Affairs

I think it is natural for people to feel upset if they suddenly find out about a parental affair.

But "do"?

Nothing. For the reasons others have given above.

At age 11, I found a foil package in Dad's pants, while helping do the laundry. I saved it and asked Dad what a prophylactic was, since that was on the label. He explained about it's use and it being called "protection", by some.

I had to ask him why he used it and he then told me of his affair with a woman other than Mom. He explained that he and Mom had started having severe problems . I accepted this easily, since they had been divorced for four years and had remarried only two years previous to the discovery. I also knew that Mom was bitter towards him for over 6 months and made life hell for everyone.

The following weekend, I was introduced to her and her daughter, about my age. The woman was divorced and liked Dad a lot, but didn't want any more children in her life on a permanent basis. Their relationship was one of close, affectionate friendship.

Shortly after, Mom and Dad split up for good and I never heard nor saw the woman or her daughter again. I never told Mom, since I figured that it would only add fuel to the bitterness she had towards my dad and still holds after 45 years.

In short, it was between them.

Blame, should one look to do it, is not as easy to address as it might seem at first or even third glance. Marriages are complex, and as others here say, between the two people. Many children age hating one parent and decades later begin to reassess. Certainly not always, but sometimes.

Sure the child will have a reaction to the news. Meddling, though, is really inappropriate.

Ratting in particular is really icky. Many times the cheated on party suspects or in any case would not want to be told. Again, not the child's business. Even if you don't think as I do that it is icky, it creates another whole dynamic that might not go where you think it would.

It is also true that many long term marriages have cycles of distance and coming back together within them - again, not your business to manipulate, or try to manipulate.

ossobuco,



I would like to add, or to be manipulated.
In far too many cases of infidelity and or divorce one or both of the immediate parties try to enlist the children on their side. If successful this manipulation may cause a rift which never heals. I have seen children shun one parent because of what they did, real or imagined, to their former partner. It seems to me that the manipulator thinks that children can love only one parent.
The only losers when this happens are the children. They learn to hate and miss out on knowing the shunned parent.

Sam

Indeed, Sam - that is a very common and insidious form of emotional child abuse - where, often, parents are so overcome by their own emotions that they forget their children have a right to an un-contaminated relationship with both parents.

It is a sad and ugly thing to see.

You're both right, I was going to mention children as pawns...
and is pretty much what I was getting at with talking about a child hating one parent for years and revising that view, maybe, sometime later on.
Well, parents and children can have a manipulating fest, or perhaps just one person does it. Some people aren't self aware enough to know they are manipulating..

Then, of course, sadly, some parents are just hateful!

So, Cereal, this is of course none of our business, but if you are dealing with this, I am sorry to hear it.

Dlowan,

It's not only sad and ugly to see, but worse to experience. I went through it with my mom and still hear an occassional remark about Dad, even though he's been gone for 27 years!

My first wife worked on my kids to a point that my oldest daughter is now using the same tactics, learned from her mother's feelings towards me. After my oldest daughter's last phone call to me, I cried for over an hour, I hurt so badly. But I have decided that I'll not speak or write to her until she comes to my door with my grandchildren. The last time I saw her and the kids was at her husband's funeral 1 1/2 years ago.

I haven't locked the door on her, but she needs to open it. I won't subject myself to the pain, when there are so many people that have opened their homes and hearts to Sam and me. There are people and children that smile and come for a hug, as soon as they see us. So why allow my daughter to hurt me? I did the best I could as a parent, but apparently she feels otherwise.

Her brother and sister told me straight out that they want me out of their lives and both have said "Don't contact me." I don't like it, but I respect their being straightforward with me. The games that the oldest has played are despicable.

No.

Strictly a hypothetical for me. I was curious of peoples opinions on the matter.

Ah, that's good, CK.

Wiyaka, I know it must hurt horribly. Maybe your daughter's take on things will change in time. Time can sure be long.

I am just in the last decade opening up in my memory collection with room for my mother's view on our family life, really, room for her in my heart.
And I am olllllllllllllllllder. And my mother was not at all horrible.

Complicating the already complicated, I think some of these matters can relate back to - if not Freud and associated names - back to rather natural sex/gender associations and rivalries with one parent or the other.

ossbuco,

I have met Wiyaka's children. All three of them are divorced, remarried and one is widowed. One would think they would know the games some partners play for the affection of their children but they refuse to recognize them in their mother.
On one occasion the youngest daughter public berated Wiyaka about distorted incidents using them as the reasons for shunning Wiyaka. She blames Wiyaka for not visiting her and the other children when her mother and stepfather were preventing not only visits but phone calls as well.
Loyalty has it's good points but it should never be blind. My mom was self-centered and manipulative, she pushed me, head first, off of the back porch onto a concrete walk when I was four years old. I still love her, after all she's my mom. Dad drank too much, embarrassing and at times frightening the day lights out of me. He is still the best dad in the world.
It is difficult for some people to shed the childhood image all powerful perfect parents and accept the frail human beings that all really parents are.

Sam

Oh, yeow.

Goodness! I didn't realise how lucky I am.

There is nothing a child at any age can do to change their parents lifestyle or life choices. They can choose to embrace their parents and overlook the things they don't like. I think parents give their children the same, on some level.
However, on the topic of love affairs, when my mother found a box of rubbers in the truck of my step dads car - our whole family was brought into this ugly graphic web of crap. Sorry folks, it wasn't kept between two consenting contractual adults. My brother and I had to hear it all and witness it all. Every time the phone would ring and no one was there - it was like World War 3. Not to mention him coming home late - what a sh*tstorm. I just wish, if my step dad wanted whatever on the side, for whatever reason - we didn't have to hear all about it. It was an ugly, ugly mess.
How do I feel about it today? I genuinely feel sorry for them both. I don't think they meant it to be as ugly as it was and I do not think they're bad people. But please people, if your going to have an affair and you have kids - try to keep it between two contractual adults. We don't want to hear it.

Oh, yes.

Ouch! having to witness that kind of stuff between you parents sure batters your emotions. I understand you feeling sorry for them. I think most parents are just people trying to do what they believe is right at the time. (Just like us.)
Not just affairs but any verbal "knock down drag out fights" are not the best thing for children to hear or see. I got so tired of mom shrieking at dad that I threatened to go on a hunger strike until they started acting like adults. It actually worked, she still voiced her opinions but more quietly.
The other thing about affairs is the breakdown of trust for everyone involved. That is so hard to rebuild once it is damaged; more so when the damage is repeated.
Forgiving is easy forgetting is hard, allowing people to change is hardest.

Sam

I tried to intervene on some level at the time, doing more household chores, offering to help my step dad with the yard work - trying to "keep the peace". It didn't work. I'm glad Sam that your mom was "aware" enough of your feelings to at least try to maintain her temper. My parents were way to wrapped up in what they were going through to notice how it was affecting my brother and I. Oh well (sigh) I'm all grown up now and see both sides (thus the sympathy).
You are too right - kids should not have to see that kind of ugliness between their parents. I understand disagreements but downright dehumanizing ugliness is a wee bit hard for children to comprehend...until much later anyway. Thanks for the validation Sam, my parents have never done that for me and I don't think they ever will.

Gee, I hope it was awareness on mom's part. I think she had a mental picture of me wasting away and having to deal with the wrath of both grannies. :wink: Two formidable women capable of cutting you dead with a look.
Perhaps one of the reasons (?) parents have blow ups in front of children is that they are children and too young to understand. Bovine excreta, children hear the viciousness and understand that all too well.
Lots of zen hugs to you now and to those two children who had to witness such ugly displays. When ever I hear about nasty childhood experiences I want to go back in time and comfort the child/children involved. I want to tell them that just because mom and dad are angry with each other they still love you. When the sh*t hits the fan parents ofter forget to do that.

XXXXXXXXXXXXX

Sam