Diversity of Everything but Thought

Well, us Grinches (those of us with a relatively smaller deep limbic system) shopped at Macy's just the same as always. This grinch also shopped at Nordstrom, Dillard's, Neiman Marcus, BeBe, Carlyn Gallerie, online product outlets and some store that sells cheap silver jewelry on Preston Rd. in Preston Center. I rarely shop at Target, so what I did there doesn't count. Oh, and I almost forgot, at Saks on 5th Ave.

Just because there were no kettles outside some stores doesn't mean I didn't donate for Christmas. I prefer to do my giving through the mail or online. I experience the sad, guilt provoking look in the eye I get from Salvation Army workers every time I enter a store at Christmas time as an invasion of my privacy and it annoys me as well.

And it's not very Christian to annoy the Grinches at Christmas. One must be loving with Grinches to soften them up. Turn the other cheek and so forth. I give because I want to, to causes I believe in, not because someone made me feel guilty or gives me an opportunity to show off how generous I am in public.

As far as I'm concerned I would prefer the Salvation Army use direct mail for their fund raising. It brings in more money and doesn't annoy customers like me at department stores. And so what, if the middle men make money raising funds as well? Everyone deserves to make a living for the work they do and besides, it boosts the economy. In the long run everyone benefits. More money for the charities, more money for the owners and employees of the direct mail businesses and therefore a better reward for the effort.

But that's just the opinion of this one self described grinch. I recognize others like to give by other methods and experience the kettles from a different perspective than I do. So when they're there, I ignore them. I didn't discriminate based on whether there was a Salvation Army person ringing a bell when I entered the store....not that I wouldn't have if it wouldn't have inconvenienced me so much.

Good for Macy's for trying to be equal and fair in their treatment of the holiday season..........speaking of open minded tolerance and freedom of speech. Some of us want to demand it of our profs in university.........but don't let the department stores get too uppity when it comes to "diversity." Too bad there are so many vindictive Christians out there.

Vindictive Christian an oxymoron? One would think. However it takes all kinds to make a movement, religious or otherwise. I'm betting there are as many Christian grinches as there are non-Christian.

Ideology has to do with thinking (the prefrontal cortex). The "heart" is located in the limbic system of the human brain. The amount of love and charity one feels is based on the size and activity level (from one moment to the next) of the deep limbic system, and the pre-frontal cortex has little to do with it, other than offer a method for how to express it.

It's all in the motivation and drive. Ideology is only one method for implementation. A single ideology can be used as an expression of many emotions including hate and retribution.

Here's a Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas wish for all of my friends on a2k. And I'll offer a toast, <Champagne in hand> here's to diversity in both thought and affect.

Quote:

Always look on the bright side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the light side of life.
[whistling]

If life seems jolly rotten,
There's something you've forgotten,
And that's to laugh and smile and dance and sing.
When you're feeling in the dumps,
Don't be silly chumps.
Just purse your lips and whistle. That's the thing.
And...

Always look on the bright side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the right side of life,
[whistling]

For life is quite absurd
And death's the final word.
You must always face the curtain with a bow.
Forget about your sin.
Give the audience a grin.
Enjoy it. It's your last chance, anyhow.
So,...

Always look on the bright side of death,
[whistling]
Just before you draw your terminal breath.
[whistling]

Life's a piece of sh!t,
When you look at it.
Life's a laugh and death's a joke. It's true.
You'll see it's all a show.
Keep 'em laughing as you go.
Just remember that the last laugh is on you.
And...

Always look on the bright side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the right side of life.
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]
Always look on the bright side of life!
[whistling]

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Well, I shopped at Saks OFF 5th Smile

(The one in LaJolla).

I plan to retire soon LOL. (Despite the predictions of the gormless Krugman) Smile

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Quote:

I plan to retire soon LOL.

I've been thinking about it myself. But have decided against it. Laughing

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Lola wrote:

Yes, DTOM.....maybe the paleocons and neocons will duke it out : ... I know............it's off topic.....or is it?

OK! It does look like neo-cons and paleo-cons are battling with each other, and that they both state falsities (knowingly or unknowingly) about as often as classical-cons, classical-libs, paleo-libs and neo-libs. I now would like to a replace a statement I previously posted here with the following one. Political labels introduced into debate preclude tolerance for competing opinions, because the definitions of these labels appear to rapidly change as expedient, and they eventually take on the appearance of expletives. In otherwords, they are merely "living labels" sort of like a "living constitution." Crying or Very sad

So I am an alpha-omega. What's an alpha-omega? An alpha-omega is whatever I say it is from time to time! :wink:

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little wheel spin and spin, big wheel go round and round.

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Definitions:

rednecks = those voters who voted the same as the majority of voters in the red states or the same as the minority of voters in the blue states.

bluenecks = those voters who voted the same as the majority of voters in blue states or who voted the same as the minority of voters in red states.

Valid Generalizations:

rednecks voted for George Bush.

bluenecks voted for John Kerry.

rednecks are fallible.

bluenecks are fallible.

Source:

I'm a redneck.

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Foxfyre wrote:

Yep, neither Macys nor Target got any of my Christmas money that I chose to spend in places that did allow Salvation Army bell ringers. To me, without charity and good will, Christmas is meaningless.

I suspect we'll see the kettles back next year. Or not. Everybody is entitled to their preferences, and I won't blackball or even lead a protest against a store for exercising theirs. But I will mostly patronize a business establishment who at least appreciates that not everybody has the Grinch's tiny heart.

true foxy. doesn't really matter (to me, anyway) why a person celebrates "the holidays", ie, "christmas", "chanuka", "winter solstice", "saturnalia", "kwanzaa", whatever.

the spirit of "the season" gives us all at least a short period to relax, be friendly, enjoy family, eat and drink well etc.

i really thought that the flap over the sal army was just silly. what's the harm? don't dig it? walk on by and don't give anything. your lack of charity only deprives you of that little glow that comes from the act of kindness.

a buddy of mine, who's read a lot of philosophy, told me once about a quote by detoqueville, i think. basically the idea was that as "peoples" rights increased, it would eventually come to a point where nobody would have any rights because any individuals exercising a right would intrude on somebody else's rights.

what did surprise me about my encounters with s.a. bell ringers this year was that after i dumped a few dollars worth of change into a kettle (with no bell ringing before or after ), i got a distracted stare and silence.

so i wished the person a merry christmas and got a mumbled something or other back.

now that was a bummer.

btw, foxy... here in glendale, about 45% of the population is armenian. so for glendalians, "christmas" goes till about january 7 or 8.

cool. get to look at the lights an extra week !

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Well I'm not Armenian and don't even belong to one of the high churches that celebrate the full 12 days of Christmas (beginning with Christmas Day), but my tree is still up and the lights are still out, mostly because we haven't had time to take them down.

Meanwhile on the issue of Townhall, from their website in the "about us" section:

Quote:

Townhall.com is the first truly interactive community on the Internet to bring Internet users, conservative public policy organizations, congressional staff, and political activists together under the broad umbrella of "conservative" thoughts, ideas and actions. Townhall.com is a one-stop mall of ideas in which people congregate to exchange, discuss and disseminate the latest news and information from the conservative movement. Townhall.com is committed to inform, educate and empower the public through this emerging electronic medium.

The member organizations and columnists that we have chosen to feature on Townhall.com do not necessarily agree on every issue, yet that is why Townhall.com believes our community is of value. An interactive, open and honest debate of the issues within the conservative community will help us all in the fight against those who would sacrifice the individual and freedom for political gain and big government.

Townhall is project of the Heritage Foundation.

Some will dismiss it because it admittedly and unashamedly focuses on conservative thought. It also points out that not conservatives don't agree on every issue and they see that as valuable. That, in my mind, is tolerance for diversity of thought.

(Again, no matter what some in this thread have said, the 'columnists they feature' write for mainstream magazines and newspapers and the writings are copied onto the Townhall website after being published elsewhere much as you find on the New Republic site which is tilted as left as Townhall is right. I also enjoy (and have posted) many thought provoking essays from the New Republic site.)

At least there are some of us who think diversity of thought allows room for different points of view.

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And to be fair, here's what The New Republic says about themselves:

Quote:

When The New Republic was founded in 1914, its mission was to provide its readers with an intelligent, stimulating and rigorous examination of American politics, foreign policy and culture. It has brilliantly maintained its mission for ninety years.

Headquartered in Washington, DC, The New Republic is uniquely positioned to cover public affairs from an insider's vantage point. Our editors are among the most respected and influential journalists in the country, known for their uncanny ability to get at the important stories long before they reach other media.

The New Republic covers issues before they hit the mainstream, from energy to the environment, from foreign to fiscal policy. By publishing the best writing from a variety of viewpoints -- including those from arts and culture, with literary criticism that sets the standard in the academy and among general readers alike -- The New Republic continues to be America's best and most influential journal of opinion.

In addition to a weekly print magazine, The New Republic now publishes a daily web magazine featuring online-only analysis of politics and culture.

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The bombast and self-seving hype of media PRmeisters is irrelevant.
The juvenile, narcissistic strutting, preening and posing impresses only the dull-witted.

What really counts is the opinions of informed and objective observers... that nucleus of society which may visit the fringes but eschews dwelling there.

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Quote:

Some will dismiss it [townhall.com] because it admittedly and unashamedly focuses on conservative thought. It also points out that not conservatives don't agree on every issue and they see that as valuable. That, in my mind, is tolerance for diversity of thought.

Focuses on conservative thought?

What it actually does is exclude any other voice. That's propaganda, not journalism. It's mission is the mission of its founding organization, Heritage...
"to formulate and promote conservative public policies based on the principles of free enterprise, limited government, individual freedom, traditional American values, and a strong national defense."

Conservatives don't agree on every issue?

Nor do Marxists, Klan members, and anti-semites. To suggest this means 'diversity' is to redefine the term to its opposite.

By way of contrast, the TNR site has, as its lead commentary, a column by Conservative Andrew Sullivan.

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I ran across this site while researching Coalition for Revival which is a highly secretive coalition of 500 or more fanatical "Christian" leaders. (I'm still doing my research on COR so I don't know much about it yet. But information is hard to find. Now I'm also interested in Christian Action, I'll keep you informed.) I thought you might like to see the source of some of the hype about liberalism in universities. Enjoy.

http://www.christianaction.org.za/articles_ca/2004-4-UniversitiesHighjackingOurYouth.htm

Quote:

Universities: Highjacking Our Youth?
If any army was to lose three quarters of its forces it would not be considered a defeat -but a disaster. Statistically, 75% of young people from Christian homes who enrol at university are lost to the church.

Universities have not always been the temples of secular humanism and cesspools of moral decadence they have all too often become today. There was a time when universities were centres of Biblical Reformation. Many of the greatest Christian Reformers were university professors.

John Wycliffe, the "morning star of the Reformation," was a professor at Oxford University. It was John Wycliffe who first translated the New Testament (from Latin) into English and mobilised the Lollards to travel throughout England to read, preach and sing the Scriptures - in English.

John Hus the great Reformer of Bohemia, who was burned at the stake at Constance, was the Rector of the University of Prague.

The great German Reformer, Martin Luther was a professor at the University of Wittenburg.

The Reformer, John Calvin, was the founder of the Academy of Geneva which trained Reformers who transformed nations.

The English Reformer, William Tyndale, was a graduate of Oxford University and studied at Cambridge. At that time both Oxford and Cambridge were described as "hotbeds" of Biblical Reformation. Tyndale was a gifted scholar and linguist who managed to translate the New Testament from the original Greek, and most of the Old Testament from Hebrew, into English. He had these "illegal Scriptures" printed in Germany and smuggled the contraband into England in bales of cotton. For this he was burned at the stake in 1536.

The very name "university" testifies to its Christian origins. "University" means one truth. Most professors today don't even believe that there is an objective truth. What has happened that Western universities, which were mostly founded by Christians and which often produced such dedicated Christian Reformers, have now become synonymous with immorality, perversion and anti-Christian hostility?

One parent observed that the cost of giving his child the education he never had, in university, was just over R240 000. In America I saw an article written by one grieving parent entitled:
"I Spent $75000 To Send My Child To Hell!"

Many parents are determined that their child will get the education that they never had. Thanks to some radical evolutionists and secular humanist professors, many young people are indeed obtaining the education that their parents never had. But this education often has little to do with anything academic. Situation ethics, radical feminism, homosexual "alternative lifestyles", socialist economics, revisionist Marxist history, secular humanist religion, existentialist philosophy, and blind anti-Christian prejudice, antagonism and hatred predominate on campus.

Indeed, it could cost you R240000 to send your child to hell. Would you be willing to take a R240000 gamble? More to the point, would you be willing to gamble R240000 and your son or daughter's future? It is extraordinary how many Christian parents are willing to sacrifice and pay good money to see their children indoctrinated by anti-Christian professors.

The fact is: sending our children to college is a huge investment, both financially, and spiritually. Before sending them to university, we should ensure that they are practically and spiritually prepared to deal with the issues, temptations and pressures that they will inevitably face there.

The Summit Youth Leadership and Worldview Training Course has been designed to equip students with the facts and the skills they need to deal with humanism and evolutionism. The Summit is a crash course to enable students to understand and articulate the Christian worldview, to enable them to answer the toughest questions and to practically prepare them so that they can respond to every challenge to their Christian faith with confidence.

Christianity is not for the weak minded. It is not enough to simply believe. You have to know what you believe and why you believe it. And you need to be able to defend it. The Summit will enable you to understand and respond in a Biblical way to everything from relativism to dualism, from Hollywood to humanism, from Marxism to Islam. The Summit can change your life.

At the Summit you will encounter dedicated Christians seeking to live with integrity and deal honestly and intelligently with life's challenges. The Summit is packed full with mind stretching and life altering learning and soul searching. It includes lots of fun, fellowship, hiking, volleyball and water sports and many lifelong friendships begin there.

The Summit is great value for time and money. Some have commented that it was the best investment that they have ever made. The Summit is packed full with cutting edge research, films, presentations and valuable insights.

If you don't want your son or daughter to be conformed to this world, but to be an effective Christian witness at university, send them to this great survival course for the Christian mind and soul.

"And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may approve what is that good, and acceptable and perfect will of God." Romans 12:2

Our universities should not be doomed to decadence. By God's grace, they can once again become centres of Biblical Reformation. We need to thoroughly prepare and equip our young people to be salt and light for the decadence and darkness of secular university - to make an impact for Christ.

"See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ." Colossians 2:8

Peter Hammond

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Anecdotally:

I saw it over and over during my undergrad days. The students who had lived the most sheltered lives were the ones most given to excesses of drinking and risky sex.

They hadn't been taught how to deal with temptation.

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I agree DrewDad.....it seems to be so in the experience of my children who are in college now. My daughter wrote me an email saying, "you wouldn't believe it! These kids who have never been allowed or required to make a decision for themselves are all going crazy."

It does illustrate the danger involved in too much guidance, protection, manipulation or coercion in parenting practices. These kids have little internal guidance and are vulerable to the pressure of others.

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hi lola, drew...

similar experiences here as well. beyond the religious types, i noticed that even "secular" strictness produced the wilder kids in the neighborhood. prohibition breeds desire. education breeds thought and responsibility. doesn't always work, but neither does deep immersion in religion.

either way, i'm really getting tired of hearing all of the mumbo jumbo about "secularism" and "family values". it may be the self appointed role of evangelicals to "spread the good word", but for those of us who already have a relationship with the creator or a different religion, it's just plain offensive to have someone in your face all of the time intimating that "you are going to hell".

cool. i'll save you a seat.

and when you tell this type of christian to back off, the little violins come out and i have to here all about the persecution of christians and anti-christian sentiments.

telling a person to back off isn't persecution and saying mind your own business isn't anti-christian.

by the same token, claiming how "tolerant" you are only serves to highlight your own elitism and arrogance. tolerant of what? someone not being you ?

i keep wondering who these people are trying to convince. me? or themselves?

Idea

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Quote:

i keep wondering who these people are trying to convince. me? or themselves?

My thoughts exactly, DTOM.

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Well I agree that being accosted on the streets by fantatical evangelists of any faith is intrusive and offensive to me, and I will also step around them, ignore them, or, if they persist, will tell them to back off. I agree to defend yourself in this way is not unChristian or unanything. (On the other hand I sometimes invite the Jehovah Witnesses in just for the apportunity to annoy them, but that's another story.)

Tolerance to me is that I will allow you your faith, belief, ideology and I appreciate being allowed mine. That we are different does not automatically mean one of us is evil or even necessarily wrong.

So long as that fundamental is applied, we can debate our various beliefs, convictions, points of view to the ends of the earth and thereby might even find ourselves better educated than we would be if we were exposed only to our own point of view.

It is that kind of tolerance of diversity of thought that I would want for any person attending any institution of learning.

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Lola wrote:

Quote:
i keep wondering who these people are trying to convince. me? or themselves?

My thoughts exactly, DTOM.

i always chuckle when i think about something my pop told me; he is a christian.

one day the doorbell rang at the house in east tennessee.

there's two fellas standin' there with there bibles and little xeroxed papers.

they engage the old man in a conversation about god and jesus for a minute or so.

one asks pop, "wellsir, are ya a christian"?

pop says, "yup".

the other fella asks, "have ya been born again" ?

without blinking, pop replies, "nope. got it right the first time".

they just looked at him...

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Completely agree, Fox. I think that most students at most institutions of higher learning have exactly that environment; it is one of the beauties of college.

Cycloptichorn

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Foxfyre wrote:

we can debate our various beliefs, convictions, points of view to the ends of the earth and thereby might even find ourselves better educated than we would be if we were exposed only to our own point of view.

It is that kind of tolerance of diversity of thought that I would want for any person attending any institution of learning.

same here. look, i don't dislike religious people. but as you say, religious fanatics drive me stark raving. some of the stuff is so bizarre and histrionic ridden, it must be for show.

at thanksgiving, my brother in law told me a story about a mechanic he just tried. he went out to the shop to check on the progress. the guy is standing there, with the hood up, praying over the engine !

to me, that is just plain weird...

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Diversity of Everything but Thought

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