Intelligent Design Theory: Science or Religion?

You seem to start with the "middle of the movie" without wondering where your living chemicals came from


Farmerman makes a great unanswered point.

Not that you would recognize it but that's just another sweeping statement by farmer in an attempt to dismiss my argument that he has no answer for. You are welcome to step up to the plate and help him out.

Other classic farmer lines are:

'Your thinking is too one dimensional'.
'The earlier forms of simpler life that later evolved have been erased by time. (An excuse for having no evidence of its existence)
'You are ignoring all the science showing how it happened.'
'All your theories are based on religious beliefs.'

These are just some of the signs of his intellectual dishonesty.
I don’t know why I even bother with him. Mostly boredom I think.

Why do you want this?

What are you trying to achieve?

Christians who accept evolution and the Big Bang see a supreme being with the foresight and ability to create everything with one flash.

You seem to want a less intelligent supreme being, one who clearly isn't smart enough to do the above, but instead has to make everything by hand in some workshop because as far as supreme beings go he ain't all that.

And don't start all that crap about id not being about God, you have a real brassneck accusing fm of intellectual dishonesty.

I just want to see a reasonable answer.

Everybody but you is out of their depth.

Even in this generation of the universe, it took the Eternal, who has neither beginning or end, over thirteen billion years before he could even think of creating modern human beings.

Do you even begin to realise the groundwork that must be established first, in order for the creation and sustainability of humans on this earth?

And I suppose a few billion years in the eternal life, which has neither beginning or end, could be seen by the Eternal, as no more than a 'FLASH' in his eternal life.

English Standard Version. 2 Corinthians 5: 1; For we know that if the tent that is our earthly home is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

So the red blood cells and skin tissue that they have found on dinosaur bones are billions of years old?……what about the common sense reasoning that that conclusion could be total nonsense……..after all man keeps changing his mind over the years as to timescales, that’s how sure he is.……Common sense would tell anyone that these creatures could have been around in our recent history as a possibility.

Also,if there is a God who are you to say what he can and can’t do?…..come on……that’s pure guess work.

Everyone knows that they don’t know if there is a God or not…that is all that anyone can say…

I can see why a senile God would appeal to you.

Thank you for answering Izzy’s question about what I want.

'Science' actually knows that it has not found it yet, in spite of some opinions to the contrary.

Science is ongoing, we know more now than we did a hundred years ago.

It's never claimed to have all the answers.

I don’t need all of them. Just this one will do.

You're not a child, adults accept limitations.

Some more than others.

I've already accepted you won't be answering my question.

In short you want to play dumb while proclaiming the superiority of your position. Point taken.

I think that's what they all do, smug stupidity.

That's funny! And it went completely over his head.

@izzythepush, who says?

I don't accept limits. I don't define being an adult as putting a muzzle on myself and letting someone muffle my speech, or letting someone bridle ne and control me like a horse. The reason I am unemployed now is is that I refused to have the last boss run my life, so I quit and became self-employed. But then COVID hit, and I saw the prospect of running things myself increasingly more difficult, got discouraged and lost enthusiasm. I could probably pick it up again.
The only real limits there are, are limits you impose on yourself. Soreness, fatigue, even illness, you can work through these as long as you have decent rest afterwards. But if you accept someone else's discipline in your life, you're not an adult, you're a slave (regardless of pay).
Lemme give you little secret I've learned from self-employment. It doesn't seem like it's a matter of advertising after a certain point. I put my flyers evrrywhere, tried the newspaper, did a farmer's market. Stopped adverising when it made me exhausted to drive around. I usually get calls (like yesterday) when I'm thinking I might need more money. It's a subconscious thing, I can't really ask for it, but usually people call out of the blue. Unfortunately, I can't help most of them because I'm not trained to repair hardware, or glass, or issues where the computer won't start period. I'm mainly a computer tutor, which there isn't the same market for. I've fixed alot of issues, but mainly for the same two people and one retired and moved away (not dealing with that well, cuz the other regular is far less regular). Likewise, when I was depressed working for the library, the boss kept cutting my hours (a bit of a vicious cycle). The point being that although it seemed like the boss was in control, I was the one determining whether I had more or less hours through my attitude and performance.

You're following a kid's definition of adulthood. A kid looks at adults and sees most of them as useless oafs, and thinks they have to follow the same pattern. You only do if you allow yourself to be enslaved. You don't need to do anyone's model for your life but your own. The Christians paradoxically talk about accepting God's autho in their life. But from my experience that's limit talking. The God that I know of is at odds with the world's "freedom" but rather shows you a path of self-discipline. For example, while you are certainly free to use drugs, you will become an addict. "I can do anything, but I will not be ruled by anything." The secular world has told you there are limits, and you think that's so. And then they blame these limits on the church, who never defends itse or sets people straight.

Who says?

obviously youve bought into the entire bible tales without question. do you even accept the limits of knowledge ?????

No, I don't.

People put arbitrary limits on their knowledge. "Oh I can't do science, I'm a hairdresser" or "I'm no good at sports I'm a brain surgeon."

Our brains are designed for us to learn whatever we want. Or we can tell ourselves there are limits. When you tell yourself you are limited, you put a lock on yourself, in the same way that an older person convinced they can't find things anymore will be unable to do so. This is mental reinforcement. "I can't do... I can't do..." then you won't be able to.

I've learned to make music with no musical theory. I've done everything from writing to art to pretty technical computer stuff (registry fix and dll coding) often without formal training. I've never found anything I can't do.
I've learned how to look sexty as a female even though I was born a male. You want to tell me again how there are limits? Not even my body limits me.

We can know things that you and Frank think are impossible to know.