200,000 Votes Disqualified in Florida!

dlowan wrote:

Has anybody addressed the reality of this alleged 200,000 vote fraud?

If it is real, then I think it amazing, in a much vaunted superior deoocracy, that such a level is tolerated, with a simple, c'est la vie.

It is a partisan projection, pure speculation, nothing more.

Larry434 wrote:

dlowan wrote:

Has anybody addressed the reality of this alleged 200,000 vote fraud?

If it is real, then I think it amazing, in a much vaunted superior deoocracy, that such a level is tolerated, with a simple, c'est la vie.

It is a partisan projection, pure speculation, nothing more.

Is it? I looked here - and didn't SEE any analysis or factual reasoning about it - and I am not equipped to debate it myself. What are your rasons for saying so, Larry?

Any knowledgeable, non-polemic, opinions re the accusation?

America doesn't want to stand toe-to-toe... it wants its toe on the neck of the rest of the world.

Democrats register more new voters, analysis finds

The Associated Press
Published Tuesday, October 19, 2004

The Democrats appear to be gaining the upper hand in the battle to sign up new voters in the all-important swing states, an Associated Press analysis suggests.

The AP analysis of the most up-to-date figures from across the country found that in every state where complete data are available, the Democrats have registered more new voters than Republicans. They have the edge in Arizona, Iowa, New Mexico, Nevada and New Hampshire.

Only in Florida is the story different. Registration tallies from more than half the counties show that the Republicans and the Democrats are virtually tied in the race to increase their share of voters in the state that decided the presidential election four years ago. In those counties, the Republicans have signed up just a few thousand more.

As for the two other big prizes among the swing states - Pennsylvania and Ohio - Pennsylvania's numbers are too scant to draw any conclusions, and Ohio does not register voters by party.

"We're living politics right now, everywhere you turn," said Kevin Glat, auditor in Burleigh County, N.D. "It was such a close race four years ago that people are finally coming to the realization that every vote does count."

Now the real test is whether the parties can get these newly registered voters to the polls. New voters are often less likely than others to actually cast ballots.

"It's the end-all, be-all. Nothing matters unless they show up to vote," said Mindy Tucker Fletcher with the Florida GOP.

With 2000 as a warning and the latest polls showing this election very close in eight critical states, the latest registration numbers could be pivotal.

In New Hampshire, a state that George W. Bush won by 7,211 votes in 2000, the Democrats have signed up 6,814 more new voters than the Republicans have. The Democratic rolls rose by 3.7 percent, compared with a scant 0.2 percent for the GOP.

In Iowa, Democrats have registered 42,074 more of their supporters than the GOP - this in a state Bush lost by just more than 4,000 votes.

In New Mexico, the Republicans increased their share of voters by 9 percent, and Democrats increased their share by 7.7 percent. But the Democrats still added nearly 10,000 more voters. The voter rolls grew overall at 7.6 percent in Arizona, with Democrats seeing a 7.5 percent increase and Republicans 6.1 percent.

States are seeing a boom in registration that is swamping election offices with paperwork.

Nevada's Washoe and Clark counties, which account for 85 percent of the state's population, reported 231,688 new voters, a jump of more than a quarter from just a few months ago. The rise is more than three times the number that signed up in the months before the 2000 election.

Washington state reported a record 46 percent increase over 2000's rolls; Ohio saw a 10 percent rise in the past few months.

The analysis does not provide a complete picture of voter registration because some states had not finished counting and others only report on a county basis. The analysis sought a fair sampling of counties to reflect each state's larger political demographics.

http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=381&row=0

Block the Vote - By Paul Krugman
The New York Times
Friday, October 15, 2004

The case of Florida's felon list - used by state officials, as in 2000, to try to wrongly disenfranchise thousands of blacks - has been widely reported. Less widely reported has been overwhelming evidence that the errors were deliberate.

In an article coming next week in Harper's, Greg Palast, who originally reported the story of the 2000 felon list, reveals that few of those wrongly purged from the voting rolls in 2000 are back on the voter lists. State officials have imposed Kafkaesque hurdles for voters trying to get back on the rolls. Depending on the county, those attempting to get their votes back have been required to seek clemency for crimes committed by others, or to go through quasi-judicial proceedings to prove that they are not felons with similar names.

And officials appear to be doing their best to make voting difficult for those blacks who do manage to register. Florida law requires local election officials to provide polling places where voters can cast early ballots. Duval County is providing only one such location, when other counties with similar voting populations are providing multiple sites. And in Duval and other counties the early voting sites are miles away from precincts with black majorities.

**********

The BBC documentary of Palast's report on Florida and more - "Bush Family Fortunes" - premiers in New York this Sunday, in Washington Monday. For info go to www.Greg Palast.com

**********

Krugman continues:

Next week, I'll address the question of whether the votes of Floridians with the wrong color skin will be fully counted if they are cast. Mr. Palast notes that in the 2000 election, almost 180,000 Florida votes were rejected because they were either blank or contained overvotes. Demographers from the U.S. Civil Rights Commission estimate that 54 percent of the spoiled ballots were cast by blacks. And there's strong evidence that this spoilage didn't reflect voters' incompetence: it was caused mainly by defective voting machines and may also reflect deliberate vote-tampering.

The important point to realize is that these abuses aren't aberrations. They're the inevitable result of a Republican Party culture in which dirty tricks that distort the vote are rewarded, not punished. It's a culture that will persist until voters - whose will still does count, if expressed strongly enough - hold that party accountable.

Piffka--

Ask yourself what other countries would do with the unmatched power we have. We're pretty damn decent with it. Don't be ashamed of our military. Don't be ashamed of our wealth or prestige. We earned it. If not us, who?

What do you think THEY would be doing with unmatched power?

You already have your answer for a couple of countries.

I don't understand how any American is so ashamed of their country's success.

God, you're quite the unhappy American, Piffka. Everything from you about America is so incredibly negative. Like nothing good ever happened here.

Nobody said America is perfect--just pretty damn good. All you ever talk about is the 'invasions' and the 'realpolitic' errors... Plenty of countries have errors in their pasts. We're not the only one.

Its a little nuts to believe I'm congratulating myself on my prestige. (My prestige--that's funny...) But only a blind idiot would say the US doesn't have wealth or the prestige that goes along with it.

Americans give plenty to charitable causes in the US and abroad. Your perception of this country is squewed horribly negative. I think you and people like you do the US a great disservice. It's not as bad as you always say it is.

Lash wrote:

Piffka--

Ask yourself what other countries would do with the unmatched power we have. We're pretty damn decent with it. Don't be ashamed of our military. Don't be ashamed of our wealth or prestige. We earned it. If not us, who?

What do you think THEY would be doing with unmatched power?

You already have your answer for a couple of countries.

I don't understand how any American is so ashamed of their country's success.

Well, I have never been impressed with success built on the labors of others
The success of the country is the total of the success of all of us--and the living standard is a result of the success of all of us. Why do you act as though we have a slave population?
nor do I applaud the wealth of people who use unfair tactics to get it.
Who are you talking about? What unfair tactics?
I am disgusted by the machinations of the Republican party and I can only hope for their swift decline.
The Republican party has the same goals for this country as the Democrats do--just different methods of acheiving them--What exactly makes the Republican party so much worse in your opinion?
So, it is true, I don't understand you, either. You are such an apologist for the actions of this country.
An apologist finds some excuse for everything negative. I don't fit this definition. I add the positive when applicable.
Have you ever studied history, Lash, in-depth and without prejudice?
Yes. I wonder if you have...
How can you think invading countries is pretty damned decent?
Ridiculous. You condemn the entire history and good of a country because of some negatives? Which are your preferred, inerrant countries?
Who do you think sold Saddam Hussein the nasty weapons he used on the Kurds?
Not our best decision. But, I don't think we should dismantle the place.
How can you possibly believe that the incredible government protections of our corporations' wealth is earned other than through graft and political favors?
Is that really how you think America has made money? No innovation? No hard work? No ingenuity? Just corruption? And, this is a particularly American phenomena?
I would rather we took the money we spent to create our "unmatched power" and used it for good rather than our self-centered and paranoid foreign policy. Why, in fact, does the United States not only want to be the "bully" of the world but demand that as our right?
We weren't such a bully until a couple of countries tried to take over the world. Try to think of us as a really prepared country...Europe didn't seem to mind our 'unmatched power' when the Soviets were knocking on their door. Now, suddenly, it's arrogant to be loaded for bear...
Yet what else is this unmatched power? Americans are absolutely fearful and made to feel that way even more by this wretched administration.
They didn't film 911 in a sound studio. You should feel secure.
It is almost hilarious, if it weren't so incredibly hypocritical, that this same supposedly God-Fearing Christian Right would rather kill than help,
Who would rather kill than help? We help plenty. Who are we supposed to be helping, who we're not?.
and encourages the hoarding of wealth rather than taking care of the working class.
What more should we be doing for the working class?
It is absurd that you can't see that and instead congratulate yourself on what you think of as earned prestige.
I can't see how you think I've congratulated myself about anything. I just feel very fortunate to live in America.