 Feb, 2008 07:06 pm
I am aware that my English is not up to the standards I would like it to be.

But I do try to improve. It never enters my head that I knew anything worth a blow when I left the educational system.

I have known too many teachers to delude myself in that regard.
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wandeljw
 
  1  
Sat 23 Feb, 2008 08:57 am
FLORIDA UPDATE

Quote:
Our position: It would be a mistake for legislators to dilute evolution decision
(Orlando Sentinel Editorial, February 23, 2008)

The state Board of Education approved the teaching of evolution in Florida schools after a long public debate and embarrassing political compromise that angered Darwin's supporters and failed to satisfy his detractors.

It's time now for the bureaucrats and politicians to get out of the way and let teachers do their job. That job is to educate Florida's school children about the process of evolution, which is the central principle of biology.

But don't hold your breath.

Evolution's opponents -- the same folks the Department of Education were hoping to mollify by adding the words "the scientific theory of" before the word "evolution" in the standards -- now look to the Legislature to further weaken this important change in Florida's curriculum.

The Trojan horse at the science classroom door is the call for an "academic freedom" law. Such a law is said to allow teachers to "engage students in a critical analysis" of evolution. What's wrong with that?

Plenty.

The essence of science is to inquire, observe and challenge concepts. Science teachers will encourage their students to ask questions about evolution and they'll have scientifically valid answers for them. The scientific method has led evolution to be widely accepted as fact.

This academic-freedom law is just an attempt to sneak creationism through the schoolhouse's back door. Creationist theology that life on Earth is so complex it must have resulted through God's intelligent design belongs in a comparative religion course, not in a science class.

And to couch this in the noble principle of academic freedom is shameful. Would you defend a math teacher who fervently believes 2+2 = 5 and offers that as an alternative theory?

In teaching evolution, and Charles Darwin's thoughts on natural selection, the new science curriculum challenges students and encourages critical thinking.

Lawmakers should butt out.

The protracted debate over evolution was embarrassing enough. Florida's old science standards were a national joke that held the state's students back for years while children in other states excelled. And, yet, there was so much resistance to this basic scientific concept that the Board of Education felt the need to pander to evolution's deniers.

All this in the nation's fourth-largest state, where leaders are desperately trying to build a new economy around life sciences and research. Imagine the impact a veritable monkey trial on the floor of the Florida House of Representatives would have on efforts to attract research dollars.

Lawmakers can't let that happen. Even with the last-minute compromise, the new science curriculum is a huge improvement. Leave it alone.
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spendius
 
  1  
Sat 23 Feb, 2008 01:17 pm
Seems like the editor of the Orlando Sentinel can't leave it alone.

The temptation for effort free pontification has obviously been too strong.

What does "widely accepted" mean in view of 90% of Americans rejecting atheism.

Quote:
The essence of science is to inquire, observe and challenge concepts.


If you say that in the nerve muscles of a dissected frog the transmitter substance, acetylcholine, acts by increasing the permeability of the subsynaptic membrane to cations so that sodium ions flow inward and potassium ions flow outward so that the end plate current is the sum of the currents due to sodium and potassium ion flow you have said no more than that the traffic is passing along the freeway. And if you don't ask why you are left with having to say that the traffic is passing because the traffic is passing.

The editor has no more idea of the why of this biological process than anybody else has or ever will have. It is a mere description of what we can observe. And it might look very different in another language.

So to rule out an intelligent designer as the cause is to leave the question unanswered and pretend it has been answered by the expedient of words not so self-evidently stupid as those used in relation to the traffic but just as stupid nevertheless.

Blinding the kids with science in other words in the service of promoting atheistic materialism (the wedge) probably for a control freakery purpose or a straight cash transfer which is what the editor gets by sticking easily written drivel on the reverse side of an advert for the magical artefacts known collectively as lingerie for which he will have no explanation regarding the cause either.

If Florida is backward it might be a safer place to look for the cause in the editor of a prominent newspaper insulting his reader's intelligence and addressing them on the assumption that they are a "national joke". And if he hasn't assumed that he must be a national joke himself and if he has assumed it a manipulative cynic.

And he must have deliberately set his face against the overwhelming evidence that a fundamental characteristic of being human is to ask, demand even, and seek for the first cause and that it is that characteristic which is the energy source of scientific enquiry.

He is inviting us to divest ourselves of the essence of our humanity and be satisfied with the explanation that the traffic flows because the traffic flows. To become automata. And they are very easily managed and control freaks want nothing less. Ever.

And to run science into the buffers of self-congratulating, pompous twits who have got EHS (exploding head syndrome) who are only pretending they have answers to the real questions in order to expand their fiefdom and rule the world.

Once you admit that the only explanation we can think of for final causes of every physico/chemical event is to posit an intelligent designer or that there is no cause, and we have seen that the latter is not possible if we are to retain our humanity, ( AIDs-ers excepted of course), you might be able to get on with teaching the kids some science and an appreciation of the wonders of the design. There can be no wonders in meaninglessness.

And there are so many physico/chemical events taking place in your body reading this post that they asymptote with infinity.

What is this debate all about. I don't give a damn if the world is only a week old. Faustians go forward with what they've got.

It is a battle between two factions (circulating elites) for a bigger slice of the cake which, though that is another seemingly unalterable human characteristic, has been agreed should not use kids as a pitch to play on except, as evolution demands because more kids can be made and more parents can't, in famines and suchlike catastrophes.

Which leads to the philosophical question, has American greed reach such a level that Americans, some I mean, exhibit symptoms of famine in the midst of plenty and they assuage their guilt by overbearing displays of "love" towards kids again using them to make invidious comparisons in the realm of conspicuous consumption.

(See the GB Shaw quote earlier.)

But I will accept that a nation of automata might be the evolutionary way forward as well.

Huxley posed the question of whether the luxuries of his Brave New World were a good swap for the loss of humanity as we know it and Orwell never really engaged himself with the benefits to the controlling elite in his vision.
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