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Where does corporate responsibility start on the issue of institutionalized racism? Starbucks

 
 
Reply Wed 18 Apr, 2018 02:12 pm
Starbucks Closing 8,000 Stores For An Afternoon, For Racial-Bias Education
Is this overkill? Necessary medicine? Somewhere in the middle?

It's definitely unique an action for a global corporation. I think this might be a good start. Will be very curious come May 29th to see what happens on Twitter and Facebook when thousands of people can't get their Starbucks fix.
 
jespah
 
  6  
Reply Wed 18 Apr, 2018 03:41 pm
@tsarstepan,
It'll be interesting to see around November 29th when a half a year has elapsed, if anything took.
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oralloy
 
  -4  
Reply Wed 18 Apr, 2018 05:11 pm
@tsarstepan,
tsarstepan wrote:
Is this overkill? Necessary medicine? Somewhere in the middle?

PR stunt.

As I understand it, two black men were expelled from the store for not buying anything, and now black people are yammering about racism.

I'm not sure if it is the best policy to kick people out of a store if they are not buying anything, but I've heard of it happening in other stores. I see no basis for accusations of racism.

If a bunch of silly people are falsely accusing you of racism, and you can manipulate the silly people into going away by putting on a publicity stunt, it's probably a good business move.

They might want to also consider a policy against kicking people out of stores just because they aren't buying anything right then. My instincts are that it's not a good business move in the long run. Then again, I'm not an expert on business or store management.
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PUNKEY
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Apr, 2018 05:29 pm
Staged, I suspect. Too obvious.

0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 Apr, 2018 06:06 pm
@tsarstepan,
Im amazed at how folks line up with their worlviews on this. NOONE, I mean NOONE has the facts yet. The Philly Inquirer hd published some stuff that was incorrect (that the guys were apparently loitering )
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 12:23 am
@tsarstepan,
Not so much doing the right thing as to be seen as doing the right thing.
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 08:10 am
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

Im amazed at how folks line up with their worlviews on this.

I'm super disappointed that you weren't going to talk about folks lining up with their wolverines as I first read your post. Embarrassed Crying or Very sad
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maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 08:13 am
@farmerman,
If Noone has the facts, I wish he would tell the rest of us. Wink

I agree with you that people are lining up in their particular corner. The facts don't really matter to either side.

tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 08:13 am
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

Not so much doing the right thing as to be seen as doing the right thing.

Yeah. I understand much of their intent is public relations/save ourselves (corporate wise) from any national backlash and I suspect ... it won't mean anything if Starbucks DOESN'T follow through after May 29 and that everything goes back to the do nothing, punish no one, take no responsibility status quo that the corp headquarters has been tolerating of their own employee population in the past.

I said elsewhere. It's a good start. Emphasis on START. It's not a cure all by any stretch of the imagination. Institutional racism can't be fixed if nothing is done at all.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 10:08 am
I’m glad Starbucks is responding like this.

The racial problems the US still suffers from could use some nationally recognized goodwill. I think the two racial incidents that happened at Starbucks were the result of accidental or unconscious racism by individuals in management positions. I think racism like this happens every day, and it’s a very good thing to shine a spotlight on it.

I hope that it sparks more dialogues that might open the eyes of people who either don’t believe it happens, or are cold-hearted to how it affects people who have to constantly deal with unfair treatment.

tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 11:10 am
Not Everyone Feels Welcome Camping Out In 'Third Spaces' Like Starbucks
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -4  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 12:17 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
I agree with you that people are lining up in their particular corner. The facts don't really matter to either side.

Facts matter to my side.

Although until I hear reputable reports to the contrary, I'll continue to believe that the facts are as I've already heard them reported on the PBS Newshour.
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oralloy
 
  -4  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 12:19 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:
I think the two racial incidents that happened at Starbucks were the result of accidental or unconscious racism by individuals in management positions. I think racism like this happens every day, and it’s a very good thing to shine a spotlight on it.

Two incidents??

How is the event where people were asked to leave the store if they refused to buy something a racial incident?
PUNKEY
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 02:10 pm
I have worked in the restaurant business on and off for over 55 years. The only place people were allowed to "hang out" without buying anything was at the Dairy Queen - and that was when I was 15 when a young guy wanted my friend's attention.

As I understand it, these men weren't homeless, in fact, they were real estate people, professionals. Sitting down and having a meeting in a busy cafe? Without ordering anything? They should have known better. There is a sense of entitlement for young people, I notice, in their behavior at public places nowadays.

Still, Starbucks has set itself up. It has given the public the message that it's a hangout place. But in reality, it's a high-price salon with the expectation that you would order something. That's how they make money; that's how the staff gets paid.

Still - the police never should have been called; this could have been handled differently.

Now it's become a racial incident and if you support the business aspect of the situation, you are called a bigot or racist.


Lash
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 04:02 pm
@PUNKEY,
White people were also sitting there and were given the access code to the restroom with no problem.

It was clearly racially-biased behavior.
Lash
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 04:04 pm
@oralloy,
Because the same situation at the same two Starbucks had white people present who were treated differently.
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 04:30 pm
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/men-arrested-at-starbucks-say-they-feared-for-their-lives

Quote:
Nelson and Robinson originally were supposed to meet Andrew Yaffe, a white local businessman, at a Starbucks across town. But the plan changed, and they agreed to meet at the Rittenhouse Square location, where they’d met several times before on a potential real estate opportunity.

The black men arrived a few minutes early. Three police officers showed up not long after.

Nelson said they weren’t questioned but were told to leave immediately.

Yaffe showed up as the men were being handcuffed. He can be seen in the video demanding an explanation for the officers’ actions. Nelson and Robinson did not resist arrest, confused and unsure of what to think or what might happen next.

“When you know that you did nothing wrong, how do you really react to it?” Nelson said. “You can either be ignorant or you can show some type of sophistication and act like you have class. That was the choice we had.”



people go to coffee shops to wait for others every stinking day. people go to coffee shops and take up table space for hours - sometimes after the purchase of a coffee - sometimes not. I think taking up space without ordering - for hours - is horrid but it's an entire sub/culture. It's also not what happened here. The guys showed up slightly early for a meeting.

Waiting for friends in a coffee shop should not be something people are arrested/detained for. It is a normal thing for people to do.


it's much more than a decade since I set foot in a Starbucks. I've long had issues with their HR practices - most specifically about their very deliberate efforts to keep staff from becoming entitled to receive benefits. If I am given gift cards I pass them on to homeless people so someone will use the $. Don't want $tarbucks to benefit from my avoidance of them. No chance I'd go back now.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 04:33 pm
@PUNKEY,
PUNKEY wrote:
I have worked in the restaurant business on and off for over 55 years.


for at least 20 years it has been coffee shop culture that people go in with their books/electronic gear and do their work. sometimes they order / sometimes they don't.

at Future Cafe in the Annex here, it's been done for at the least 25 years I've been going there.
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ehBeth
 
  4  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 05:15 pm
Just listening to another interview on this.

They arrived in the store at 4:35, the police were called at 4:37. Thank goodness it was a white woman recording the incident. It would have never been heard of otherwise.

**** that bullshit. People who are planning to order something stand in line longer than that. Call the police two minutes after each person arrives in your coffee shop. Every single person. Then you'll realize how truly awful this was.
ehBeth
 
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Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2018 06:02 pm
https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/30709542_10156481995541800_1890256678626719714_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=87ef1c87d8d40732021a757d530785b3&oe=5B65D8AF
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