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Evolutionry/religious nonsense

 
 
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2018 06:52 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Lets see, how many times and in which order did I ask you for any evidence to support your beliefs.(AND: many and I asked fist).
All you do is ignore, so really, why should I give you some more education in something that you wont even take the time to analyze if it doesn't start with "let there be light".


I did not ignore your answers. You side step the question by explaining how the system works. I know the system works. I asked how the system originated. The answer to that questions is the proof you claim that you have for an origination from purely random origins. So please answer them.

Here is my answer.
Many scientists agree that the higgs field is a matrix of particles that fills all of empty space and gives matter mass. (also see quantum gravity) It has spatial density and that is what holds matter together through the strong and weak nuclear forces in the same way atmospheric pressure keeps the energy that is stored in a balloon in a balloon. (put a balloon in a vacuum and it explodes, take away the higgs field and all atoms would explode)

So by interpreting the evidence provided by modern science from the large hadron collider, the higgs field exists, and had to exist before matter could exist.

Further evidence suggests it is a matrix because, all particles of matter radiate energy exactly the same way, (every where, all the time).

wiki
Quote:
Planck's law of black-body radiation
Main article: Planck's law
Planck's law states that[30]
(must click on link to see equation.)
https://wikimedia.org/api/rest_v1/media/math/render/svg/a2827e05f0d515a450bd8e30492b100d777031bd

where

Bν(T) is the spectral radiance (the power per unit solid angle and per unit of area normal to the propagation) density of frequency ν radiation per unit frequency at thermal equilibrium at temperature T.
h is the Planck constant;
c is the speed of light in a vacuum;
k is the Boltzmann constant;
ν is the frequency of the electromagnetic radiation;
T is the absolute temperature of the body.
For a black body surface the spectral radiance density (defined per unit of area normal to the propagation) is independent of the angle {\displaystyle \theta } \theta of emission with respect to the normal. However, this means that, following Lambert's cosine law, {\displaystyle B_{\nu }(T)\cos \theta } {\displaystyle B_{\nu }(T)\cos \theta } is the radiance density per unit area of emitting surface as the surface area involved in generating the radiance is increased by a factor {\displaystyle 1/\cos \theta } {\displaystyle 1/\cos \theta } with respect to an area normal to the propagation direction. At oblique angles, the solid angle spans involved do get smaller, resulting in lower aggregate intensities.



For B (Bolztmans constant), and h (Planck's constant) to have the constant values that they have "everywhere and all the time" there has to be a matrix like structure of the "virtual particles" of empty space (higgs bosons) and to the "real particles" that fill the space inside of atoms (quarks, electrons, anti quarks and positrons). It becomes simple geometry and Newtonian physicas to figure out that all electrons of matter are coupling with all the photons of the higgs field at approximately 60 degrees.

But, you have to be willing to ask what the structure looks like before you can get the 60 degree answer. And then you must accept that, "structures that "look" like that like aren't easily arrived at as the result of a Big Bang explosion caused by gravity. Especially since the the evidence suggests that gravity is an emergent entropic force that needs matter to emerge from in the first place making it hard for gravity to be the force behind matter creation.

They are having the same problem with Entropic gravity requiring a Baroque Structure like this implied (and I think obviously implied) matrix.
wiki
Quote:
Criticism and experimental tests
Entropic gravity, as proposed by Verlinde in his original article, reproduces the Einstein field equations and, in a Newtonian approximation, a 1/r potential for gravitational forces. Since its results do not differ from Newtonian gravity except in regions of extremely small gravitational fields, testing the theory with earth-based laboratory experiments doesn’t appear feasible. Spacecraft-based experiments performed at Lagrangian points within our solar system would be expensive and challenging.

Even so, entropic gravity in its current form has been severely challenged on formal grounds. Matt Visser has shown[18] that the attempt to model conservative forces in the general Newtonian case (i.e. for arbitrary potentials and an unlimited number of discrete masses) leads to unphysical requirements for the required entropy and involves an unnatural number of temperature baths of differing temperatures. Visser concludes:

There is no reasonable doubt concerning the physical reality of entropic forces, and no reasonable doubt that classical (and semi-classical) general relativity is closely related to thermodynamics [52–55]. Based on the work of Jacobson [1–6], Thanu Padmanabhan [7– 12], and others, there are also good reasons to suspect a thermodynamic interpretation of the fully relativistic Einstein equations might be possible. Whether the specific proposals of Verlinde [26] are anywhere near as fundamental is yet to be seen — the rather baroque construction needed to accurately reproduce n-body Newtonian gravity in a Verlinde-like setting certainly gives one pause.


First of all the unnatural number of temperature baths can be accounted for if each piece of matter from a small group of atoms to a planet or star is a temperature bath storing energy that it receives from gravity.

It gives him pause for the same reason you can't blow up a box of legos a million times and expecting one time to end up with a lego house. The one time you end up with a house a child will always be involved as the designer. Its to bad Matt Visser cannot imagine somebody arranging each "real" and "virtual" particle of space to build the matrix science is requiring to finish the unification of physics, as easy as he can accept the fact that his child must have a key to the toy box that he locked up the legos in the day before and then came home to a lego house on the bedroom floor. (the toy box did not explode)

There is your evidence farmer. And the interesting thing is the 60 degree coupling angle was written in the bible long before modern day scientists started to discover it. I will guarantee Adam and Noah(whoever or whatever they represent in the bible) knew it though. Because, they passed on, (in oral tradition) that part of the bible that tells how the matrix was established (to an illiterate population that eventually developed written word and wrote it down).

So if gravity is an entropic emergent force that needs matter and a complex structure to exist, then gravity cannot be the driving force behind the creation of matter. Logic tells us that "a let there be light" explanation for the establishment of the higgs field (or something like it) might not be of your liking but, it might be the only logical one.

So, ask and I will explain in detail how the matrices of the Higgs field and matter were created and how they unify physics.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2018 07:03 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Hutton's rewording of Wheywell became the famous quote of the "Present is key to the past", (except when its not). Hutton recognized that certain events in earths history happened so infrequently that maybe they became the source of events like Environmentally induced MASS EXTINCTIONS. When we now consider that such things are impossible to plan for, it was Darwin who , after he came back from his sea voyage on the Beagle and had spent a long time experimenting, soon gave ID a vote of no-confidence because the appearances of life were so tenuous and almost haphazard in their occurence.


That all mass extinctions are always environmentally induced is obvious. Why are they impossible to plan for. We are trying to plan for global warming mass extinction right now, and we didn't even create any of the environment, we just alter it slightly (but, possibly devastatingly). We are experiencing haphazard alterations to the enviroment by intellkigent beings today with global warming, gmo's, DDT, dead spots in the oceans, rivers and lakes, etc. . . Isn't that evidence that intelligence could have been haphazard in the past if the pattern holds true? Looks a lot like the intelligence we observe today. Wouldn't you agree?
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2018 07:06 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
It's easy to give ID a vote of no confidence. In order make ID provable, you need to produce the evidence of the designer. It can't be done, no matter how you approach it. The bible itself is too full of errors, omissions and contradictions; it's not reliable.


Most intelligently produced things have errors. The key is to figure out where the errors are and learn from them. Don't throw the whole works in the garbage because of the errors. There is to much to learn from the part that is right. Besides 90 percent of what you learn is from the mistakes you and others make.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 21 Apr, 2018 11:04 pm
One can assume, therefore, that 90% of what your magic sky daddy does is mistaken?
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2018 04:29 am
@Setanta,
This intelligent designer is SO intelligent that it thought about it waaaay back in the HAdean .It thought to itself,

"Wow, Im gonna have me some fun in about 3.8 Billion years. Im gonna make **** up to appear as if it was just sort of coming to be by dribs and drabs. Then when humans (my penultimate apex being) start using what Ill have them call "SCIENCE", they will have these wonderful discussions on the internet about how I was soooo damn clever to fool the educated smart asses, (Ill have them call themselves "atheists").Im gonna leave all this manufactured evidence to make it appear that nature was behind it all when really, it was all me."

"Dayum, I be smart , I be Me Damned

Wait till they find out that all this will end when I turn everything off".
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2018 05:03 am
@brianjakub,
You really dont think things out too deeply do you??
Quote:
. We are trying to plan for global warming mass extinction right now
You say "planning for global warming", while I say REACTING. If we were so fuckin smart, why didnt we see thi back at the beginning of the Industrial Revolution and why are there still factions of your people still arguing that global warming is "made-up" by evil socialist scientists?

Quote:
Looks a lot like the intelligence we observe today
So what are you saying? Is it that your ID guy was really a committee?
You do realize how idiotic and stretched your "reality" is becoming?? You seem to have to be copsing your arguments to keep em all together. It almost like lying where you really have to be careful about remembering your previou statement.
Science just goes along and lets the evidence present itself. Then the theories get adjusted as more facts appear. No biggie.

Youve entered the new realm of the Incompetent designer era.


_________________________________________________

Why your hyperbole of evolution is kinda bankrupt can be demonstrated by the published works of one of the founders of modern ID, namely William A. Dembski.
In 1999 he wrote,
"Any view of the sciences that leaves Christ out of the picture must be seen as fundamentally deficient ...The conceptual soundness of a scientific theory cannot be maintained apart fro Christ"
ID: The Bridge Between Science and Theology

Then, as the ID movement matured and wished to be taken as a functional scientific worldview, separate from religion he spoke in 2005,
Intelligent design is not an evangelical Christian thing, or a generally Christian thing or even a general theistic thing...Intelligent Design is an emerging scientific research program.Design theorists are attempting to demonstrate its merits fair and square in the scientific world-without appealing to religious authority
Intelligent Design: The Bridge between Science and Theology

See where theres a lot of chicanrey attached to your worldview? I really dont GAS what you believe in, just PUHLEEZE dont try to fake us out with trying to prpeach that your doing actual science. You're Not, and as you get more and more "out there" you keep sawing off the limb that youre sitting on.
laughoutlood
 
  0  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2018 08:08 am
@brianjakub,
Quote:
Putting a definition to name calling explains nothing. Which of my statements contradicts reality and why?


It was this one:

Quote:
God having a penis is consistent with the Eternal Word of God becoming flesh and dwelling among us as a man 2000 years ago. Jesus the Eternal Word of God, is the same God that created the universe, and always existed with God as the Word of God even before he created the universe. He did not come into existence 2000 years ago.


Some people don't understand:

God
God having a penis
God having a penis is consistent
God having a penis is consistent with the Eternal
God having a penis is consistent with the Eternal Word of God
God having a penis is consistent with the Eternal Word of God becoming flesh and dwelling among us as a man 2000 years ago
Jesus the Eternal Word of God
Jesus the Eternal Word of God, is the same God that created the universe
Jesus the Eternal Word of God, is the same God that created the universe, and always existed with God as the Word of God even before he created the universe.
He did not come into existence 2000 years ago.


It doesn't contradict everyone's reality.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 22 Apr, 2018 08:53 am
@brianjakub,
Quote:
There is your evidence farmer. And the interesting thing is the 60 degree coupling angle was written in the bible long before modern day scientists started to discover it.
That silly attempt wasnt even in the ballfield. Youre just trying to blow smoke up my ass by quote mining physics. Do you understand that youre acting incompetent to even participate if you cant distinguish between the evidence that surrounds each field??? Its apparent that you are merely trying to bluff your way through all this while ignoring my simple request.

Heres a relevant question. Why is Avogadro's number important in the biochemistry of genomics
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 11:51 am
@farmerman,
Quote:

You say "planning for global warming", while I say REACTING. If we were so fuckin smart, why didnt we see thi back at the beginning of the Industrial Revolution and why are there still factions of your people still arguing that global warming is "made-up" by evil socialist scientists?


Because we are the intelligent beings that have been a small part of the unvierse for a unknown period of time, not the intelligent being (or beings) that created the whole thing.

Quote:
So what are you saying? Is it that your ID guy was really a committee?
You do realize how idiotic and stretched your "reality" is becoming?? You seem to have to be copsing your arguments to keep em all together. It almost like lying where you really have to be careful about remembering your previou statement.
Science just goes along and lets the evidence present itself. Then the theories get adjusted as more facts appear. No biggie.

Youve entered the new realm of the Incompetent designer era.


The initial design was perfect. There are a lot of intelligent beings involved capable of messing it up (Satan and humans). Environmentalists point out we are screwing up today, so why not in the past.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 12:06 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Heres a relevant question. Why is Avogadro's number important in the biochemistry of genomics


wiki
Quote:
In chemistry and physics, the Avogadro constant (named after the scientist Amedeo Avogadro) is the number of constituent particles, usually atoms or molecules, that are contained in the amount of substance given by one mole. Thus, it is the proportionality factor that relates the molar mass of a substance to the mass of a sample. The Avogadro constant, often designated with the symbol NA or L, has the value 6.022140857(74)×1023 mol−1[1] in the International System of Units (SI).[2][3] (The parentheses there represent the degree of uncertainty.)

A much simpler definition is that Avogadro's constant is the conversion factor for converting grams to atomic mass units.


For that constant to exist, every atomic mass unit which, is an electron proton pair or neutron, (no matter where it is in matter and no matter where that matter is in the universe) is storing the same amount of energy as inertia relative to the higgs field (otherwise known as the false vacuum). That energy is stored in the space inside an atom(which could be viewed as a separate universe) as order.

What physics is having a hard time admitting is that, the order is arrived at by combining two higgs bosons and accelerating, them to the temperature of the surrounding higgs field, to create an atomic mass unit.

I am not blowing smoke, I just know something that most people don't.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 12:08 pm
The discussion here has gotten truly bizarre.

0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 12:14 pm
Warning! NSFW

Help, I'm steppin' into the twilight zone
Place is a madhouse, feels like being cloned
My beacon's been moved under moon and star
Where am I to go now that I've gone too far?
Soon you will come to know
When the bullet hits the bone


brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 01:54 pm
@Setanta,
The Higgs field interact with matter to give it mass. The question is what does a expose on an atomic mass unit look like so that the atomic orbitals always look the way they do? Do you have an answer for that setanta?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 02:09 pm
Your initial statement is false. A Higgs field, the existence of which is purely speculative, may interact with matter through the agency of the Higgs boson. You are always serving up statements from authority, when the pseudo-scientific word salad that you routinely spout gives no confidence that you have any authority from which to make your statements.

I continue to believe that you are only obsessed with the Higgs boson because come joker called it the god particle, and you're all about your magic sky daddy. Higgs himself disparages the term "god particle" because it is misleading, irrelevant and does nothing to help understand his hypothesis.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 02:28 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:

For that constant to exist, every atomic mass unit which, is an electron proton pair or neutron, (no matter where it is in matter and no matter where that matter is in the universe) is storing the same amount of energy as inertia relative to the higgs field (otherwise known as the false vacuum).
stick to your day job.

0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 02:31 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
Because we are the intelligent beings that have been a small part of the unvierse for a unknown period of time, not the intelligent being (or beings) that created the whole thing.


ee ho your "logic" begins with a presupposition that is left hanging unevidenced??
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 03:07 pm
@Setanta,
You're exactly right I should've said to Higgs field reacts through the mechanism of the Higgs boson. It is speculative but is the best thing we have so far. And real scientists really believe in it and as a possible solution.

I believe in the Higgs bozon and the Higgs field because I am pretty sure I figured out what the Higgs field and Higgs boson looks like. I believe the Higgs field has a matrix type structure and there are virtual higgs bosons everywhere in empty space. But where they come into contact with matter they give matter mass and, the matrix is disturbed ( symmetry is broken ) by that matter
Helloandgoodbye
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 03:36 pm
@Setanta,

I know deep down you, or others do not truly think it is reasonable to assume that 90% of everything created is a mistake.....That the designer is to blame for the ‘breakdowns’ in this world.

It seems reasonable to assume that the designer created a smooth running machine, and he gave mankind instructions/laws/commandments on how to care for it, yet we chose to put oil in the washer fluid compartment ya know?
You, I and the rest of humanity are to blame for ‘screwing up’ his creation. (Sin) and explains ‘mans misery.’

And in the end, only those who acknowledge the benefits of his way of life and desire to submit to it, will do so, And of course experience the benefits! Hope you make the right choice that leads to Life!

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 05:18 pm
@Helloandgoodbye,
Quote:
It seems reasonable to assume that the designer created a smooth running machine,
+
No. It is not "reasonable" to assume such a thing without direct evidence. Even homo sapiens evolved from primates. There is evidence for it.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Apr, 2018 05:22 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Your logic begins with the presupposition that is left hanging unevidenced
I have done more research than you have and accept things as evidence that you don't, And I know things that you don't know yet. Keep asking. It's a big picture .
 

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