Homosexual Marriage defeated by WIDE Margins

Cycloptichorn wrote:

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What "changes"? There have been gay people for a lot longer than the past few years.

Watch the Bravo channel for an evening and then come back and ask me if our society has changed re: gays in the last few decades....

Cycloptichorn

What has changed about gay people in the past few years? Are thye more gay? Less gay? I don't understand.

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McG wrote

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Some people fail to understand that for other people marriage is a sacrament equal to birth, baptism, communion with God, death. Marriage is a life changing event between themselves, their spouse and their God. To them, gay marriage is an affront to their beliefs. Whether we understand that or not is immaterial. To them gay marriage is simply unspeakable.

So what?No one is asking that they be a party to it. The problem with religious people is they are under the impression, that based upon their beliefs, they have the right to dictate to everyone else. Typical the intolerance of religion. Religion belongs at home and in places of worship not in the legislative process.

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au1929 wrote:

McG wrote

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Some people fail to understand that for other people marriage is a sacrament equal to birth, baptism, communion with God, death. Marriage is a life changing event between themselves, their spouse and their God. To them, gay marriage is an affront to their beliefs. Whether we understand that or not is immaterial. To them gay marriage is simply unspeakable.

So what?No one is asking that they be a party to it. The problem with religious people is they are under the impression, that based upon their beliefs, they have the right to dictate to everyone else. Typical the intolerance of religion. Religion belongs at home and in places of worship not in the legislative process.

And you are being "tolerant" by grouping everyone that is religious into one neat little group?

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MgC wrote

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Having a country with a strong religious core hardly makes it a theocracy a religious fundamentalist state.

It is the precursor.

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It certainly seems to be on the track to becoming a religious fundamentalist state. The changes heading in that direction seem to be speeding up over the past 10 - 15 years.

America was founded on the dreams of some extraordinary, forward-thinking people. People who saw the dangers in mixing government and religion. It's sad to witness the devaluation of those dreams and hopes.

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The precursor to what?

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cannistershot
And what if not the religious community drives the campaign against Gay Marriage.

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au1929 wrote:

McG wrote

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Some people fail to understand that for other people marriage is a sacrament equal to birth, baptism, communion with God, death. Marriage is a life changing event between themselves, their spouse and their God. To them, gay marriage is an affront to their beliefs. Whether we understand that or not is immaterial. To them gay marriage is simply unspeakable.

So what?No one is asking that they be a party to it. The problem with religious people is they are under the impression, that based upon their beliefs, they have the right to dictate to everyone else. Typical the intolerance of religion. Religion belongs at home and in places of worship not in the legislative process.

The problem with non-religious people is they are under the impression, that based upon their beliefs, they have the right to dictate to everyone else.

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ehBeth wrote:

It certainly seems to be on the track to becoming a religious fundamentalist state. The changes heading in that direction seem to be speeding up over the past 10 - 15 years.

America was founded on the dreams of some extraordinary, forward-thinking people. People who saw the dangers in mixing government and religion. It's sad to witness the devaluation of those dreams and hopes.

Then why is God mentioned in every document written by the founding fathers?

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cannistershot wrote

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The precursor to what?

Shall I spell it out? A T h o c r a c y. Twisted Evil

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ehBeth wrote:

It certainly seems to be on the track to becoming a religious fundamentalist state. The changes heading in that direction seem to be speeding up over the past 10 - 15 years.

America was founded on the dreams of some extraordinary, forward-thinking people. People who saw the dangers in mixing government and religion. It's sad to witness the devaluation of those dreams and hopes.

Who here remembers the 1950's? (I wasn't born yet, but my parents grew up then.)

Would you say that the country was more religious then than in the late 60's, early 70's? Amazingly enough, the 50's did not lead to a society filled with Taliban like exclusions on women and minorities. We survived... maybe for the better, maybe for the worse.

Crime rates have certainly been up since, as has drug use and abortion rates. Comparing the status of religion in America today to being like a Taliban regime is completely absurd. It's a tactic. Nothing more. The anti-religious fervor being beaten into the heads of the liberals in our society should give every one in America a moment to pause and think for a moment what it is exactly they are opposing. A belief in God? Is that such a bad thing thing that some people should have a different belief system than you?

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"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between church and State."

--Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptist Association on Jan. 1, 1802, _The_Writings_of_Thomas_Jefferson_Memorial_Edition_, edited by Lipscomb and Bergh, 1903-04, 16:281

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au1929 wrote:

cannistershot
And what if not the religious community drives the campaign against Gay Marriage.

I didn't say that it wasn't read the post. Are you any better than the people that you are talking about if you are putting ALL religious people into one group?

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"No religious reading, instruction or exercise, shall be prescribed or practiced [in the elementary schools] inconsistent with the tenets of any religious sect or denomination."

--Thomas Jefferson, Elementary school Act, 1817, _The_Writings_of_Thomas_Jefferson_Memorial_Edition_, edited by Lipscomb and Bergh, 10:305

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"Christianity...(has become) the most perverted system that ever shone on man. ...Rogueries, absurdities and untruths were perpetrated upon the teachings of Jesus by a large band of dupes and imposters led by Paul, the first great corrupter of the teaching of Jesus."

--Thomas Jefferson

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au1929 wrote:

cannistershot wrote

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The precursor to what?

Shall I spell it out? A T h o c r a c y.

A WHAT? :wink:

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"Ecclesiastical establishments tend to great ignorance and all of which facilitates the execution of mischievous projects. Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise, every expanded project."

James Madison

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"All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian, or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit."

--Thomas Paine, _The_Age_of_Reason

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"The adulterous connection between church and state."

-Thomas Paine, from _The_Age_of_Reason_

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"Persecution is not an original feature in any religion; but it is always the strongly marked feature of all law-religions, or religions established by law."

Thomas Paine, _The_Rights_of_Man_, 1791, ed P.S. Foner, 1945

These were very modern men.

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ehBeth, shall we start a new thread stating various quotes from historical figures?

"Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports . . . . And let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. . . . reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle."

--George Washington's Farewell Address published on September 19, 1796.

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Mcg wrote

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The problem with non-religious people is they are under the impression, that based upon their beliefs, they have the right to dictate to everyone else.

Apparently you don't understand the difference between allowing people the freedom of action and mandating thou shall not.
If we allow people the freedom of action they can participate or not as they see fit. On the other hand if we legislate against freedom of action there is no choice.
Do you see and understand the difference. Freedom of choice is the way of tolerance and the religious view is as always intolerant.

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Homosexual Marriage defeated by WIDE Margins

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