revelette1
 
  2  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 01:39 pm
@ehBeth,
Agreed, I hope just enough of the new dems in congress follow this advice to get their followers to do the same. If they do, we have a shot in 2020, if they don't, we don't.
0 Replies
 
livinglava
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 01:48 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:
A statement of irony. So, what would you have them do? Not escape the violence of their own country? Their attempts to escape violence and death in their own country is a natural aspect of trying to live. What would you have them do? If I were to be in their shoes, I'd probably attempt the same thing they are regardless of the unknown dangers of that trip. A perfect Catch 22.

I think you misunderstand me as criticizing them or putting them down in some way with what I am explaining.

This is also not something that is limited to transnational migrants. People can be sent from one area to another within the same national country by various kinds of threats to their families, including even something as basic as the threat of home eviction.

My point is we have to stop focusing on migrants in their own right and look at how they are being used by others. Ultimately, everyone should be free to migrate and live and participate in the economy/society wherever they can responsibly go; but that freedom/liberty is being ruined by gang members and other organized criminals that are connected through global networks to use people as slaves for migratory jobs that make them vulnerable in various ways.

Part of me says that totally legalizing migration would take some power away from the criminals who exploit migration as a means of perpetrating trafficking crimes, but unless all the crimes that are served by trafficking are legalized, such as prostitution and recreational drugs, then there will still be a motive to harvesting poor people in poor areas of the world and sending them to rich areas where there is big money to be made selling their bodies for sex and as drug containers.

Now, if this leads you to think that legalization of these crimes is the answer, then you have to ask yourself whether the fundamental exploitation of things like recreational drugs and prostitution go away when they are legalized? The answer is no. Drugs are addictive so people can be controlled by addicting them to the drugs and then getting them to commit crimes or take other risks in exchange for supplying their habit.

Likewise with prostitution, until people are voluntarily willing to perform all the sex acts that any paying customer wants free of charge and other 'strings,' there will be a market for prostitution - and the women, men, and children who give into it will often do so because of economic pressures they face from making other choices; or maybe even just because they are too greedy or lazy to settle for harder work that pays less. Whatever the case, these abuses of humans are not going to go away if they are legalized or if borders are abolished, so the issue is what to do about them and whether borders are a useful tool that is worth all the harm and human tragedy they cause otherwise.

In short, can criminals/gangs be discouraged from abusing and exploiting poor people as migrant traffickers if the borders are strengthened enough that they lose hope in trafficking whatever they are trafficking? If so, there could eventually be hope for a world where all people are free to migrate of their own volition, but for that world to exist, organized crime and abuse has to be stopped first, because otherwise they will just always see opportunity in abusing people to make money trafficking contraband between otherwise-separated economies.
coldjoint
 
  0  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 01:58 pm
@Lash,
Quote:
I suggest that stupid things like age, sex appeal, and height aren’t considered as presidential traits.

After 8 years of Gods gift to humanity Barack Obama? You sure about that?
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  0  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 02:04 pm
When candidates are beholden to big money they leave us holdin' the bag, Democrat or Republican. Establishment Dems are trying to bulldoze progressives into accepting their dictates instead of running a fair process. We already know where that leads. To dysfunction, loss of confidence among the voters who make up the margin of loss or victory, further expansion of Republican power. They apparently haven't learned a thing from the debacle a few years back.
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 02:10 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Here's an article you should read.

Quote:
Drunk Driving, Illegal Lawbreaker Kills 22-Year-Old Son of TN Fire Captain

http://www.independentsentinel.com/drunk-driving-illegal-lawbreaker-kills-22-year-old-son-of-tn-fire-captain/
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 02:53 pm
Pat the Berner 🌹


@PatTheBerner
19m19 minutes ago
More
I resolve to be nicer to Beto in 2019.

Nevermind. He's a crappy corporate Dem.

✔️Voted to deregulate banks
✔️Voted to fast-track TPP
✔️Voted with GOP a ton
✔️Broke his no fossil-fuel $ pledge
✔️Endorsed by ThirdWay (GOP/centrist funded think-tank intent on killing Medicare4All
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 05:15 pm
@livinglava,
I doubt immigration is a crime issue, although almost all countries have laws concerning immigration. Look at the problems created by the European Union? Many of the disagreements has to do with the freedom of immigration.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 05:21 pm
John Iadarola

Verified account

@johniadarola
31 Dec 2018
More
There is no perfect politician. Not even your favorite.

Question them all. Dig into their votes, their speeches, their donors... everything.

I want to stress - do this for ALL. OF. THEM. Don't recoil when your favorite candidate is criticized. Don't write off critical voices.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 05:43 pm
The "president" has called on the two party leaders to meet for negotiations to open the government. Rolling Eyes
cicerone imposter
 
  3  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 05:48 pm
@edgarblythe,
What? Trump closed the government for his wall, and he now wants to "negotiate?" He already said, my wall or close down the government. He looses on both counts.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 05:52 pm
@cicerone imposter,
They have to look for a public stance that makes people perceive there are no losers. Not a possible thing. I won't consider the Democrats successful if they up what they have already offered.
Real Music
 
  4  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 06:32 pm
@ehBeth,
Thank you for posting that S.K article.
That is a wonderful article.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 07:22 pm
Bernie far and away ahead of the 2020 pack
Mother Jones

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/bernie-sanders-2020-poll-770632/

Excerpt:

WASHINGTON — Sen. Bernie Sanders (D-VT) holds a commanding lead in a new poll of liberal grassroots activists conducted by Democracy for America, the lefty activist group founded by former Vermont governor and 2004 presidential candidate Howard Dean.
In a field of 23 candidates, Sanders claimed 36 percent of the first-place votes by DFA activists, more than double the percentage of former Vice President Joe Biden, who finished in second with 15 percent. Rep. Beto O’Rourke (D-TX), who narrowly lost his Senate race against Republican Ted Cruz last month, took third place with 12 percent. Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) grabbed fourth with 8 percent and Sen. Kamala Harris (D-CA) rounded out the top five with seven percent.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  5  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 07:52 pm
@ehBeth,
Here. *******. Here!!!!

This should be posted daily.
Real Music
 
  5  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 07:56 pm
@maporsche,
Definitely. I'm going to save that article and repost it again at a later date.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 07:57 pm
Stephanie Kelton

Verified account

@StephanieKelton
9h9 hours ago
More
"Deficit reduction" is not a democratic value.
With Dems taking back the House, Republicans will try to force them to prioritize deficit reduction.
Don't let it happen! Show us how you will make *better use* of deficits to improve the human condition.
maporsche
 
  3  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 07:57 pm
@edgarblythe,
edgarblythe wrote:
I won't consider the Democrats successful....



...EVER!!!
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  4  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 07:59 pm
@edgarblythe,
What is wrong with deficit reduction?

Raise taxes and reduce the deficit.

That should be important to all of us.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 08:08 pm
I've noticed that when you point out that certain Democrats take mountains of dirty cash, their defenders don't answer what it means for their loyalties and the bills they support. They merely attack the messenger. Does anybody really think that a person taking hundreds of thousands of dollars from, for instance, insurance companies is going to make a real effort to get people universal health care? Taking hundreds of thousands from the fossil fuel industry going to support clean ways of doing things? Etc. Point it out and you are 'making war' on establishment types. Not to mention so many establishment Dems, including Warren, have made the Democrats a party for warmongering. It's not liberals who have gotten out of step. It's establishment Democrats.
maporsche
 
  3  
Reply Tue 1 Jan, 2019 08:11 pm
@edgarblythe,
Once you explain to me how a person working in the IT department of Aetna Healthcare donating $250 to a candidate makes that candidate more beholden to that industry.

Candidates who don’t vote for things that they haven’t ran on or don’t believe in, isn’t corruption.

If there is a “progressive” candidate who is anti-gun control for example and they get money from the NRA or pro-gun people, that candidate wouldn’t be selling out if they voted against gun control. They may not be really progressive, but that’s another issue...
0 Replies
 
 

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