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Does the Bible say that all Christians will go to heaven?

 
 
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 11:35 am
It is not uncommon for people to bear from their ministers that all of Christ's followers will go to heaven. But is this really the truth? What does the Bible really teach on this matter?
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Type: Question • Score: 3 • Views: 4,491 • Replies: 64

 
fresco
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 12:40 pm
@anthony1312002,
http://bible-truths-revealed.com/adv17.html

There you go...straight from the Atheists Customer Service department ! Mr. Green
anthony1312002
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 01:21 pm
@fresco,
No, no. You misunderstand me. I asked this question in light of what Jesus says at Matthew 5:5 which is a restating of what Psalm 37:29 says.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 02:00 pm
@anthony1312002,
Matthew 7:21 makes it absolutely clear that not all Christians will go to heaven.

Then there's Matthew 25:31-46 (which makes it clear that Republicans are going to have a hard time going to heaven).
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 03:10 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Matthew 7:21 makes it absolutely clear that not all Christians will go to heaven.

Then there's Matthew 25:31-46 (which makes it clear that Republicans are going to have a hard time going to heaven).


HA!
farmerman
 
  3  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 04:49 pm
@InfraBlue,
does the bible ever even use the word christian in the text.?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 23 Jan, 2016 06:18 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
does the bible ever even use the word christian in the text.?
Good point.
0 Replies
 
George
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 01:57 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

does the bible ever even use the word christian in the text.?

Acts of the Apostles 11:26
And they conversed there in the church a whole year: and they taught a
great multitude, so that at Antioch the disciples were first named Christians.

Et annum totum conversati sunt in ecclesia et docuerunt turbam multam ita
ut cognominarentur primum Antiochiae discipuli Christiani.


καὶ εὑρὼν ἤγαγεν εἰς Ἀντιόχειαν. ἐγένετο δὲ αὐτοῖς καὶ ἐνιαυτὸν ὅλον
συναχθῆναι ἐν τῇ ἐκκλησίᾳ καὶ διδάξαι ὄχλον ἱκανόν, χρηματίσαι τε πρώτως
ἐν Ἀντιοχείᾳ τοὺς μαθητὰς Χριστιανούς.
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 02:29 pm
@George,
That suggests that the text was written in the mid- to late second century, as the word does not appear in any non-christian sources any ealier than 150 CE.
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Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 02:33 pm
Excuse me, Pliny uses a similar term at the end of the first century. There is dispute about whether he refers to "Chrestus" or "Christus."
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jan, 2016 03:29 pm
@George,
Thank you. Id also found reference to the term in one of the non-canonical gospels (Peter I) where the term was used again as a title . Peter is a pseudoepigraphical work from 150D + . .
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puzzledperson
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Jan, 2016 10:05 pm
@anthony1312002,
Tough question. The Bible says many things and some of them appear to contradict one another. I'll examine a few quotes from the New King James Version.

Matthew 24:13 says: "But he who endures to the end shall be saved."

First Thessalonians 4:15-17 says: "For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himsel will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord."

Revelation 20:4-5 says: "And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection."

Since the dead in Christ are not limited to those beheaded for their witness to Jesus, they are not resurrected until the thousand years have finished. Since those who are alive and remain do not rise to meet the Lord "in the air" until the dead in Christ have done so, this seems to imply that some Christians will remain alive on Earth at least until the events of Revelation 20:7. But since the words "clouds" and "air" are used, rather than "heaven", it isn't clear that those who are alive and remain ascend to heaven. In fact, since they rise to meet the Lord "in the air" only after the Lord has descended from heaven with a shout, it seems as though the meeting does not take place in heaven.

Immediately following the thousand years, the final battle occurs:

Revelation 20:9 says: "They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them."

So somebody is living on Earth in "the beloved city". It isn't clear what city that is, since the New Jerusalem doesn't descend from heaven until Revelation 21, after the "first heaven and the first earth had passed away" (Revelation 21:1-2).

Revelation 21:3 says: "And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God." "

So after the Last Judgment at the end of Revelation 20, Revelation 21 has God living on Earth with his people in the New Jerusalem. Christ is there also:

Revelation 21:22 says: "But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and his Lamb are its temple."

Then, we have the puzzling verses near the end of the final chapter of Revelation:

Revelation 22:14-15 says: " Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie."

But apparently by this time the Last Judgment has already occurred and all of God's people live with him in the city of the New Jerusalem. Yet, "outside" are sorcerers, perverts, murderers, idolaters, and lovers of lies: but maybe this is just a way of saying that those won't (and didn't) get in, not that they literally continue to exist outside.

Is all of this consistent with an interpretation in which at least some Christians are "translated" into the New Jerusalem without going to heaven? Hard to say.
puzzledperson
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Jan, 2016 04:07 am
@puzzledperson,
Matthew 24 is a lecture on end times. Curiously, after describing the great tribulation, the arrival of Christ on Earth with the sound of a trumpet, the falling of the stars from the heavens, and the gathering of the elect, there is this:

In Matthew 24:34 Jesus says: "Assuredly I say to you, this generation will by no means pass till all these things take place."

Earlier, in Matthew 16:28 Jesus says: "Assuredly I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

So, not only is this consistent with First Thessalonians 4:15-17, it adds an additional component which (taken on its face and evaluated as to logical possibilities) demands one of three interpretations:

(1) The Book of Matthew predicted the end times to occur within the lifespan of the human beings of the generation contemporary to Christ's life and ministry; that generation passed without the occurrence of the end times; therefore the Book of Matthew is erroneous; or

(2) Some members of that generation have indefinitely long lifespans and have either wandered the Earth for two millennia or else spent the time sequestered elsewhere; or

(3) The current (modern) generation is actually contemporaneous with the events of Christ's life chronicled in the gospels, and the appearance of the passage of two millennia is an illusion.


Nova Flare Q
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 06:51 am
At Ecclesiastes 9:5, it tells us that the dead are conscious of nothing at all. We see that when we die, we don't go anywhere. At Revelation 14:3 and 4, however, there is a set number of 144,000 that will be "bought from the earth" as first fruits to God and to the Lamb, Jesus.

This is not to say that there is no hope for the rest of us, known as the Great Crowd who have an Earthly hope through resurrection as promised by Jesus whilst he was on Earth. Please see Matthew 5:5, including 6:10 and 22:31,
also see 2 Timothy 1:10 and John 14:6.

I put further emphasis on 1 Corinthians 15:12-21.

If you would like any further references, I am happy to help.
Nova Flare Q
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 07:00 am
@anthony1312002,
Apologies for double posting, but I forgot to say that you made a valid point identifying Psalm 37:29. Also, how do we know that we are on the right Christian path, according to what the Bible says?
mark noble
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 07:06 am
@Nova Flare Q,
By becoming the product of the 10 commandments.
0 Replies
 
YarnPerfect
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 07:31 am
@Nova Flare Q,
Exercise faith in Jesus’ ransom sacrifice. Regarding Jesus, it is said that the one who exercises faith in the Son has everlasting life -John 3:36. How can we exercise faith in Jesus? Such faith is not shown by words alone. James 2:26 says “Faith without works is dead.” Yes, true faith is proved by “works,” that is, by our actions. One way to show that we have faith in Jesus is by doing our best to imitate him not just in what we say but also in what we do.—John 13:15.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 09:18 am
@puzzledperson,
Quote:
Earlier, in Matthew 16:28 Jesus says: "Assuredly I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

So, not only is this consistent with First Thessalonians 4:15-17, it adds an additional component which (taken on its face and evaluated as to logical possibilities) demands one of three interpretations:

(1) The Book of Matthew predicted the end times to occur within the lifespan of the human beings of the generation contemporary to Christ's life and ministry; that generation passed without the occurrence of the end times; therefore the Book of Matthew is erroneous; or

(2) Some members of that generation have indefinitely long lifespans and have either wandered the Earth for two millennia or else spent the time sequestered elsewhere; or

(3) The current (modern) generation is actually contemporaneous with the events of Christ's life chronicled in the gospels, and the appearance of the passage of two millennia is an illusion.
Another possibility is that Jesus was speaking of his transfiguration spoken of in the following chapter (17) when he took Peter, James & John with him on the mountain. Precisely what is meant by transfiguration is I'm not sure but when God directly addressed Jesus and proclaimed him as his son in their sight and they were then unable to look directly at him, it could well be his 'Coming into his kingdom'.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 09:25 am
@puzzledperson,
Quote:
First Thessalonians 4:15-17 says: "For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himsel will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord."
This passage is often cited as the time when believers will ascend with Jesus into heaven but it really does not say that. They may rise to meet him in the clouds but Jesus appears to be on his way back down to earth in order to fulfil the prophecy that he will rule there for a thousand years.
0 Replies
 
puzzledperson
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 Jan, 2016 03:20 pm
@Nova Flare Q,
Nova Flare Q wrote: "At Ecclesiastes 9:5, it tells us that the dead are conscious of nothing at all. We see that when we die, we don't go anywhere."

This is a paraphrased verse fragment, followed by an inference. If we're going to discuss what the Bible says, a direct quote would be a more appropriate starting place. But first some context for this paraphrased verse fragment.

Ecclesiastes 12:6-7 says: "Remember your Creator before the silver cord is loosed, or the golden bowl is broken, or the pitcher shattered at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the well. Then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it."

Also Ecclesiastes 3:20-21 says: "All go to one place: all are from the dust, and all return to dust. Who knows the spirit of the sons of men, which goes upward, and the spirit of the animal, which goes down to the earth?"

So then, is "the dead know nothing" an ontological assertion, or is it an epistemological assertion? Ecclesiastes 8:1 says: "Who is like a wise man? And who knows the interpretation of a thing?"

Luke 20:38 says: "For He is not the God of the dead but of the living, for all live to Him".

First Peter 4:5-6 says: "They will give an account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead. For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit."

Psalms 16: 9-11 says: "Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoices; my flesh also will rest in hope. For You will not leave my soul in Sheol, nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption. You will show me the path of life; in Your presence is fullness of joy; at Your right hand are pleasures forevermore."
0 Replies
 
 

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