0
   

THE US, THE UN AND THE IRAQIS THEMSELVES, V. 7.0

 
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 12:43 pm
That was probably my comment you saw, Hamburger, and was based on what the North Vietnamese said, not on what the Americans said. This is mentioned in several historical books that have subsequently been written on the Vietnam War-I can't remember titles at the moment

In a previous post:
Quote:
In later years, after the Communists were firmly in power in Vietnam, they admitted that the Tet offensive was a military disaster for them. In a 1995 interview in the Wall Street Journal, a Communist official stated frankly that the key to their victory was the American home front, and that they were encouraged to fight on by all the anti-war demonstrations in the United States
http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=23268&highlight=
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 02:05 pm
my coments are in blue
Gelisgesti wrote:
Sistani and others will be trying to insure a rapid departure for our troops .... after all, the U.S. presence is the reason for the insurgency.
Why do you believe this is the reason? Why do you reject the reason for the insurgency (I call it subversion) to be the desire of the subversives to recover their declining/lost tyrannical power.
Bush will say 'ok I'll send 5000 home but because of Syria and Iran's hostile stature he won't feel it would be a good move if he were to yank everyone.
Why do you believe this stuff? Bush has already stated that the extra 12,000 troops brought in to help protect the Iraqi election are going home now.
This will go back and forth til about the middle of March .... all this time the Sunnis will continue to extract thier pound of flesh from our troops in payback for Falluja. Sistani will call for a peaceful protest and a million or so Shiites will hit the streets. Bush will pull another 'bring em on' stunt ..... and they will .... hundreds of thousands of Sunni and Shias will try to convince George that pulling out might be the best thing .......... what will George do?
Your statement is more hymnal-like Bunkum Slop. Bush has already said several times that we will remove our troops from Iraq when the Iraqi government asks us to leave. Why do you think otherwise? I bet we will be asked to leave after the Iraqi Assembly presents a Constitution to the Iraqi voters that they approve, and after the new Iraqi government is elected under that Constitution, and after that new Iraqi government decides it can handle the subversives by itself without US help. The new Constitutional Iraqi government is scheduled to be accomplished by the end of this year.
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 02:50 pm
Quote:
0 Replies
 
Gelisgesti
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 02:57 pm
ican711nm wrote:
my coments are in blue
Gelisgesti wrote:
Sistani and others will be trying to insure a rapid departure for our troops .... after all, the U.S. presence is the reason for the insurgency.
Why do you believe this is the reason? Why do you reject the reason for the insurgency (I call it subversion) to be the desire of the subversives to recover their declining/lost tyrannical power.
Bush will say 'ok I'll send 5000 home but because of Syria and Iran's hostile stature he won't feel it would be a good move if he were to yank everyone.
Why do you believe this stuff? Bush has already stated that the extra 12,000 troops brought in to help protect the Iraqi election are going home now.
This will go back and forth til about the middle of March .... all this time the Sunnis will continue to extract thier pound of flesh from our troops in payback for Falluja. Sistani will call for a peaceful protest and a million or so Shiites will hit the streets. Bush will pull another 'bring em on' stunt ..... and they will .... hundreds of thousands of Sunni and Shias will try to convince George that pulling out might be the best thing .......... what will George do?
Your statement is more hymnal-like Bunkum Slop. Bush has already said several times that we will remove our troops from Iraq when the Iraqi government asks us to leave. Why do you think otherwise? I bet we will be asked to leave after the Iraqi Assembly presents a Constitution to the Iraqi voters that they approve, and after the new Iraqi government is elected under that Constitution, and after that new Iraqi government decides it can handle the subversives by itself without US help. The new Constitutional Iraqi government is scheduled to be accomplished by the end of this year.


What do you think will happen and upon what do you base your opinion? Please supply links.
Thx.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 03:18 pm
Good grief. One has to wonder how many links one must post in order to make one's point. Oh yeah, there aren't enough links out there for some to acknowledge that the U.S.A. is not the great Satan and that there is optimistic hope for an eventual good outcome in Iraq.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 05:00 pm
A couple that are not from right wing media links such as what can be found on Ann Coulter's site would suffice.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 05:27 pm
Well, with no personal verification of the information on this site, there is a lot of information there from various sources. Unfortunately some of the sources have since been archived and are no longer accessible, but many still are. And there isn't a single Ann Coulter link to be found.
http://www.2la.org/syria/iraq-wmd.php

It is obvious to me that any thinking person has to acknowledge that there was plenty of reason to believe Saddam Hussein had WMD at the time of the invasion no matter when or if he disposed of them.

It is reasonable to conclude that he stonewalled the inspectors:

1) Because he did have WMD that were subsequently moved, and/or

2) Because he wanted the U.N. to believe he had WMD so the most lucrative sanctions (for him) would be left in place.

If he had cleaned it all up by 1991 as some suggest, he could have had all sanctions removed and avoided any possibility of further action by opening up the warehouses and letting the inspectors confirm it. He didn't. Any thinking person has to ask why.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 07:20 pm
Gelisgesti wrote:
What do you think will happen and upon what do you base your opinion? Please supply links. Thx.

Laughing You're really too much! You persist in not answering my questions of why you believe what you post, and then exhibit "gall of such outstanding proportions as to bring one's mind to a functional standstill" by asking me to tell you what I think and why I think what I think.Laughing Thank you for that. Laughing

Just for more fun, I will tell you what I think will happen and I will tell you why I think it will happen. I cannot wait for your response! Laughing

Unless I say otherwise, I think what I think will happen, because the Iraqis have been on schedule ever since their provisional government was first established. The establishment of their provisional government was itself established on schedule as well.

November, 2005: The newly elected Iraqi Assembly will submit a Constitution to the Iraqi voters for their approval after almost 3,000 additional Iraqi civilians have been murdered by subversives. The Iraqi voters will approve this Constitution on a close vote despite the murder of almost 100 Iraqi civilians by subversives during this election.

December, 2005: The Iraqi people will elect their new government under their newly approved Constitution despite the murder of almost 500 Iraqi civilians by subversives during this election.

*December 2006: The Iraqi government will have trained and assigned a military and police force fully capable of protecting the Iraqi people against those subverters who continue to attempt to subvert their evolving democracy.

*December 2007: The last member of the US military will have left Iraq except for the standard small contingent of marines assigned to the new American Embassy in Iraq.

I think the two asterisked items will happen because after their previous accomplishments in December 2005, the Iraqis will be unshakeably focused on accomplishing these items as well. They will allow nothing to stand in their way of evolving their democracy according to their own design. The raging desire for freedom by the Iraqi people is now, like mine, unquenchable.

I day-dreamed the following happenings.

In September of 2008, the Democratic candidate for President will be Barak Abama. The Republican candidate for President will be Condelesa Rice. Rice will win and appoint Abama to the US Supreme Court. All bluenecks will attempt to emigrate to Iraq, but the Iraq government will deny all of them entry visas. :wink:
0 Replies
 
Verbal lee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 07:29 pm
I tell you what. When I come back to read on these rare visits,
I am quickly aware of why I left this place.
why I cannot care about the continuing of insanely sick opinionating.
(excuse me if I am not too clear, I am not a speaker)
Reading all you people glorifying the present government and their lies is so depressing, I have to go wash out my eyes. who gives a _____ if the Iraqis had wmd, the Bush/cheny/rummy crowd did not even need an excuse to start an aggressive war against a country already poor and suffering. They had a plan, and they are working it. I just have to hope only the supporters of these sick people suffer from these actions. but no, we all will.
Since when did it become the American way to kill thousands of people just so they could get one or two?? How many of the crippled Iraqi children and the suffering women and hungry, thin beggars (and multiplied DEAD), were guilty of Saddam's sins? But they are paying. and paying, and still paying.
Quit glorifying evil. Quit praising craziness. Or just keep on, I am not going to know, I am NOT coming back here again.
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 07:41 pm
Verbal lee wrote:
I tell you what. When I come back to read on these rare visits, I am quickly aware of why I left this place.
why I cannot care about the continuing of insanely sick opinionating. (excuse me if I am not too clear, I am not a speaker) Reading all you people glorifying the present government and their lies is so depressing, I have to go wash out my eyes. who gives a _____ if the Iraqis had wmd, the Bush/cheny/rummy crowd did not even need an excuse to start an aggressive war against a country already poor and suffering. They had a plan, and they are working it. I just have to hope only the supporters of these sick people suffer from these actions. but no, we all will. Since when did it become the American way to kill thousands of people just so they could get one or two?? How many of the crippled Iraqi children and the suffering women and hungry, thin beggars (and multiplied DEAD), were guilty of Saddam's sins? But they are paying. and paying, and still paying. Quit glorifying evil. Quit praising craziness.
Or just keep on, I am not going to know, I am NOT coming back here again
Bye, bye baby! Crying or Very sad And whose opinion is that you are injected with, and why do they have that opinion? Why, it may be yours! It may be you who is crazily defending craziness. Why?
0 Replies
 
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 08:15 pm
Quote:
Inquiry & Analysis - Iraq
February 16, 2005
No. 207

Iraqi Elections (VI): The Results and Their Implications
By Dr. Nimrod Raphaeli*

To view this Inquiry & Analysis in HTML, visit
http://memri.org/bin/opener_latest.cgi?ID=IA20705

Introduction

By all accounts the general elections held in Iraq on January 30, 2005 were a seminal event in the history of the country and, by extension, an
important benchmark by which the future evolution of democracies in other countries of the Middle East will be measured. The people of Iraq went by the millions to cast their ballots in a first step toward establishing a democratic regime.

The mechanism of the elections was as follows:

Each Iraqi voter was given the opportunity to cast two ballots: one for the
national assembly and one for one of the eighteen provincial councils. The
voters in the three Kurdish provinces (Dahouk, Erbil and Sulaymaniya) cast a third ballot for the autonomous Kurdish parliament.

The choices open to the voters were broad and varied. There were 111 lists of political parties, coalitions or individuals, comprising a total of 7471
candidates who were competing for the 275 seats in the National Assembly. Additionally, 7850 candidates were running for 748 seats in the provincial councils (41 seats in each province, except for Baghdad with 51 seats.) And, finally, there were 499 candidates running for the 111 seats in the Kurdish Parliament. A total of 15,820 candidates at all levels of the elections were, thus, competing for 1134 seats, or an average of 14 candidates per seat - a high figure by Western standards but an understandable one for a people bursting with democratic impulses after almost half a century of political dictatorship and denial of liberty.

Election Results

According to the figures published by the Independent Elections Commissionin Iraq (IECI), approximately 8.45 million voters, or about 59 percent of 14.2 million registered voters (including those registered overseas), cast their ballots. The results of the elections will be officially certified three days after the date of their publication, in order that anyone wishing to contest the results shall have an opportunity to come forward. As the director general of IECI 'Adil al-Lami has pointed out, it is not the tabulation of ballots that is apt to be in question. Rather, results may be contested for the alleged failure of the Elections Commission to open the ballot boxes for voters in the city of Mosul and a number of other cities in the Sunni Triangle because of security considerations. As a result, as many as 15,000 voters in one instance were denied the chance to vote.(1)

Based on the distribution of votes, twelve lists will be represented in the
National Assembly. For the Table of Lists Represented in the National
Assembly, visit http://memri.org/bin/opener_latest.cgi?ID=IA20705

Procedures of Seat Allocation

Seat allocations for Iraq's 275-member National Assembly are calculated as follows:

* The total number of valid votes cast (8,456,266) is divided by 275 to
give an initial quota of 30,750 votes per seat.

* Any list with fewer votes than the initial quota is excluded.

* After excluding the votes of lists who fell below the threshold the total
votes used for calculating the allocation of seats is reduced to 8,011,450.

* A seat quota is then calculated by dividing the new total by 275, which
is 29,132 votes per seat.

* The unallocated balance of votes is dealt with by giving an extra seat to
lists with the highest balance to complete the allocation of the 275
seats.(2)

As was expected, three lists (the Kurdish list (130), Shi'ite list (169),
and Allawi's list (185)) have emerged with 87.6 percent of the votes. Had
the Sunnis voted in large numbers, the number of votes of the three major lists may have been the same but their percentage of the total would have been decidedly lower.

Comments on the Results

The results suggest a number of observations:

The Winners:

A) The Iraqi National Alliance

It is significant that the Iraqi National Alliance has emerged with a
plurality rather than a majority of the votes. This outcome could limit its
governing options, particularly on matters relating to the role of Islam in
the state. It should also be kept in mind that this list itself is a
coalition of two competing Shi'ite parties - the Supreme Council of the
Islamic Revolution in Iraq (SCIRI) headed by Abd al-Aziz al-Hakim and the al-Da'wa Party, headed by Ibrahim al-Ja'afari - and the secular Iraqi
National Congress, headed by Dr. Ahmad Chalabi. In addition to these three established political elements the Allied list includes a number of
independent candidates, amongst whom are secular Shi'ites and even
individuals representing other Iraqi ethnic groups.

Three major figures, 'Adil Abd al-Mehdi, Ibrahim al-Ja'afari and Ahmad
Chalabi, have announced their candidacies for the post of prime minister.
Provided the Alliance remains cohesive, which may not be the case for long, any candidate it sponsors is likely to be the next prime minister. This will leave Mr. Allawi out of the list of viable candidates. However, should group cohesion give way to the pressures and incentives of deal-making, there could be a big surprise that could benefit Mr. Allawi. Another possible contender is Hussein al-Shahrestani, a nuclear physicist who opposed being drawn into Saddam's program to produce weapons of mass destruction and who was subsequently imprisoned, may reemerge as a viable candidate after withdrawing from the race a few days ago

B) The Kurds

By all standards, the Kurds, who make up no more than 20 percent of the
population, garnered 25.7 percent of the vote, have emerged as the biggest winners and greatest beneficiaries of Sunni boycott of the elections. The Kurds are now in a position to tip the scales in favor of a candidate amenable to fulfilling their political aspirations and demands. These include the election of their leader Jalal Talabani as the president of
Iraq.

But beyond this immediate demand, the Kurds have three critical priorities:
first, the creation of federalism in Iraq that will guarantee the autonomy
of the Kurdish region comprising the three governorates of Dahouk, Erbil and Sulaymania; second, the incorporation of the City of Kirkuk with its vast oil reserves into the Kurdish region; and, third, the separation of powers and the giving of primacy in legislation to democracy over religion. In Fact, the strength of the Kurds and some of the secular Shi'ites within the Alliance list backed by the secular Shi'ite group of Ayad Allawi will be a significant bulwark against any attempt by the Shi'ite clerics to produce an Islamist government in Iraq.

The Losers:

A) The Current Iraqi Leadership

The results of the elections have fallen below the expectations of Ayad
Allawi, the interim prime minister, who was unable to escape blame for the
absence of security and for the shortages in basic amenities, particularly
electricity, drinking water, gasoline for cars, and gas for home cooking.
Iraq's interim President, Sheikh Ghazi al-Yawer, whose list earned only five seats, is most likely to lose his job under the next government. Ironically, his failure is a success: that is, the results of the elections testify to their fairness and transparency. Elections in Arab states never result in existing governments losing.

B) Iraq's Elder Statesman

The results must also be considered unsatisfactory for Dr. 'Adnan
al-Pachachi, Iraq's elder statesman, a leading Sunni candidate and a former minister of foreign affairs who failed to receive sufficient votes to be elected. Dr. al-Pachachi waxed philosophical by declaring that "Allah is
generous" (Allah Karim) and that he will participate in the next elections.
In the meantime, he will prod the Sunnis to be active in the new government and the drafting of the new constitution.(3) Dr. al-Pachachi is being mentioned as a possible second vice president of Iraq.(4)

C) The Monarchist Movement

The elections have dealt a fatal blow to the aspirations of two political
movements which run on a platform calling for the restoration of monarchy to Iraq. The claimant to the throne, al-Sharif Ali bin Al-Hussein, a cousin of the last Iraqi monarch, Faisal II, received 13,740 votes. The second list under the name of Iraqi Hashemite Group, received another 9,781 votes. Even if the votes of both lists had been combined, the result would have gained hardly one seat in the National Assembly and ultimately had no impact on the nature of the emerging regime in Iraq.

Key Events After the Elections

Under the Transitional Administrative Law (the law governing Iraq, or TAL,
during the transition to a constitutional democracy) the following key
events must take place following the tabulation of the votes and the winners declared:

* The Transitional National Assembly will appoint by a two-third majority a Presidency Council, consisting of a President and two Deputy Presidents
(Article 36 of TAL).

* The Presidency Council will appoint by a unanimous vote a Prime Minister and - on his or her recommendation - cabinet ministers to run the Iraqi government (Article 38). The number of ministries is not fixed by the TAL. If the Presidency Council fails to nominate a prime minister unanimously the responsibility will be reverted to the National Assembly, which must do so by a two-third majority.

* The Prime Minister and his cabinet must receive a vote of confidence by a simple majority of the National Assembly before commencing work as a government.

* The Transitional National Assembly is required to draft a new
constitution by August 15, 2005.

* The draft constitution is to be presented in a referendum to the Iraqi
people for approval by October 15, 2005.

By December 15, 2005 new elections will be held under the new constitution to choose a new national assembly which, in turn, will have to approve a new government.

The Weight of Women

Under the Transitional Administration Law, women will comprise at least 25 percent of the members of the National Assembly. It is a great achievement for the Iraqi women, although it is too early to tell what will be their weight in the assembly and how they vote on matters relating to family legislation.

The Problem of Personal Security

The Iraqi voters cast their ballots for lists of candidates, often not
knowing who were on the lists. When the votes are finally tabulated and the seats are allocated, the names of the 1134 individuals who will occupy the seats of the national assembly, the provincial councils, and the Kurdish
parliament, will be made public. In some high-risk areas, but not only
there, these men and women will be targets for terrorists and remnants of
the Ba'th regime determined to undermine and disrupt the will of the
electorate. Providing individual security to so many elected office holders
will pose a great challenge to the nascent security services of Iraq.

*Dr. Nimrod Raphaeli is Senior Analyst of MEMRI's Middle East Economic
Studies Program.

Endnotes:
(1) Al-Zaman (Baghdad), February 14, 2005.
(2) The figures are provided by the Independent Elections Commission for Iraq on February 13, 2005. A detailed distribution of votes for all the 111 lists competed in the elections is published in the daily Al-Zaman
(Baghdad), February 14, 2005.
(3) Al-Sharq Al-Awsat (London), February 14, 2005.
(4) Al-Quds Al-Arabi (London), February 14, 2005.
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 09:21 pm
Brandon, one of the very first things we did after our invasion of Iraq was to annul the Iraqi constitution which forbade the foreign ownership or control of Iraqi businesses or real estate through the Coalition Provisional Authority Orders. Through these orders "Foreign investment may take place with respect to all economic sectors in Iraq, except that foreign direct and indirect ownership of the natural resources sector involving primary extraction and initial processing remains prohibited. In addition, this Order does not apply to banks and insurance companies." As regards licenses for the use of Iraqi real property, "The duration of any license to use property shall be determined by the duration of operations related to the foreign investment. The initial term of a license shall not exceed 40 years, but may be renewed for further such periods. Licenses may be reviewed by the internationally recognized, representative government established by the people of Iraq upon its assumption of the responsibilities of the CPA."

Foreign companies cannot own Iraqi real estate. They can, however, license the use of Iraqi real property in perpetuity.

American companies already operating under such terms are: Haliburton, Howe-Baker Engineering Inc., Mobil Oil, and Pullman-Kellogg.

http://www.iraqcoalition.org/regulations/
http://www.iraqcoalition.org/regulations/20031220_CPAORD_39_Foreign_Investment_.pdf
http://www.virginia.edu/igpr/apagoilcompany.html
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 09:26 pm
Yeah, polls say this and polls say that, ican, even "polls" you quote with nary a reference. I can quote a poll that states four out of five Iraqis report holding a negative view of the U.S. occupation authority and of coalition forces, according to a new poll conducted for the occupation authority, and that 80 percent of the Iraqis questioned reported a lack of confidence in the Coalition Provisional Authority, and 82 percent said they disapprove of the U.S. and allied militaries in Iraq. Your determinations of my characterizations of what the Iraqi people want amount to nothing, ican, save vacuous bluster.

By the way: Our current administration, through its manipulation of misinformation and its manipulation of the collective national paranoia, has lead me to distrust it, and your blind devotion to it has lead me to believe that you are a manipulable, feebleminded victim of its brainwashing propaganda.
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Feb, 2005 09:28 pm
It is plainly obvious that your speculations are based on what you're pulling straight out of your own rectum, ican, and nowhere else.
The CIA director himself contradicts your speculations as to the nature of the insurgency in Iraq. "Islamic extremists are exploiting the Iraqi conflict to recruit new anti-U.S. jihadists," CIA Director Porter Goss told the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Feb, 2005 06:52 am
Sorry - not quite sure where to put this, but salon.com has a reporter at Conservative Political Action Conference who says that these people are saying that the US DID find WMD in Iraq:

"Among the believers
At the Conservative Political Action Conference, where rabid Bush-worshippers learn that liberals hate America and that we really did find WMD in Iraq.

- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Michelle Goldberg



Feb. 19, 2005 | WASHINGTON -- It's a good thing I went to the Conservative Political Action Conference this year. Otherwise I never would have known that, despite the findings of the authoritative David Kay report and every reputable media outlet on earth, the United States actually discovered weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, vindicating all of George W. Bush's pre-war predictions. The revelation came not from some crank at Free Republic or hustler from Talon News, but from a congressman surrounded by men from the highest echelons of American government. No wonder the attendees all seemed to believe him.

The crowd at CPAC's Thursday night banquet, held at D.C.'s Ronald Reagan Building, was full of right-wing stars. Among those seated at the long presidential table at the head of the room were Henry Hyde, chairman of the House International Relations Committee, Kansas Sen. Sam Brownback, Minnesota Sen. Norm Coleman, Dore Gold, foreign policy advisor to former Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, and NRA president Kayne Robinson. Vice President Dick Cheney, a regular CPAC speaker, gave the keynote address. California Rep. Chris Cox had the honor of introducing him, and he took the opportunity to mock the Democrats whose hatred of America led them to get Iraq so horribly wrong.

"America's Operation Iraqi Freedom is still producing shock and awe, this time among the blame-America-first crowd," he crowed. Then he said, "We continue to discover biological and chemical weapons and facilities to make them inside Iraq." Apparently, most of the hundreds of people in attendance already knew about these remarkable, hitherto-unreported discoveries, because no one gasped at this startling revelation......"


http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2005/02/19/cpac/




Does anyone know where I can get confirmation/denial of this?

I have heard that a lot of Americans remain ignorant of the findings of the commission headed by Kay - but this stuff is quite concerning, if true.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Feb, 2005 07:50 am
I thought the term, "blame america first crowd" originated here.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Feb, 2005 08:03 am
I read the article Dlowan and concluded the writer was being sarcastic.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Feb, 2005 08:15 am
Really? Well - there is a lot of sarcasm. I hope you are right. Meanwhile - is there anyone with other sources on the same conference?

I am finding lots of stuff about it - (brrrrrr) - but no other comments on that bit of nonsense.

Seems to be mainly for far right religious folk.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Feb, 2005 09:32 am
Deb, even if true; that would mean one California Rep. (Chris Cox) was guilty of ignorance. Leave it to Salon to publish an article implying the entire gathering of "hundreds" agreed. And leave it to the "Blame America First Crowd" (Special Delivery :razz:) to misinterpret the elaborate Strawman as news.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Feb, 2005 10:02 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
Deb, even if true; that would mean one California Rep. (Chris Cox) was guilty of ignorance.


Rep. Chris Cox, R-Calif. (Newport Beach), chairman of the House Committee on Homeland Security
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.08 seconds on 05/10/2024 at 08:02:15