Let's talk about replacing GWBush in 2004.

Lola - Actually, the possibility that you wrote it to be funny had escaped me, yes. If that's the case, then, well done! It was, and moreso because I failed to see it as intentional. Cool

Of course, you are right that I simply inferred your meaning correctly. What you wrote could have been read another way. I appreciate your honesty about how you did mean it. I enjoy any opportunity to be right that comes my way these days.

Despite the caterwauling of your guards here, I really meant my response in good fun, and my experience of you here led me to believe that you are one person who would likely take it that way. I seem to have been right, and am glad that you took no offense.

Have a great Holiday Season! Very Happy

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timberlandko wrote:

Tell ya what, PDiddie, I'll go out on a limb here. I really think you are wrong, and I really think The American electorate thinks you are wrong. That of course doesn't mean that you are wrong; it merely means I think you're wrong, and that the majority of voters think so too.

"If I do not believe as you believe, it proves that you do not believe as I believe, and this is all that it proves." - Thomas Paine

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Scrat wrote:

"If I do not believe as you believe, it proves that you do not believe as I believe, and this is all that it proves." - Thomas Paine

Hey! I love that quote! Which Thomas Paine book is that from?

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timberlandko wrote:

PDiddie wrote:
You're on.

Care to put any money where your beak is?

Sure ... how about a $50 donation to the national committee of the party of the successful candidate?

Agreed!

That's probably the only time I'll ever type that word in relation to one of your posts...perhaps we should bookmark that as well... :wink:

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Both of you can send me the $50 bucks, and I'll hold onto it until we declare the winner. Wink

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Thomas wrote:

Scrat wrote:

"If I do not believe as you believe, it proves that you do not believe as I believe, and this is all that it proves." - Thomas Paine

Hey! I love that quote! Which Thomas Paine book is that from?

I'm unsure. I read it first as a lad, and had to look it up just now (Google) to find the exact wording.

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Thomas wrote:

...
That doesn't change the fact that the interests of almost all Americans are not in conflict with the interests of almost all French. We shouldn't let the noisy few in both countries bring up the reasonable majorities in both countries up against each other.

I fully agree. Indeed if all humans took fully objective views of their self interests, the world might be a better place. Unfortunately that isn't the case. People and nations live with delusions of all sorts, which do affect their perceptions of self-interest. It is these perceptions, both among electorates and by their governments, that influence national behavior. In the case of France and the United States there is, and has for some time been, an undeniable divergence of self-perceived national interest. I don't see anything on the horizon likely to change that. Indeed, in terms of popular perceptions here, the situation has become much worse. Very likely the same is true among the French.

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Quote:

NBC News/Wall Street Journal Poll
conducted by the polling organizations of Peter Hart (D) and Robert Teeter (R). Dec. 14, 2003. N=512 adults nationwide. MoE ± 4.3.

"In general, do you approve or disapprove of the job George W. Bush is doing as president?"

12/14/03 Approve: 58% Disapprove: 34% Don't Know: 9%

12/13/03 Approve: 52% Disapprove: 41% Don't Know: 7%

11/10/03 Approve: 51% Disapprove: 44% Don't Know: 5%

09/22/03 Approve: 49% Disapprove: 45% Don't Know: 6%

Then, there is this:

[/i]

http://www.pollingreport.com/images/ABCbushiraq.GIF

And This:

http://www.pollingreport.com/images/partyID.GIF

Interesting trends. Bush the Younger's Approval Ratings broadly increasing, while party membership has decreased among Democrats and increased among Republicans. The "Swing Voter", the Independent, becomes even more critical to the electoral hopes of all.

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Interesting numbers indeed. I wonder what will happen when the Democrats have decided on one candidate. But given the way things are looking now, my hopes for a reclaiming of the Republican party by the grown-ups are currently higher than my hopes of a Democrat winning the presidental election.

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hmmmmmmmmmmmmm........................

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Thomas wrote:

my hopes for a reclaiming of the Republican party by the grown-ups are currently higher than my hopes of a Democrat winning the presidental election.

ROTFLMAO!!!! Laughing

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georgeob1 wrote:

Thomas wrote:

...
That doesn't change the fact that the interests of almost all Americans are not in conflict with the interests of almost all French. We shouldn't let the noisy few in both countries bring up the reasonable majorities in both countries up against each other.

I fully agree. Indeed if all humans took fully objective views of their self interests, the world might be a better place. Unfortunately that isn't the case. People and nations live with delusions of all sorts, which do affect their perceptions of self-interest. It is these perceptions, both among electorates and by their governments, that influence national behavior. In the case of France and the United States there is, and has for some time been, an undeniable divergence of self-perceived national interest. I don't see anything on the horizon likely to change that. Indeed, in terms of popular perceptions here, the situation has become much worse. Very likely the same is true among the French.

george

There's a line from Camelot (the movie, at least) where Guenevere is in an initial conversation with Lancelot (it's the May Day scene) and, after listening to him for not very long at all, she inquires if he is familiar with the French word humilite'.

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Blatham,

Perhaps I don't get your point. Are you suggesting that with more humility the United States would get some cooperation from France? (That seems so far fetched to me that I doubt you mean it.)

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george

Fetching from afar in all cases here...you, me, France, the US.

The only way, I think, we can make progress against the sillinesses of pompous nationalist delusions is to do what we can to understand them, and then deflate them. We really ought not to join the game and defend them.

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OK by me, but we start with France, and work down the list ranked by the degree of delusion, pomposity and silliness. It will take us some time to get out of Europe this way.

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If you are goiong from most pompous to least, the US should be at the top, and Iceland at the bottom.

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Nah, not at all in the American spirit of fair play. Coin flip?

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georgeob1 wrote:

pomposity and silliness. It will take us some time to get out of Europe this way.

Another thing, the USA want to be the one and only and greatest? :wink:

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Walter,

You left out delusion. Perhaps that is what makes the difference. I won't argue with you about pomposity and silliness - they are indeed similar on both sides of the Atlantic (though even here, it is difficult to equal France).

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georgeob1 wrote:

Walter,

You left out delusion.

Hmm, didn't forget it and didn#t make a mistake while copying and pasting :wink:

georgeob1 wrote:

(though even here, it is difficult to equal France).

But many in the US try very hard for that ... and some are even better :wink:

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Let's talk about replacing GWBush in 2004.

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