192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -3  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 12:54 pm
@layman,
What this tells us is that Newsweek perceives that there is a sizeable market of consumers disconnected with reality. I'm sure they are correct since fakirs like the Long Island Medium are making big bucks.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -4  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 12:56 pm
@maporsche,
What was the compromise?

The shutdown was a tactical move by the Dems. If they thought it was working they would not have compromised.

They folded

You really need to stop believing that your tribe is all about sweetness and light.
camlok
 
  0  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 12:58 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
You really need to stop believing that your tribe is all about sweetness and light.


Is this hypocritical, Finn?
maporsche
 
  5  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:05 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

What was the compromise?

The shutdown was a tactical move by the Dems. If they thought it was working they would not have compromised.

They folded

You really need to stop believing that your tribe is all about sweetness and light.


You need to stop assuming this is tribal Finn. I'm actively trying to look at this objectively, without lenses.

The debate on DACA wasn't happening before now, despite democrats asking to have this debate for months. That's new.

Also, almost nothing happened to anyone due to the shutdown. No paychecks were missed. The shutdown was pretty much inconsequential (outside of the news).
BillW
 
  2  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:06 pm
@camlok,
camlok wrote:

Quote:
You really need to stop believing that your tribe is all about sweetness and light.


Is this hypocritical, Finn?


No, it is bullying and resentful.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -1  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:08 pm
@camlok,
Not at all since I don't ascribe sweetness and light to "my tribe"
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -3  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:10 pm
@BillW,
You're a riot BillW Very Happy

You must be one of the snowflakes who thinks he's tough.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:13 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
What this tells us is that Newsweek perceives that there is a sizeable market of consumers disconnected with reality.

Newsweek wrote:
Lessig noted that the hypotheticals he wrote about in his essay would apply to only the specific scenario he described.
Perhaps they really thought, most readers wouldn't get further than the headline.
maporsche
 
  3  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:14 pm
@maporsche,
And CHIP for 6 years is no small thing.
revelette1
 
  5  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:14 pm
Democrats did fold, but not empty handed if that makes any difference. When you are the party of the minority, your hand is not going to be that great to begin with. It could have gone worse, McConnell could have listened to Trump and went nuclear, or he didn't have to be so firm on the immigration debate happening before Feb 8, at which time a shutdown could loom again if he don't keep his word. At this point, McConnell could go nuclear, but he will just look a bully. The public wants immigration reform, they want the Dreamers to have a path to citizenship without a deportation.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -1  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:15 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Of course they did.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:16 pm
@maporsche,
It was there for them before they chose to shut down the government. They get no credit for that.
maporsche
 
  6  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:20 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Well, fine. But they gave up a 3 week CR to force McConnell to keep his word and actually bring something up for normal debate/process in the Senate. Something that hasn't been done ALL YEAR.

If McConnell doesn't keep his word, or if Trump messes things up somehow (who knows how...) then the government shutdown threat could happen just in time to ruin your Valentine's day.

You and I both agreed that this shutdown wasn't a good idea. Ends up it lasted a weekend and no one outside the media was affected. Dems will get their DACA debate and maybe a little normal order in the Senate for once.

What's wrong with the compromise?

If you think the Dems lost, how did the Republican's win? What does the CR get them besides more time to do DACA? I think the Republicans are in a tight spot right now. They have no agreement on what a DACA bill should look like and reports are the Trump is flip-flopping and telling everyone what they want to hear. That's not exactly good leadership.
revelette1
 
  4  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:20 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
They deserve no credit. It wasn't a debate. It was Trump and hardliners saying they only want countries with a white majority to be allowed into the country.
camlok
 
  0  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:21 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
Not at all since I don't ascribe sweetness and light to "my tribe"


Not in the narrow political sense but in the larger national sense you do.
0 Replies
 
BillW
 
  2  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:23 pm
@maporsche,
"Normal Order" hasn't been in play for 9 years thanks to McConnell. I don't think this will happen now either.
maporsche
 
  6  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:24 pm
@BillW,
BillW wrote:

"Normal Order" hasn't been in play for 9 years thanks to McConnell. I don't think this will happen now either.


It's going to have to start somewhere. I hope it's now.

If it's not now, then we could have another shutdown again in just 3 short weeks.

Who has the most to lose there after the promises that have been made?
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  5  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:33 pm
Also, this 3 week deadline has some teeth now. McConnell can't just assume that there's no way a shutdown will happen. Schumer has shown that the dog can bite, so to speak.

That's a stronger position to be negotiation from regarding DACA.
layman
 
  -4  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 01:48 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

What was the compromise?

The shutdown was a tactical move by the Dems. If they thought it was working they would not have compromised.

They folded


No doubt the Democrats' phone lines were burning up with angry phone calls from constituents, eh?:

Even cheese-eating CNN wrote:
Americans say avoiding a shutdown is more important than passing a bill to maintain the program allowing people brought to the US illegally as children to stay, according to a new CNN poll conducted by SSRS.

56% overall say approving a budget agreement to avoid a shutdown is more important than continuing the DACA program, while just 34% choose DACA over a shutdown.

Trump's numbers have improved in the last month, however, with approval rising 5 points largely on the strength of improved ratings among independents and conservatives. He's improved 7 points among independents, with much of that shift coming among those who lean Republican, and gained 10 points among ideological conservatives.

The CNN Poll was conducted by SSRS January 14-18 among a random national sample of 1,005 adults reached on landlines or cellphones by a live interviewer.


http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/19/politics/cnn-poll-shutdown-trump-immigration-daca/index.htm
izzythepush
 
  2  
Mon 22 Jan, 2018 02:09 pm
Quote:
The US is willing to work with Turkey to address its legitimate security concerns in northern Syria, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson has said.

Turkish troops have seized a number of areas from Kurdish YPG control in recent days.

Turkey sees the group as terrorists, but they have been crucial in a US-led coalition against the Islamic State (IS) group.

Ankara said the US had to stop backing the YPG if they wanted cooperation.

"If they want cooperation, we are ready for this cooperation," Turkey's Deputy Prime Minister Bekir Bozdag said on Monday. "As the first step to take, they can stop arming terror groups and take back weapons already given."

The YPG, or Kurdish People's Protection Units, controls much of north-eastern Syria.

It is believed by Turkey to be an extension of the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), which has fought for Kurdish autonomy in Turkey for three decades. The YPG denies any direct links to the group.

Mr Tillerson said on Monday in London that the US recognised the country's "legitimate concerns" for its security, and its right to defend itself from terrorist elements.

"We're engaged with Turkey and we are engaged also with the leadership of our coalition and are asking that both sides show restraint," he said.

He said the US had proposed measures to Turkey and others to try and stabilise the situation.

Reports say the US is discussing with Turkey and others the possibility of a "security zone" being set up in north-west Syria.

Earlier the Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan vowed to not "step back" in the assault on the YPG enclave of Afrin.

"We are determined, Afrin will be sorted out," Mr Erdogan said in a live television broadcast in Ankara on Monday.

"We will take no step back," he said, adding: "We spoke about this with our Russian friends; we have an agreement."



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-42782017
 

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