1 in 5 women get raped?

@Lustig Andrei,

Lustig Andrei wrote:

This is the thing so many people don't seem to get -- rape is a crime of violence, not lustful sex. The sex is apparently secondary to the domination factor.

Andy here has clearly not looked at the sexual assault definition over the last few decades I see. Violence is not required, Lack of consent defines sexual assault, that being state mandated forms of consent. Violence to define rape went by the boards because the feminists demanded that women be allowed to remain passive and non commutative and still retail the right to claim to be victims of sexual assault.

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

rape is a sexual assault but not all sexual assault is rape.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

Quote:

I'm sure BillRM will be claiming Jesse Matthew is a victim of circumstance.

Or he'll find some way of blaming his victims for their rapes and deaths.

Hannah Graham had been drinking the night she disappeared, before she was seen on a surveillance video tape with Jesse Matthew following her. Police believe she may have gotten lost and gotten into a car with Matthew. Therefore, according to how BillRM sees these things, her death was her own fault--by partying that night she was asking to be sexually assaulted and murdered by Matthew, because "men shouldn't be expected to be the guardians of women".

His paranoia and negative feelings toward women are so strong, he really doesn't give a damn if they get raped, or probably murdered either.

edit: Good grief, BillRM just posted this:

Quote:

I will dare to stated that the murder victim sadly placed herself at very very high risk of harm the night she ran into Mathew.

Of course teenagers both males and females tend to think that they are invulnerable and add in alcohol into the mixed and in this case it sadly cost her her life.

He is blaming Hannah Graham for her own death. Rolling Eyes

But, if Jesse Matthew had been stopped when the first sexual assault claim was lodged against him, at the first university he attended, rather than just being allowed to easily transfer to another university, where another sexual complaint was lodged against him, Hannah Graham might still be alive. and so would the other student he is suspected of murdering.

I'm glad that the colleges and universities will have to come up with better procedures for investigating and adjudicating the sexual assault complaints they deal with, and have to work more closely with the police. The sexual predators on campuses have to be identified so they can be stopped.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Even if woman is high on drugs and drunk into the bargain, standing in front of a man with little or nothing on, if she indicates she does not want sex with him (or is unconscious) and he then rapes her he and he alone is responsible for his criminal actions, not the victim. No woman or man or child asked to be raped, if they do, then it is not rape.

You have sunk lower pond scum in my estimation.

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

rape is a sexual assault but not all sexual assault is rape.

No levels of sexual transgression require violence anymore. The feminists went on a mission to convince us that sexual transgression is always about violence never about too much passion ( and we were dumb enough to fall for it) , then they went and rewrote the laws so that illegal sexual transgression has nothing to do with violence.

Any argument that the feminsts are not expert manipulators pretty much went out the window after that. As well that the feminists have any interest in honesty.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Quote:

Hannah Graham had been drinking the night she disappeared if she got herself drunk then she made a bad move. If she got herself drunk with no buddies to watch over her then she was doubly stupid, before she was seen on a surveillance video tape with Jesse Matthew following her. Police believe she may have gotten lost and gotten into a car with Matthew Proof then that she drank too much, and then she made another stupid move. Therefore, according to how BillRM sees these things, her death was her own fault--by partying that night she was asking to be sexually assaulted and murdered by Matthew, because "men shouldn't be expected to be the guardians of women" Looks like she did not take reasonable care to safeguard herself. Others should watch and learn what not to do.

Quote:

I'm glad that the colleges and universities will have to come up with better procedures for investigating and adjudicating the sexual assault complaints they deal with

Liar, you already said the justice system should handle it

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Quote:

Violence to define rape went by the boards because the feminists demanded that women be allowed to remain passive and non commutative and still retail the right to claim to be victims of sexual assault.

No, that's not correct.

The "No means no" laws required some verbal, or physical, indication of unwillingness, or lack of consent. They just didn't require that the victim be beaten and bloody to prove she was raped--that violence was used against her.

But rapes under the "No means no" definition are still legally considered forcible acts of assault that are committed against a person's will.

When the victim remained passive or non-communicative, without overt indication of non-consent, it allowed defendants, or those accused, to claim the silence of passivity was indication of consent.

That's the reason for the shift to a "Yes means yes" standard--it requires an affirmative response, and silence or passivity are no longer acceptable indications of consent. "Yes means yes" helps to eliminate that grey area, which makes it much clearer as an indication of consent, and it's why more and more colleges, and some states, are adopting it. And most people approve of using that standard.

Stop calling me a liar and distorting my opinions. I would rather see the college sexual assault complaints handled by the criminal justice system. But meanwhile that's not what is going on in most cases, and colleges and universities are now under a mandate from the federal government to improve the way they handle these matters, and I am happy about that. Is that too complicated for you to comprehend?

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@hawkeye10,

Quote:

No levels of sexual transgression require violence anymore. The feminists went on a mission to convince us that sexual transgression is always about violence never about too much passion ( and we were dumb enough to fall for it) , then they went and rewrote the laws so that illegal sexual transgression has nothing to do with violence.

Are you joking?

Your ignorance of current rape law is astounding.

Crimes of rape that involve violence, or weapons, or serious threats of harm, are still very much part of state sexual assault law, and they often result in additional charges when physical injuries are inflicted.

"Too much passion" is not an excuse, or rationalization, for sexual assault--and if the other party isn't consenting to that "passion" it's definitely a forcible assault--it is a form of aggression and violation.

Your constant reference to "feminists" is getting comical--where are these almighty feminists, you are never able to name, but you think re-wrote the laws? Weren't they written and passed into effect, by predominantly male state legislatures, and signed by predominantly male governors? A lot of men appear to be feminists, judging by that, so, at the very least, you should stop thinking of "feminists" as all being female. Vice President Biden has been one of the most influential feminists in the country for quite some time.

And it was the high number of acquaintance rapes or "date rapes", as opposed to the often more considerably violent stranger rapes, that left prosecutors without appropriate laws to deal with such crimes, which was a major reason for passage of "No means no" rape laws that didn't require the victim to be bloodied and beaten to prove her lack of consent, she could simply say, "No" .

Your paranoid obsession with unnamed feminists is nuts. Women, and not just feminists, vote, and they are getting elected to office in larger numbers, and they are concerned with issues, like sexual assaults, that most affect their gender. Of course they will press for changes in the law that better empower and protect them. It's really the increasing social and political power of women that threatens you, and, brace yourself, it's only going to grow stronger.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Quote:

It's really the increasing social and political power of women that threatens you, and, brace yourself, it's only going to grow stronger.

My posting history makes it very clear that to me this is about

1)the states abuse of the citizens, to include our very fucked up laws and abusive prosecutors

2) The idiot citizens still listening to the elites even though they have a horrible record of competence as well as honesty

3) the almost universal tendency these days to avoid facts, or more often imagining what you want things to be and then calling it a fact. This goes along with calling anything that you (figuratively speaking) dont want to be true a myth regardless of reality.

4) that policy all too often is decided by emotion

5) I really like sex, and I would like, no I ******* demand, that the state/the feminists, and everyone else leave me and my sex partners alone to do as we like. The state has no jurisdiction in my bedroom except under the most unusual circumstances.

6) the bosses of the state constantly telling us how to live our lives even thought they are clearly corrupt, have no interest in doing their actual work, and with them tending to be personally some pretty fucked up people. I dont need a boss, they need to shut the **** up about the alleged need for me and everyone else to adopt clean living and get back to the jobs we elect and pay them to do.

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@revelette2,

revelette2 wrote:

You have sunk lower pond scum in my estimation.

Pond scum has an important place in the ecosystem, and has never suggested that it's alright to rape someone as long as she's had a drink.

1 Reply

@revelette2,

Quote:

Even if woman is high on drugs and drunk into the bargain, standing in front of a man with little or nothing on, if she indicates she does not want sex

The problem occur when she is standing there naked and drunk or under the influence of drugs by her own free will and declared that she does indeed wish for sex and sex now and her partner who likely is also under the influence take her up on the offer.

Next day she then declared with the support of people like Firefly that her consent was not valid due to her conditions of being under the influence and therefore the sex was rape and the man should be locked up for a decade or so for taking her up on her offer.

This does happen and my favor example of that occurring is when a young lady at a party and under the influence decided that her birthday would be a good time to loss her virginity.

She found a young man sound asleep in a back room and jumping into bed with him woke him up and have sex with him,

Next day she is all broken up by her actions and her lost of her virginity charge the young man with rape under the theory that she was not in any shape to grant a valid consent.

The poor guy was a West Point Cadet and the damn military under pressure from congress due to the feminists have the man go through a full court martial before being found innocent.

Not a good way to start your military career before it even got started.

footnote: in case you have any question that this had occur I had posted the links to the above event any numbers of time on the can a woman ask to be rape thread and I sure I can find the links again if you wish.

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@hawkeye10,

Hawkeye as Firefly seems to had posted it is very very non-pc to pointed out that it is not a good idea for a young woman who is also below the legal age to drink to be running around at 2 am in the morning by herself and drunk out of her mind.

Firefly would must prefer other young women to die by way of sexual predators/murderers then to drill into young women that this is a very unsafe thing to do as after all in a perfect feminist world they would not be at any risk by doing so.

Anyone who know that we are not living in a perfect feminist world and would wish for young women to act in safer manner is accused of blaming the victim and not the murderer/rapist.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

Quote:

and has never suggested that it's alright to rape someone as long as she's had a drink.

An who suggested that my friend unless you are claiming that all sex even consensus sex between couples that are under the influence is rape due to the invalid consent issue.

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@BillRM,

That's exactly what you've said when you categorise 99.9% of rapes as women having had too much to drink and regretting it in the morning.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

That's exactly what you've said when you categorise 99.9% of rapes as women having had too much to drink and regretting it in the morning.

So you are claiming that I had somewhere came up with a 99.9 percent number?

If you can not disagree or disproved what I had said you then seem to feel free to make up positions out of thin air for me that you can then attacked.

Whether you or Firefly are the most dishonest person on this website is an open question.

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@BillRM,

Quote:

Hawkeye as Firefly seems to had posted it is very very non-pc to pointed out that it is not a good idea for a young woman who is also below the legal age to drink to be running around at 2 am in the morning by herself and drunk out of her mind.

Who said Hannah Graham was "drunk out of her mind"?

That's a great example of how you distort and lie to trash and blame female victims--in this case, blame them for their own murder.

Hannah apparently had been drinking that night, which may mean one or two drinks, and she did not appear drunk in the surveillance video in which she was seen with Jesse Matthew walking behind her. And she wasn't "running around" in a particularly unsafe location, she was in a main area, with a lot of activity and people around, when seen on that video. Earlier in the evening, she had dinner with friends and left them to go to a party, and was apparently intending to reunite with them at the time she was seen on the video with Matthew walking behind her.

No one knows what happened after that video clip, or how Matthew might have abducted her, or gotten her into a car, except she wound up dead.

Quote:

Firefly would must prefer other young women to die by way of sexual predators/murderers then to drill into young women that this is a very unsafe thing to do as after all in a perfect feminist world they would not be at any risk by doing so.

Then you're the one who wants to drill it into every young woman's head that every man she encounters might be a potential rapist/murderer, so she shouldn't trust any man, and it is not safe to go anywhere alone, at any time, because men make it unsafe to do so. Is that the view of men you want to promote? That conflicts, completely, with your constant complaints, and whining, about all men being regarded as potential rapists.

If, "in a perfect feminist world" women would no longer be in danger of being raped or murdered if they went out for a night of socializing, then I want to live in that world. At the same time you quibble about, and deny, rape statistics, like 1 in 5, you admit women are less safe, and more vulnerable to rape, and even murder, because you wouldn't warn an 18 year old male it was "unsafe" for him to go out at night to socialize with friends. You want women to have to leave in fear of men, and have to curtail their lives, because of the reality of possible rape--you know those statistics represent real danger for women, so stop denying that. But the danger comes, not from anything the woman does, but from the predators, like Jesse Matthew, who walk around quite freely. But you have no interest in identifying those predators, or making sure we get them off the streets or off campuses.

Jesse Matthews was accused of sexual assault at both universities he attended, over a decade ago. Since then, he has been linked to a rape and attempted murder, and two murders. Had the universities better investigated those early incidents, or regarded them more seriously, rather than letting him just transfer from one school to another, or just drop out to avoid a hearing, he might have been stopped over a decade ago.

But you fail to take the issue of campus sexual assaults seriously, even though most are committed by serial predators, like Jesse Matthew. You worry about "ruining their college careers"--rather than all the women they may go onto rape or harm with other violence . You really don't care if women are raped, you really don't care that Hannah Graham was murdered--according to you, it was her own fault for not staying home, and for going out to enjoy herself with friends. That's your solution to the problem of rape--college women should stay home, out of fear, but go easy on the campus rapists because you might ruin their "college careers"?

You're not being "non-pc", you're continuously exhibiting your terminal stupidity and hostility toward women.

2 Replies

@firefly,

firefly wrote:

You really don't care if women are raped, you really don't care that Hannah Graham was murdered--according to you, it was her own fault for not staying home, and for going out to enjoy herself with friends. That's your solution to the problem of rape--college women should stay home, out of fear, but go easy on the campus rapists because you might ruin their "college careers"?

You're not being "non-pc", you're continuously exhibiting your terminal stupidity and hostility toward women.

That's it in a nutshell.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

according to you, it was her own fault for not staying home, and for going out to enjoy herself with friends

An Firefly does not care how many other young women died in the future by exposing themselves to unneeded risks as to try to convince them not to do so is non-PC and mean that you must be trying to limit their freedoms and taking the side of the rapists and murderers.

Now going out and enjoying herself with friends is not all that must of a risk but while underage getting herself complete drunk and running around alone repeat alone at 2 AM hooking up with someone that will help her get more alcohol is a horse of another color and a completely unneeded risk that I would not care to have anyone I care about taking.

Let run an analogy with your truly say I decided to get my hands on drugs and in order to do so I went into a very high crime area of town where drugs are being sold at 2 AM.

Instead of selling me drugs a gentleman pull out a gun an killed me in order to get my money without selling me any drugs.

Well the criminal who killed me is surely at fault but my lack of judgment open me up to being in a place and time where I was a great deal more likely to be harm.

But once more we can not tell our young women not to run unneeded risks as that is very very non-PC and Firefly would prefer young women to died instead of suggesting that it might be wise to used some commonsense judgment.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

Now going out and enjoying herself with friends is not all that must of a risk but while underage getting herself complete drunk and running around alone repeat alone at 2 AM hooking up with someone that will help her get more alcohol is a horse of another color and a completely unneeded risk that I would not care to have anyone I care about taking.

Please find and cite, any evidence, at all, that Hannah Graham was "completely drunk"? I have read absolutely nothing about this crime to support that. And she wasn't in an "unsafe location, she was in a very busy main downtown mall when seen on that video.

Cite any evidence that this statement is at all true-- " at 2 AM hooking up with someone that will help her get more alcohol". How do you know that? The police don't know what happened after she was seen on that video, but you're claiming to know? Matthew is charged with abducting her "with intent to defile" before he killed her.

So you're choosing to try to maliciously paint this 18 year old as a reckless drunk--in order to blame her for her own death?

You are one sick bastard.

The only "bad judgment" is in not stopping these sexual predators--like Jesse Matthew--and delivering maximum punishments--when their patterns first surface while they are college students, and allegations of sexual assault against them are first made.

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@izzythepush,

I don't wonder that BillRM's ex-wife got an Order of Protection from him. Given his hostility toward women, they should all have Orders of Protection from him.

1 Reply

1 in 5 women get raped?

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