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Should DeLay resign

 
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 12:55 pm
You are arguing with yourself.
I am NOT disagreeing with you about DeLay,I AM saying that EVERY VIOLATION should be treated the same.
IN their public life or personal life.If its an ethics violation or an "appearance of impropriety",they should be removed and replaced.

BTW,"apprearance of impropriety" is what the dems used to investigate the "October surprise against Bush 1.
There was no evidence,just the appearance.
So,lets hold EVERYONE to the same standard,or hold noone to any standards.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 12:57 pm
Quote:
You are arguing with yourself.
I am NOT disagreeing with you about DeLay,I AM saying that EVERY VIOLATION should be treated the same.


No, I am arguing with you. I do NOT believe that every violation should be treated the same, because every violation is NOT the same.

Do you really have a black-and-white view of things this badly?

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:01 pm
Cycloptichorn wrote:
Quote:
You are arguing with yourself.
I am NOT disagreeing with you about DeLay,I AM saying that EVERY VIOLATION should be treated the same.


No, I am arguing with you. I do NOT believe that every violation should be treated the same, because every violation is NOT the same.

Do you really have a black-and-white view of things this badly?

Cycloptichorn


Every violation should be treated the same,because there are not degrees of ethics.You either have them or you dont,there is no in between.

And yes,the law is black and white.There are no shades of gray.There is either right or wrong. And everyone knows the difference between the two.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:02 pm
Quote:
Every violation should be treated the same,because there are not degrees of ethics.You either have them or you dont,there is no in between.

And yes,the law is black and white.There are no shades of gray.There is either right or wrong. And everyone knows the difference between the two.


Respectfully, I have nothing left to say to you.

Good day

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:02 pm
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:06 pm
ehBeth wrote:
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.


Tell me,where is the gray area in "murder is wrong,theft is wrong,stelaing is wrong"?
Where is the gray area in any of those statements?
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:12 pm
mysteryman wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.


Tell me,where is the gray area in "murder is wrong,theft is wrong,stelaing is wrong"?
Where is the gray area in any of those statements?


If terrorists fly a plane into the twin towers it is murder. If we drop bombs on Iraqi children it is unfortunate but unavoidable colateral damage.

There's one to start. That's kinda grey IMO.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:13 pm
mysteryman wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.


Tell me,where is the gray area in "murder is wrong,theft is wrong,stelaing is wrong"?
Where is the gray area in any of those statements?


Perhaps the murder was justified.
0 Replies
 
chiczaira
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:13 pm
!
I also believed that any "Ethics violations" should be punished. I amy have missed the news but at this time I am unaware of any OFFICIAL charges being made against DeLay. When he is impeached by the House, it will then be clear that there are ethical violations. Most of us know that Bill Clinton was impeached by the House who accepted the Charge of Obstruction of Justice as a violation to be passed on to the Senate for possible Conviction and removal. Most of us are aware that Clinton was fined $25,000 by an Arkansas Law Board for conduct unbecoming a lawyer and had his law degree suspened for five years.
Most of us know that Clinton was fined $80,000 for his misbehavior in Judge Wright's courtroom.

Most of us know that the "moral" leader of the Senate Ted Kennedy was found guilty of leaving the scene of an accident on July 19th. The complaint read:

"Edward M. Kennedy...did operate a certain motor vehicle upon a public way in Edgartown and did go away after knowingly causing injury to Mary Jo Kopechnie without stopping and making known his name, residence and the number of his motor vehicle"

Does this mean that DeLay should not be investigated? Of course not. But it does mean that he is not guilty of anything until it is adjudicated. If he is found guilty then he can decide whether or not he should resign.
If he takes Clinton and Kennedy as models, he will not.
But, he will not be found guilty of a thing!!
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:14 pm
If we drop atom bombs on Japan it is to save more lives later.

there, now I've picked on a democrat too. Wouldn't want to make any Bush supporters cry.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:17 pm
blueveinedthrobber wrote:
mysteryman wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.


Tell me,where is the gray area in "murder is wrong,theft is wrong,stelaing is wrong"?
Where is the gray area in any of those statements?


If terrorists fly a plane into the twin towers it is murder. If we drop bombs on Iraqi children it is unfortunate but unavoidable colateral damage.

There's one to start. That's kinda grey IMO.


Lets look at the definition of murder,ok...
Main Entry: 1mur·der
Pronunciation: 'm&r-d&r
Function: noun
Etymology: partly from Middle English murther, from Old English morthor; partly from Middle English murdre, from Old French, of Germanic origin; akin to Old English morthor; akin to Old High German mord murder, Latin mort-, mors death, mori to die, mortuus dead, Greek brotos mortal
1 : the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought


Notice the key word...UNLAWFULLY

now,since the duly elected powers in Washington exercised their constitutional duty and decided it was the right thing to do to go to war in Iraq,then it isnt UNLAWFUL.
Now,it is tragic that civilians have died,but that has happened in EVERY wart since man first walked the earth.
Since war is not illegal,then civilian deaths are not unlawful,but I will agree that they are tragic.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:19 pm
blueveinedthrobber wrote:
If we drop atom bombs on Japan it is to save more lives later.

there, now I've picked on a democrat too. Wouldn't want to make any Bush supporters cry.


Again,not an illegal act.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:19 pm
Quote:
But, he will not be found guilty of a thing!!


Don't be so sure. Abramoff has reportedly said that 'That scum, DeLay, knew everything. They knew everything.'

Once that birdie starts singing, it won't be long before DeLay is swingin'

And ask yourself this: given the allegations, and DeLay's obviously trouble that he's in, you believe it helps your party more to KEEP the guy around?

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:25 pm
ehBeth wrote:
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.


Spoken like a true liberal!!!

Laws and ethics are basicly suggestions???
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:25 pm
well MM, how about if my house decides that I am to come to your house and murder you and your family. We vote on it. It passes 4 to1. I guess as far as my house is concerned it's not unlawful and therefore it's not murder.

I suspect however, that at your house you might have a different feeling about it and might even possibly consider it unlawful.

So I guess lawful and unlawful sort of depends on whose house you're in and what end of the bullet you're on.

And since we're all in God's house, I don't believe His/Her law is concerned with the adjective lawful.I've never seen that describer mentioned anyhow.
0 Replies
 
chiczaira
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:28 pm
Bluevienedtrhrobber- Are you familiar with the PulitizerPrizeWinning Biography written by David McCulloch? He wrote a very fine biography of Truman.

McCullough qoutes Winston Churchill--"The historic fact remains and must be judged in the after time, that the decision whether or not to use the atomic bomb to compel the surrender of Japan was never an issue. There was unanimous, unquestioned agreement around our table and never did I hear the slightest suggestion that we should do otherwise."


and

"In a poll of 150 SCIENTISTS at the Metallurgical Laboratory in Chicago, 87%(eightyseven) voted for military use of the weapon,"

It's a great biography of Truman.
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:29 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
mysteryman wrote:
ehBeth wrote:
Actually, law and ethics are composed almost entirely of shades of grey. Very little pure white or black in those worlds.


Tell me,where is the gray area in "murder is wrong,theft is wrong,stelaing is wrong"?
Where is the gray area in any of those statements?


Perhaps the murder was justified.


That would be homicide. Not illegal in cases of self defense. just splitting a straw.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:30 pm
Homicide and Murder are two names for the same thing. The only difference is in perception and judgement.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:32 pm
blueveinedthrobber wrote:
well MM, how about if my house decides that I am to come to your house and murder you and your family. We vote on it. It passes 4 to1. I guess as far as my house is concerned it's not unlawful and therefore it's not murder.

I suspect however, that at your house you might have a different feeling about it and might even possibly consider it unlawful.

So I guess lawful and unlawful sort of depends on whose house you're in and what end of the bullet you're on.

And since we're all in God's house, I don't believe His/Her law is concerned with the adjective lawful.I've never seen that describer mentioned anyhow.


Thats a silly analogy,but lets play it out.
After you try and murder me,then I have the right to come to your house,burn it down,destroy every living thing in it,and it is justified and called self defense.
Do I have your analogy correct?
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Apr, 2005 01:33 pm
chiczaira wrote:
Bluevienedtrhrobber- Are you familiar with the PulitizerPrizeWinning Biography written by David McCulloch? He wrote a very fine biography of Truman.

McCullough qoutes Winston Churchill--"The historic fact remains and must be judged in the after time, that the decision whether or not to use the atomic bomb to compel the surrender of Japan was never an issue. There was unanimous, unquestioned agreement around our table and never did I hear the slightest suggestion that we should do otherwise."


and

"In a poll of 150 SCIENTISTS at the Metallurgical Laboratory in Chicago, 87%(eightyseven) voted for military use of the weapon,"

It's a great biography of Truman.


Sounds like a good book. I'm interested in Truman. I liked him judged by what I knowof him, even though I disagree with his bombing of Japan.

I wonder if these same people had had any inkling of the true force and power and lingering effects of such a weapon and the pandoras box they had opened they would still use it, or they would have "erred on the side of life".
0 Replies
 
 

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