Aren't Central Park and the streets of New York City publicly owned?
McG
Quote:Not at a privately funded gathering you don't.
Privately funded, Bull Crap.
To begin with he is there on taxpayer funded time. Surrounded by an entourage of taxpayer paid Secret Service people and traveling on an aircraft that has been paid for by the citizens of the US. Those that support him and those that do not.
And if I may let me remind you of his claim that he is a uniter. Who with the devil?
Actually, he may have been travelling in a bus. But your point remains nonetheless.
Remember the people who were arrested at a Bush speech a while back for wearing anti-bush tshirts? What the hell is that all about? I saw last night that they are suing the Secret Service for ordering their arrest. good for them.
Cycloptichorn
That's why we have laws governing campaigns. The fact remains, whether you like it or not, that free speech has not been, in any way, shape, or form, mis-handled, abused, or ill-treated.
Explain to me how those $25,000 per plate fund raising dinners that the Democrats throw are not private affairs? How come the DNC had caged free-speech zones?
Baldimo wrote:You people are twisting the free speech issue. Free speech is guaranteed by the govt, not by private gatherings. If the president is attending a private gathering then the people hosting that gathering can tell you whether you are allowed to enter or not. You can't stand in my yard protest with out my permission, I can have you thrown off my land because you are in violation of my property rights.
The RNC isn't a govt agency and there for can let who they want into a meeting or even into a dinner. It is their right to limit entry in to meetings regardless of who is there or what they are doing.
I support any private group that wants to limit people's access to their private meetings.
Again, we are talking about public spaces -- unless you are talking about the loyalty oaths.
EAST HAMPTON, N.Y., Aug. 21 - Talk about soaking the rich.
The Democratic presidential nominee, John Kerry, breezed through the Hamptons this weekend to
attend private fund-raisers and siphon a couple of million dollars from the wealthy, left-leaning East End of Long Island.
link
Okay, I think we need to establish a line of what is acceptable. If we take the saying "Freedom of Speech" literally we should allow this speech whenever at any cost. We should be allowed access to any event and be allowed to stand there bull horns in hand saying whatever we want.
Now I don't think anybody interprets it that way. So what is acceptable? Yes protestors should be allowed to say what it is they have to say...and they can. But don't the people they are protesting have just as much freedom?
Again no body is being silenced. It is a freedom of speech NOT a right to be heard.
You link to a freeper and expect to be taken seriously?
I mean, I understand your point, but c'mon, find a better source McG.... it sullys yer name to associate with 'em.
Cycloptichorn
Mcg
I am sure if one of Bush's supporters wanted to contribute $25,000 to the DNC he could get an invite. You realize that is a stupid question don't you. Probably similar to one that Bush would ask. Oh well the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
Patrick Healy is a Freeper
linked here as well.
again, worrying about the source instead of the message?
McGentrix wrote:EAST HAMPTON, N.Y., Aug. 21 - Talk about soaking the rich.
The Democratic presidential nominee, John Kerry, breezed through the Hamptons this weekend to
attend private fund-raisers and siphon a couple of million dollars from the wealthy, left-leaning East End of Long Island.
link
Good job McG, you've proven that politicians often have private fund raisers. Now back to talking about 'free speech zones' in public places.
au1929 wrote:Mcg
I am sure if one of Bush's supporters wanted to contribute $25,000 to the DNC he could get an invite. You realize that is a stupid question don't you. Probably similar to one that Bush would ask. Oh well the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
I shouldn't have to pay anything according to the logic that's been expressed here by some. I should be able to go and listen to the candidate whenever I want no matter who he is speaking to.
I think the topic has gotten muddled. There are two things to complain about here. One is the 'free speech zones' used by the BA where only those with anti-Bush messages are forced to protest while those with pro-Bush messages are allowed greater access. The other is 'loyalty oaths' that those, even those who have paid or were given tickets, who are trying to attend campaign rallies for Bush/Cheney must sign. I don't believe anyone in this thread has asserted that the public can crash party fundraisers at any time with bullhorns.
What does Freedom of Speech have to do with loyalty oaths?
Nothing, but it was discussed in this thread and so is getting the topic confused.
Just for a little refresher on the First Amendment, which gets a lot of bad-mouthing from the Right as it is . . .
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Given that any place outside Madison Square Garden which is not inside the privately owned property of an individual can be considered public, how the hell can the wrap-ourselves-in-the-flag-and-get-photographed-with-the-grimy-firefighters crowd of mealy-mouthed Republicans, always touting their American virtues, still defend such an obvious violation of the right of "the people, peacably to assemble?"
FreeDuck wrote:I think the topic has gotten muddled. There are two things to complain about here. One is the 'free speech zones' used by the BA where only those with anti-Bush messages are forced to protest while those with pro-Bush messages are allowed greater access.
like these?
Quote: The other is 'loyalty oaths' that those, even those who have paid or were given tickets, who are trying to attend campaign rallies for Bush/Cheney must sign. I don't believe anyone in this thread has asserted that the public can crash party fundraisers at any time with bullhorns.
Is a loyalty oath anything like coughing up a check for $25,000?
Who has been told they can not assemble?
Let's get back to basics, folks.
"U.S. Constitution
Amendment I
CONGRESS SHALL MAKE NO LAW respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
No mention of a prohibition of private citizens or organizations abridging free speech. Just a prohibition against Congress making a abridging the freedom of speech.
