New Jersey cops shoot Radazz Hearn seven times as he pulls up pants

What can you reasonably expect? Compassion for the people of color brutalized and killed by police? Empathy for the point of view that regards police not as guardians of safety, but as bullies and abusers? I don't think anyone who doesn't already feel and express those things after the recent onslaught of murders and brutality is going to ever be able to.

I am trying to be understanding of Chai. Her point that people should cooperate with police. I agree with her on this.

She is missing the point that we are making, which I also agree with, that police are targeting and killing young Black men. She is also missing the point that not cooperating with police, or disrespecting police should lead to death or abuse.. and that for White people it almost never does.

I agree with both of these points. I am trying to build a bridge so that Chai can see why we are so upset at the string of police killings that predominantly target Black men. (Maybe I am not the person to do this).

That doesn't sound unreasonable to me. Actually, that might be my own reaction, and I practically glow in the dark. More likely, I would go way out of my way to avoid any such confrontation.

Actually, I think expressing anger in a protest movement... and doing everything possible to make police accountable and to make society understand the problem would also be a reasonable response.

In a longer term sense, yes.

The definition of white privilege:
Police: Man injures seven officers during fracas

"The defendant rolled down the window and said 'I know why you stopped me.' The defendant then made reference to the events in Ferguson, Missouri," according to the criminal complaint.

Joseph Parker, 34, in a wild rant, threatened to kill police, then pounced, police said. He punched 57-year-old Lt. Jeremian Goodwin, knocking him out.

From the overnight scene to lockup, Parker allegedly injured seven officers. The police chief says the man battled, nearly breaking the metal detector.


http://www.kctv5.com/story/29767559/police-man-injures-seven-officers-during-fracas


Just sayin'

I think american people who don't understand black people running have lived a secluded life.

This could be a bigger problem if the low pants style thing is still going on - I'm not savvy enough to know if that is in or out of style now, in mid 2015.

White Georgia Woman Shoots At People From Her Car, Aims Gun At Police And Does NOT Get Shot

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/12/29/white-georgia-woman-shoots-at-people-from-her-car-aims-gun-at-police-and-does-not-get-shot/

Author: Stephen D Foster Jr December 29, 2014 10:25 am

A gun-wielding white woman in Georgia shot at people while driving her car, led police on a chase while continuing to fire bullets, and then aimed her gun at officers. So, she got shot and killed, right? Guess again.

Julia Shields strapped on some body armor and drove around a neighborhood in Chattanooga shooting at people and property.

“She was just casually holding a gun, and wearing a baseball hat,” witness Jennifer Clouse told the Times Free Press. “It was crazy. … This is a pretty quiet area. I saw the gun and said to myself, ‘I’m going to go inside.'”

Shields then stopped in a parking lot until she was discovered there by responding police. Noticing the cops closing in, Shields escaped the parking lot and forced officers to chase her through the neighborhood. While speeding away, Shields continued to shoot at people in other vehicles with the police just behind her witnessing every shot.

Shields came to a final stop at an intersection and then aimed her weapon at police officers, clearly endangering their lives and giving them justification to shoot her in self-defense. But they didn’t shoot her. They arrested her.

Once again, white skin proves to be the ultimate factor in whether or not a cop will shoot someone. Shields wore body armor, nearly murdered several people and even pointed her gun at police and STILL didn’t get shot. If she had been black, the result would have been execution by cop.

This is yet another instance of how police treat white people versus how they treat black people. As you’ll recall, police were quick to kill unarmed black men Michael Brown and Eric Garner. But this nut job in Georgia actually threatened officers with the gun in her hand that she had already fired at multiple people, and yet, police refrained from shooting and killing her on the spot. I’m not saying they should have killed her, but it’s clear that there is a double standard.

As further proof of this double standard, let’s look at an incident that occurred in Idaho. Two men walked into a Walmart and took BB guns out of their packages and began shooting up the store. Police arrested them without firing a shot. In Ohio a few months ago, police shot and killed John Crawford III for merely waving a BB gun in the air in a store. The difference? The two Idaho men are white. Crawford was a black man.

As further proof of this standard, when white gun nuts aimed their weapons at federal officials at the Bundy ranch in Nevada, police didn’t do a damn thing. Apparently, if you are white, you can wave a gun around and shoot it at all the people you want. You can even threaten police with it, and you won’t be shot and killed. But if you’re an unarmed black man, police will just shoot you dead no matter what you did or didn’t do. The woman in this story strapped on body armor, drove around the neighborhood shooting at people, and pointed her weapon at police officers. But her white skin saved her from being killed by police. This is just another example of why American police forces need to be heavily investigated and reformed. Because if police don’t think it makes sense to shoot a deranged white woman pointing a gun at them yet think it’s perfectly acceptable to shoot unarmed people of color, that’s a major problem that needs to be addressed swiftly.

Agreed. All a cigarette would do would give you a nasty burn. However you said yourself that if you did choose to burn an officer, it would ensure you a trip to jail.

Therefore, what is the big deal about putting out a cigarette that the police officer doesn't want to risk getting burned with?

Unless I'm the only one that has noticed. All the things I'm saying apply to people, period.

Just people.

the truth of the US is that "regardless of who you are" isn't a reality

white men and white women can do things that people from other groups have to think about - stupid, simple things like smoking a cigarette, pulling up their pants, holding a toy, having a pool party, being mouthy. You can do things without thinking about them in a way that Snood can't, in a way that freeduck's children can't.

it's not fair. it's not right, and I honestly don't understand why you seem to think it's ok.

Because the policeman has absolutely no authority to ask! Is it in any way reasonable that a cigarette is a risk in the hand of someone in a car when the policeman is outside the car? Not unless the cigarette is attached to a flame thrower. But it sure is casual, isn't it? Certainly doesn't mean I have your full attention if you are puffing and I'm in charge because I am wearing the badge so you should be paying attention. If you are sitting there quietly smoking instead of sitting there quietly not smoking then maybe I'll just have to pull you out of the car and throw you to the ground. Cigarettes are scary is a pretty lame excuse for police brutality. The poor guy must be terrified to go walking downtown with all those people packing loaded menthols.

Exactly right Engineer.

And I would add the fact that the police officer would almost certainly not request a middle-class White woman to put out her cigarette.

Police officers have always treated me with the greatest respect. I was recently pulled over for driving with an rejected inspection sticker. He explained that the big red "R" on the rejected inspection sticker on my windshield meant it was a safety issue and that I shouldn't even be driving the car. I was committing a crime (although I honestly didn't know this thinking I had the usual 60 days to fix a trivial issue). He checked my license and registration and was very deferential in sending me away with a warning (telling me to go get it fixed right away).

I am a middle class White looking man... I expect to be treated with respect by police officers. Even when I am clearly in the wrong (as in this case) I can still expect to be treated with respect.

Why? So you can ensure you get chased, and risk getting shot at?

Roger, who is white he said he'd be tempted to run too.

Again, Why? Why would anyone, and I mean anyone, run from a police officer who is approaching you, to talk to and question you.

Makes absolutley, positively no sense at all.

It is stupid to run from a police officer who is approaching you. That is so obvious I can't believe I actually have to say it.


So, you (the general you) believe police officers are there to protect and serve you. However, if one approaches you, you take off running, making yourself suspicious.
How can there be any attempt at being protected, served or communicated with if you run away from them?

I have not made this a race issue in any way, and I have done that on purpose.
By bob now posting his stories of "white person not shot" there is further loss of credibility.

bob...I could just as easily scan the internet and pull up stories of White, Asian or any other race being shot (or not) by police.

I could also do quick seaches and come back with stories of police officers coming to the aide and assistance of Blacks too.

Again, there's this cherry picking being done to suit your own agenda.

Tell me bob, is Hearn still dead/not dead? Can you give me an update?

I'm trying to imagine how people from Oz and England here are viewing this country through the media buzz of "cop killing blacks, beware!" They must think every single person in this country must put on armor to walk out their front door. I've seen at least a hundred people on the streets today, of all colors, actually, come to think of it, more minorities than whites. No one at all was being shot at, or chased, or felt they had to wear a bullet proof vest.

*****

ok, I just did a little number crunching here. Not like anyone will pay the slighted bit of attention, but at least it's here. Numbers are my thing.

No one can dispute that blacks are 3 times more likely to be shot than white. I want to be clear that I just said that, right?

However, what does this mean in actual numbers, when you grind it down to more exact percentages?

The population of the U.S. is 319,000,000
so
200,970,000 white (63%)
38,280,00 black (12%)

Between 1999 and 2011:
2151 whites killed by police
1130 blacks killed by police

.00001070 of whites killed
.00002955 of white killed

1 out of 200,000 whites
3.3 out of 200,000 blacks

Yes, I agree, that's bad. No one could deny that.

However, during that time, 199,997 blacks were NOT shot by police.
At the same time 199,999 whites where not shot by police.

Correct, all things being equal, it's wrong that 2 additional people lost their lives in comparison.

However, it's not, as people are making it sound, as if one group of people are having hundreds of people drug out of their homes every day and shot in the street, while another group is just safe as houses.

There isn't some daily mass slaying going on people.

In fact, more people die of epilepsy every day than from being black and shot. You're much, much more likely to die of anemia. Why aren't people in a crisis mode over the fact too many people aren't taking their iron pills or eating enough leafy greens? Because that doesn't sell internet space.

We are infinately more concerned with this than over the fact more people die each year because they didn't keep up on their tetanus shots. The odds of dying of tetanus are twice as likely in the united states than of a black person being shot and killed by police.
Why is no one rioting over the fact tetanus shots aren't being promoted more heavily to the general population? Why are we not appalled that in this day and age 50% more people die each year of syphilis.

Where are all the news stories and youtube videos about that? Because dying of stepping on a rusty nail or having a seizure is just nowhere as journalistically sexy as a black person being shot by police.


Now, even though I just clearly said it is bad that anyone is being innocently killed, and that in the big picture more people die on a daily basis please hurry up and post that I'm advocating wholesale police killing of innocent black people

Absolutley not true.

If I were mouthy, I would expect to get all kinds of trouble. or refused a reasonable request like putting out a cigarette. If I ran away from an officer while pulling at my pants where I very well could have a gun hidden, I would expect catching hell up to and including being shot if I were running away and looking like I was pulling a weapon.

Yes, I would fully expect to have put my life in danger if I ran and was preceived as having a weapon.

It is not just the people killed, Chai. It is the people who end up roughed up and disrespected by police.

I am as White as a ghost. My kids are not White. I have had to help deal them deal with this first hand. There is nothing that makes me more upset then seeing my kids deal with racism from police and from people in the community. I have seen first hand the difference between how White members of my family are treated, and how the non-White people are treated. It is infuriating.

I pass. My dad and especially my uncle, not so much.

It's not the same world when you're not white.

Sorry ehbeth, I don't understand what you mean.

I look white.

Ah. Ok, thanks.

A brief re-cap, A2k friends:

We are presently witnessing a discussion a part of which has one party saying that white people can get away with more than non-whites can, when dealing with police in the US (a perfectly sound and rational position IMO, thoroughly supported by statistics, current news reports and common freakin' sense). Another party is denying the manifest truth of that position however - asserting that all people receive treatment from police that is for all intents and purposes equal, the only exacerbating factor being erratic, suspicious or just plain bad behavior, which earns them the rough handling or death that they have coming.

To the latter of these two positions I would retort in two ways:

1) Denial is not just a river in Egypt.
2) In the immortal words of Janelle Monae - Hell You Talmbout?!