I don't hate America,i need some help

The neocon "straw man" vocabulary seems to have sprung up over night... has the 10th edition of the Newspeak dictionary finally been issued?

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gungasnake wrote:

ebrown_p wrote:
Let's see Gunga

Laws based on religion.
No acceptance of homosexuality.
Harsh punishment for drug crimes.
Quick executions that don't drag on with legal proces.

Isn't this what you believe in?

Not really.

Then, maybe you are more liberal than you appear.

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I thought Gungasnake's contribution was quite good. It covered the issues very well. Old Europe may not be familiar with some of the sources on which we base our opinions here in the United States.

I had always been ambivalent concerning the French but was totally shocked when I first read William Shirer's classic- The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich.
I was not aware that the French could have stopped Hitler and the Nazis in 1937 when the Nazis invaded the Rhineland with a very puny force that could have, according to Shirer's evidence taken from both French and Nazi sources( at Nuremberg). Shirer's recounting of events served to impress on me the almost total lack of international responsilbity which the French have had and which they certainly have displayed since the coalition invaded Iraq.

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I would hate America too if I didn't live here. I hate what it's becoming with the NeoCons in power. We need to go back to the Clinton era.

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Roverroad- You are, of course, aware that Bill Clinton ordered missles to bomb Iraq in December 1998( at the same time that the impeachment hearings were coming to a close) alllegedly to keep Saddam from developing WMD's.

That puts any so called Neo-Con to shame for sheer chutzpah.

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chiczaira wrote:

Roverroad- You are, of course, aware that Bill Clinton ordered missles to bomb Iraq in December 1998( at the same time that the impeachment hearings were coming to a close) alllegedly to keep Saddam from developing WMD's.

That puts any so called Neo-Con to shame for sheer chutzpah.

There was a lot of hatred toward America when Clinton was president but it's nowhere near the level that the Bush administration took us to. Much of that was built up after years of us sticking our noses where they don't belong. Clinton did some great work with the peace process in the middle east, work that Bush managed to unravel by his first year as president.

Clinton wasn't booed when his face was seen on the monitor at the Pope's funeral, Bush was!

There are several posts by Americans in this thread that say they hate us because they are jealous. Because we have freedom that they don't have. Well that only proves the arrogance of many Americans and I'm ashamed that you are citizens of my country!

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chiczaira wrote:

I thought Gungasnake's contribution was quite good. It covered the issues very well. Old Europe may not be familiar with some of the sources on which we base our opinions here in the United States.

Don't know whether you're talking to me or not, chiczaira....

When discussing the reasons why so many people hate America this is quite irrelevant, though. I don't know whether you are familiar with some of the sources on which people around the world base their opinions.
Nevertheless, often enough it's not about the sources. It's more about gut feeling. What people are scared of is the often-proclaimed US-supremacy compared to the rest of the world. It's the attitude of "nobody can stop us, anyway". It's withdrawing signatures from international treaties. It's invading other countries. It's backing dictators when deemed necessary. It's torturing done by US soldiers. It's abducting citizens of foreign countries.

That's not something representative of the US. But people do generalize.

So does Gunga when he says that the UN are a gang of rapists, that Europeans are "truly idiots" and the muslims are "unrelenting crybabies".

I think insulting the rest of the world is a very good method to alienate whole countries, and I think we have seen and heard quite a lot of that recently.

Nevertheless, if you want to discuss 'sources', I'd be happy to hear about that, chiczaira. What are the sources we may not be familiar with, which would justify said behaviour?

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chiczaira wrote:

I had always been ambivalent concerning the French but was totally shocked when I first read William Shirer's classic- The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich.
I was not aware that the French could have stopped Hitler and the Nazis in 1937 when the Nazis invaded the Rhineland with a very puny force that could have, according to Shirer's evidence taken from both French and Nazi sources( at Nuremberg). Shirer's recounting of events served to impress on me the almost total lack of international responsilbity which the French have had and which they certainly have displayed since the coalition invaded Iraq.

The thing that always got to me was the contrast between England and Russia hanging on by the skin of their teeth for two or three years before there was any reason to believe they could win against Hitler while the French caved after about an hour and a half or whatever it was. Bart Simpson said it best (buncha cheese-eating surrender monkeys)...

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roverroad wrote:

I would hate America too if I didn't live here. I hate what it's becoming with the NeoCons in power. We need to go back to the Clinton era.

What was it you liked about the Clinton regime? Was it the gangsterism? The all-psychopath team of the Clinton cabinet and inner circle (Reno, Albright, Cohen, Wesley Clark, Begala, Carville, Babbit Shalaliegh et. al.)?

Was it the new definition of Chutzvah, i.e. starting a bombing campaign against Iraq the day before the sucker was impeached and then having some stooge like Dickless Gephardt try to keep his face straight while claiming it's unpatriotic to start an impeachment with a war in progress?

Was it Clinton's taste in women?

http://www.nndb.com/people/588/000025513/monica_lewinsky.jpg

As in, "...and on his farm he had some pigs, eee-iiii-eee-iiii-oh....." I mean, that's the sort of thing I'd expect to see on the centerfold of some livestock journal.

Or could it have been Kosovo (dog-wag III) and all the love and good will that little episode brought to the United States?

http://www.zpub.com/un/bc-hitler.jpg

Or could it have been old Slick telling the whole world to suck his **** on the cover of Esquire Magazine??

http://www.happinessonline.org/MoralCode/images/001201_clinton_cover.jpg

I mean, what exactly was it?

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roverroad wrote:

Clinton did some great work with the peace process in the middle east, work that Bush managed to unravel by his first year as president......

BWWWWAAAAAAAAAHAAAAAHAHAHA Hahahaaaaaaa hahahahahaha ahahahahaha haaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahh ho hohoho hoh ohhoh ohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohoooohhhh........

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gungasnake wrote:

BWWWWAAAAAAAAAHAAAAAHAHAHA Hahahaaaaaaa hahahahahaha ahahahahaha haaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahh ho hohoho hoh ohhoh ohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohohoooohhhh........

Right back at you.

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gungasnake wrote:

The thing that always got to me was the contrast between England and Russia hanging on by the skin of their teeth for two or three years before there was any reason to believe they could win against Hitler while the French caved after about an hour and a half or whatever it was. Bart Simpson said it best (buncha cheese-eating surrender monkeys)...

Your profound knowledge of WWII history is amazing.

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Gungasnake is quite correct, Old Europe. One of the best books to come out of World War II was the classic- The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" by William L. Shirer.

Anyone that reads it carefully must conclude that France and most Frenchmen were sniveling cowards with no backbone just before World War II. The opinion of many in the USA these last three years conforms with that opinion.

Shirer says

quote:

P. 291

"Two days later, Hitler reached his decision,somewhat to the consternation of the generals,most of whom were convinced that the French would make mincemeat out of the small German forces which had been gathered for the move into the Rhineland...but the French, their nation already paralyzed by internal strife and their people sinking into defeatism, did not know this when a small force of German troops paraded across the Rhine bridges on March 7 and entered the demilitarized zone....As Jodl testified at Nuremberg-"Considering the situation we were in, the French covering army could have blown us to pieces."...Hitler himself admitted as much. "A retreat on our part would have spelled collapse"

And Thousands of American troops died to liberate the French in 1944 and 1945. And the French come to our aid in Iraq?????????

No good deed is ever left unpunished.

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You know, once in a while I read something which indicates that the French system is actually superior to ours in some particular way:

http://worldatwar.net/nations/france/timeline18-39.html

Quote:

September 21, 1920 President Paul Deschanel forced to resign due to the onset of mental illness

Consider that we found ourselves in the precise same situation in 1994:

http://reason.com/9411/fe.efron.9411.shtml

and that, rather than pack Slick Clinton's sorry ass off to Saint Elizabeth's Hospital and hand the post over to Algor as they were in fact obligated to do, the demokkkrat party went to the wall to keep the sorry lunatic in office for eight years, causing massive damage to our country and institutions and leaving our military in such disrepair that it needed two years of building before it was able to go after Saddam Hussein after 9/11.

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chiczaira,

you are of course aware that the Rhineland was not originally French soil, but was a part of Germany? You are aware that the population of the Rhineland was German? You are aware that the French 'covering army' was just that - an occupation army? You are aware that the population of the Rhineland was heavily opposed to the French, and welcomed Hitler's forces?

The same happened in Austria, for example. I don't think you can equate the annexion of the Rhineland with the occupation of France, though.

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It's actually quite ironic how much effort Gunga and chiczaira put into explaining why they hate France, in a thread titled "I don't hate America,i need some help"...

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Gungasnake, Your response is so pathetically typical of the republican response that it's flat out boring. You people are obsessed with this man's peins... Get over it!

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roverroad wrote:

Gungasnake, Your response is so pathetically typical of the republican response that it's flat out boring. You people are obsessed with this man's peins... Get over it!

Something I've seen posted on libertypost a couple of times; you might enjoy it:

Quote:

If there's anything I find hard to believe in the crap I read coming from democrats and liberals it's this claim that Slick is somehow a cool stud or something like that for getting his geriatric, crooked tally sucked off by a cool, teenage Lolita intern like Monica.

The first time I ever saw a picture of Monica Lewinsky, I was almost in a state of shock. I mean, picture the European heads of state standing there with their actresses and super models looking at a picture of the leader of what's supposed to be the most powerful nation since Gengis Khan, standing there with a little pig like that. I mean, they must have laughed themselves silly.

It may in fact actually be that democrats and liberals can't tell the difference. If that's the case, then you might could devise a simple test for weeding out democrats and liberals in a manner similar to that in which they used to tell Japanese from Chinese during WW-II by having them try to pronounce something like 'lallapolooza' with a lot of 'l's in it, i.e. show the job applicant or whatever two pictures, e.g.:

Test:

One of the pictures below is of a super-model, the other of a pig:

Which is which?

A.

B.

If somebody guesses wrong, or if they honestly can't tell the difference, then they are probably a democrat and a liberal, and can be weeded out from whatever you're testing for.

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The other woman is Mila Jovovitch...

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Funny. Gunga. Very funny.

Now back to the topic: why do so many people hate America? Bush's America, that is?

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I don't hate America,i need some help

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