Progressives (Liberals)

@hightor,

Paul Waldman has a piece up on Manchin and the problems he might cause. But as you say, there is zero chance that a progressive candidate could win where he holds his seat.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

I was glad to see her go. She crowed about being a strong anti-Bern delegate.

1 Reply

@Lash,

I posted to protest the reason she resigned. I was not considering how right or left she is.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

I agree with you on that score. The husband should face serious charges.

0 Replies

@blatham,

blatham wrote:

Quote:
The seesaw is a result of manipulation by the powers who can propagandize and financially browbeat and bribe, endlessly.
I trust you aren't suggesting I'm unaware of or insufficiently educated as to the role that money and business plays in politics or that I'm untutored in the devices of propagandists. Unfortunately, we can't disappear this stuff without becoming totalitarians ourselves. Bernie is not going to be able to erase the power and influence of the oil and gas industries. He won't be able to come anywhere close to such a thing. No one could do that. What's he or any one going to do about Fox? What's he or anyone going to do about the people in that piece most of whom will surely go to their graves believing as they do?

Quote:
Anybody who thinks Obama or the Clintons have any good answers are as manipulated as Trump's stooges.
Here's where you sound very much like those people quoted in the article. Seriously. What are the chances that Sanders stands so uniquely among democrats that he is more akin to a Savior than a mortal man? That only he has the Answers?

You and people who use that line of reasoning sound defeatist to me. "We can't accomplish it all, so why even try?"

1 Reply

@blatham,

Think of how many human beings would turn down millions of dollars to do the right thing.

If you can’t be honest with me about that answer, try being honest with yourself.

That crucible changes all paths to the “answers” you mention.

All the answers may be brilliant across the Democrat and Republican debate stages if ALL they’re thinking of is ‘the right answers’.

But, in DC, they’re thinking of the right answers predicated on how they can keep this multimillion dollar lobby happy...and this other one...and maybe just one more...

And, soon the right answers are all long gone from our policy sheet.

Yes.

Bernie ******* Sanders is THE ONLY ONE with the right answers.

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@edgarblythe,

Quote:

You and people who use that line of reasoning sound defeatist to me. "We can't accomplish it all, so why even try?"

"Let's get 90% of American workers unionized in three months."

"The fossil fuel industries, the most powerful and wealthy industry in mankind's history with a presence in every nation of the world, needs to be taken down. We'll get that done with minimal disruption of peoples' lifestyle in two years"

"Fox News is a blight in every nation where it has a presence and it is helping to destroy journalism, civility and citizen democracy. Elect me and I will eliminate it before my first mid-term"

0 Replies

Yep. We are doomed. Vote no matter who.

1 Reply

Anybody with a lick of sense knows that if Bernie gets elected the fight to transform America will only begin, not conclude.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

Quote:

"Vote no matter who"

Definitely not. Just be aware of the real-world barriers ahead. Magic is not available.

Quote:

"We are doomed"

Maybe. But if so, it will be because of who we are as human social animals, our limitations, and our having exceeded levels of social, intellectual and environmental complexity far beyond our capacity to handle or even comprehend.

But we have no other recourse than to try. False hopes are far too expensive right now.

0 Replies

@edgarblythe,

I make no argument against Bernie. How is it you don't get this? My argument is with the absolutism inherent in Bernie or No One (or I won't vote).

3 Replies

@blatham,

Before each session of our state legislature there's a particular window of time allotted for a committee to review all the submitted bills and decide which ones to include in the legislative calendar and which to reject. Most of them go through; maybe a quarter pass unanimously and most of the others win or lose by large margins. But you you never see a bill rejected in toto by the whole committee, 24 - 0. The defeated bill is always awarded a "pity vote", thus sparing some constituency the civic humiliation of abject defeat. Well, Manchin's a 'Pity Democrat". He's not like us. He's on borrowed time. Leave him be.

1 Reply

He’s the only one.

1 Reply

@hightor,

Borrowed time - I think so.

But I like the pity-vote notion. I suspect it's how I got some dates.

0 Replies

@Lash,

Quote:

He’s the only one.

Analogies here with North Korea and Jim Jones and Annette Funicello songs.

1 Reply

@blatham,

Nero rosins up his bow.

0 Replies

@blatham,

It's actually easy to understand. Personally I would just move on. Some subjects with some people is like banging your head against a brick wall repeatedly and expecting it sometime to not hurt.

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@blatham,

I know you would vote for him if nominated. I haven't argued otherwise. But there is always that tug of the negative when you write about him. My ultimate thought on the other Democratic contenders is that all of the top contenders will want to sit on a status quo, as defined as restoring as much as possible of the nation to its pre Trump condition, which will certainly fail and do nothing to assuage the voter angst that keeps up the slide to a fascist right.

2 Replies

@edgarblythe,

Quote:

My ultimate thought on the other Democratic contenders is that all of the top contenders will want to sit on a status quo, as defined as restoring as much as possible of the nation to its pre Trump condition, which will certainly fail and do nothing to assuage the voter angst that keeps up the slide to a fascist right.

I get it, so if your guy loses, you would rather it be a full blown rush to more conservative judges for life, Obmacare completely destroyed and more people who previously at least had some coverage under Obamacare, then would have none. You would rather a lying crooked psychopath continue to lead us. If he pushes the button, hey at least, we won't have centrist democrats tying to keep steady hand on the country.

1 Reply

Kamala is cutting staff and running out of cash. She's fallen behind Yang and Gabbard. Biden will be next.

0 Replies

Progressives (Liberals)

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