maporsche
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 05:43 pm
@roger,
I didn't mean any harm. I was in my early teens when welfare reform was signed. I was part of a family who spent much of my childhood on welfare.

When you said 'ended welfare as we knew it' I really don't know what you mean.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 05:55 pm
@maporsche,
That was the claim of the Clinton Administration. Again, my point was that if her supporters make the association of Hillary with Bill, I think it would be more honest not to pick and chose.

You are certainly entitled to your own opinion.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 06:00 pm
@maporsche,
"End welfare as we know it" was Bill's catch-phrase in the 90s.
maporsche
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 06:02 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

"End welfare as we know it" was Bill's catch-phrase in the 90s.


Great. What does that mean? Does anyone know?
Is welfare today bad? Does anyone know?
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 06:10 pm
@maporsche,
Everybody except Hillary Clinton supporters know.

http://billmoyers.com/2014/05/12/how-bill-clintons-welfare-reform-created-a-system-rife-with-racial-biases/
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1997/03/the-worst-thing-bill-clinton-has-done/376797/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bill-clinton-welfare-reform_us_5707e023e4b0447a7dbc2a9b

There's also this: http://usuncut.com/politics/michelle-alexander-clinton-blm-rant/

I think a good descriptor for Bill is neodemocrat. Republican light...
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 06:26 pm
@Lash,
Lash, Thanks for sharing those links. I'm appalled at Bill Clinton's action to cut off food stamps for the needy. The Clintons will never get my vote again. NEVER.

They are not neodemocrats. They are wealthy, ignorant, assh.........who don't understand the poor and the needy. That's what happens when they have millions like the Donald. Senseless, insensitive, politicians. Just as bad as being a racial bigot. They're a bigot to the poor.
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  3  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 06:58 pm
Lash's account as usual is a load of hogwash. Welfare hasn't ended, food stamps are still around, CHIPS and other services. What the welfare reform did was require recipient's to work certain hours or work for community services unless they are disabled. I should know as I was disabled during the 90's and was a single mother raising two daughters for three years until I remarried my husband. The program also provided training for jobs and money for child care.

Does Child Care Assistance Matter?
The Effects of Welfare and
Employment Programs
on Child Care for Very Young Children
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:02 pm
@revelette2,
Bill Moyers, The Atlantic Monthly, The Times, ...basically you think you know more than practically every paper in the country - because they ALL run these stories. Because these stories are factual.

You are too simple-minded to make broad proclamations. I didn't say welfare has ended, idiot. Clinton said he'd end welfare as we know it. Maybe you know more than he does about what he said. I'm sure you think you do.

READ before TALK.
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:06 pm
Cenk Uygur was arrested for protesting in DC with Sanders voters. Still, the MSM won't touch the story.
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:06 pm
@Lash,
Quote:
I didn't say welfare has ended, idiot


You know there really isn't a need to get so nasty, it merely shows the character of the one who does it.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:18 pm
Already key neocons, such as the Brookings Institution’s Robert Kagan, are signaling that they expect to have substantial influence over Clinton’s foreign policy. Kagan, who has repackaged himself as a “liberal interventionist,” threw his support to Clinton, who put him on a State Department advisory board.

There is also talk in Washington that Kagan’s neocon wife, Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs Victoria Nuland, another Clinton favorite and the architect of the “regime change” in Ukraine, would be in line for a top foreign policy job in a Clinton-45 administration.

Neocons Back in Charge

So, Clinton’s election could mean that some of the most dangerous people in American foreign policy would be whispering their schemes for war and more war directly into her ear – and her record shows that she is very susceptible to such guidance.

At every turn, as a U.S. senator and as Secretary of State, Clinton has opted for “regime change” solutions – from the Iraq invasion in 2003 to the Honduras coup in 2009 to the Libyan air war in 2011 to the Syria civil war since 2011 – or she has advocated for the escalation of conflicts, such as in Afghanistan and with Iran, rather than engaging in reasonable give-and-take negotiations.

Though her backers tout her experience as Secretary of State, the reality was that she repeatedly disdained genuine diplomacy and was constantly hectoring President Obama into adopting the most violent and confrontational options.

He sometimes did (the Afghan “surge,” the Libyan war, the Iran nuclear stand-off) but he sometimes didn’t (reversing the Afghan escalation, finally negotiating a nuclear deal with Iran after Clinton left, rejecting a direct U.S. military assault on the Syrian government, and working at times with the Russians on Iran and Syria).

In other words, Obama acted as a register or brake restraining Clinton’s hawkishness. With Clinton as the President, however, she would have no such restraints. One could expect her to endorse many if not all the harebrained neocon schemes, much as President George W. Bush did when his neocon advisers exploited his fear and fury over 9/11 to guide him into their “regime change” agenda for the Middle East.

The neocons have never given up their dreams of overthrowing Mideast governments that Israel has put on its enemies list. Iraq was only the first. To follow were Syria and Iran with the idea that by installing pro-Israeli leaders in those countries, Israel’s close-in enemies – Lebanon’s Hezbollah, Hamas and other Palestinian militant groups – could be isolated and crushed.

After Bush’s Iraq invasion in 2003, Washington’s neocons were joking about whether Iran or Syria should come next, with the punch line: “Real men go to Tehran!” But the Iraq War wasn’t the “cakewalk” that the neocons had predicted. Instead of throwing flowers at the U.S. troops, Iraqis planted IEDs.

http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/04/11/would-clinton-win-mean-more-wars
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:23 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:

Lash's account as usual is a load of hogwash.

No need to get nasty. It really shows a lot about the character of the hypocrite who obviously lacks any degree of self-awareness.
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:28 pm
@Lash,
Your right, I did get nasty, I apologize.

I happen to think the Welfare Reform Act was a good thing as it did get people off of welfare who did kind of use it just to get free stuff. I am not talking of race here, but I personally knew of a woman who actually admitted she had babies to get welfare, she was white. It was people like that who prevented people who actually need help from getting it. People can't do that kind of thing anymore.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:38 pm
@Lash,
Quote Lash:
Quote:
Stop posting those friggin unemployment stats from the Clinton era, you brainless lying dickel.

If you can produce two quotes or two links to messages where I posted the unemployment stats during the Clinton era, I shall post a pic of a receipt where I made a $27 contribution to the candidate of your choice, be it Bernie, Trump, David Duke, Vladimir Putin, or whomever.

Otherwise, be a nice girl and take those meds the nice doctor said will help you from seeing things that aren't really there.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  4  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:41 pm
@revelette2,
My family was on welfare for 10 years after this law passed. I don't think they ever noticed a difference and we never went hungry.
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 07:51 pm
@maporsche,
From yourlogicalfallacyis.com

Your logical fallacy is anecdotal.


You used a personal experience or an isolated example instead of a sound argument or compelling evidence.

It's often much easier for people to believe someone's testimony as opposed to understanding complex data and variation across a continuum. Quantitative scientific measures are almost always more accurate than personal perceptions and experiences, but our inclination is to believe that which is tangible to us, and/or the word of someone we trust over a more 'abstract' statistical reality.

Example: Jason said that that was all cool and everything, but his grandfather smoked, like, 30 cigarettes a day and lived until 97 - so don't believe everything you read about meta analyses of methodologically sound studies showing proven causal relationships.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  2  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 08:11 pm
@Lash,
Quote Lash:
Quote:
I think a good descriptor for Bill is neodemocrat. Republican light...

From your own article which you used to try to attack Clinton:
Quote:
“They say the welfare reform bill increased poverty,” Clinton said. “Then why did we have the largest drop in African-American poverty in history when I was president? The largest in history.”

Your "attack" article did not refute this statement.

This is your "attack" against Bill Clinton? An article that says, "Sure he reduced black poverty by two thirds, but boy, was that guy ever racist". You Bernie people need better hatchet men to go after Clinton. The guys you got just aren't getting the job done.

0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 09:59 pm
Dick Cheney heaps praise on Hillary Clinton
Former US vice president Dick Cheney has praised Hillary Clinton as one of the more competent members of President Barack Obama's administration, saying it would be "interesting to speculate" on how she would perform as president.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/us-politics/8741148/Dick-Cheney-heaps-praise-on-Hillary-Clinton.html
ehBeth
 
  3  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 10:01 pm
@edgarblythe,
7:00AM BST 05 Sep 2011

yup

that's timely

good effort though
Blickers
 
  3  
Reply Mon 11 Apr, 2016 10:05 pm
@ehBeth,
Omigod. Dick Cheney said something nice about Hillary five years ago and Edgar is reporting it now as being relevant.
 

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