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Why do most Americans oppose gay marriage?

 
 
Debra Law
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 10:21 am
Re: Why do most Americans oppose gay marriage?
jora wrote:
I read that only 22% of Americas think that gay marriages should be allowed. What is this, nazi Germany? Makes me ashamed to be American myself.


If two consenting adults want to "get married" to celebrate their love and commitment to each other and to provide for each other (emotionally, financially, etc.)--that's their business--not mine.

It's a privacy issue.

Every individual has an unalienable right to privacy. Every individual has the right to live his or her life without unreasonable government intrusion or oppression.

The government does not have any compelling reason for treating same-sex couples differently than heterosexual couples. There is no justifiable reason (in the constitutional sense) for denying same-sex couples the right to marry. Even if the majority of Americans are against same-sex marriages, so what?

This country was formed to protect individual rights against the whims of tyranny and oppression. The mob does not rule. (Or at least, in theory, the mob is not supposed to rule--the mob is supposed to respect individual rights--no lynching allowed.)

Too many people in this world spend too much time being overly concerned about other people's private matters. Many unconstitutional laws have been passed in this country due to the interfering holier-than-thou mob mentality, but eventually (even if it takes a hundred years or more), the U.S. Supreme Court gets around to striking down these unconstitutional laws and we progress as a society.

We have a long way to go, but we're working on it.

Someday, same-sex couples will be allowed to get married.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 10:34 am
The Stern Miss Law's point is well taken--a century ago, miscegeny laws were common right across the country, north and south, east and west. In particular, one should pay attention to her caveat about how long it can take to arrive at something like justice.
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stuh505
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 11:24 am
Quote:
Stuh, that last point confuses me. First you said that the only thing that can cause people to be gay is a simple genetic mutation, but then you say that most bisexuals or gays choose to be gay.


There are two kinds of gay; people who cannot hepl being gay, and people who have no physical differences that would make them gay but simply choose to do it as a fetish.

scoates wrote:
Also, a question to everyone. It's not meant to be tricky, I am just curious. If a couple wishes to be married, and neither of them are in any way religious, what options do they have? Do they have to have a ceremony, or is there a way to just pay the fee?


You are not aware of the justice of the peace? many of my family members have been married legally this way with no ceremony and no fee (there mght be a fee actually but it is miniscule if there is one).


Quote:
Agreed, but my point is that there are a very large number of people in the world for whom, "holy matrimony", has no religious aspect. That has been the case throughout recorded history, so to say;

Quote:
I'm sure it has religious background, even if it has been adopted to "seperation of church and state" society.


Is somewhat unsupportable.


The whole point is that it HASNT been adopted into separation of chruch and state well...like many things, such as our CURRENCY. Anyway, I agree that marriage has for many people lost any religious connotation.

Foxfyre your solution would work fine I think.

jnhofzinser,

I did not assume that gayness was genetic...I said it could also be an "imbalance" and an imbalance could be caused by personal choices a person makes (similarly to depression)

Quote:
This misses the entire point; the gay community does not wish "equal, but separate" status, the want to be considered, and accepted as part of the mainstream. (They basically wish to be 'ordinary'!)


well, they ARENT ordinary...sorry for them. There is no reason to lie and say it is normal for people to be gay, it is not selected for and gays are a minority. Im not saying we should discriminate but come on...its NOT normal lets not forget this.

Debra law wrote:
This country was formed to protect individual rights against the whims of tyranny and oppression. The mob does not rule. (Or at least, in theory, the mob is not supposed to rule--the mob is supposed to respect individual rights--no lynching allowed.)

Too many people in this world spend too much time being overly concerned about other people's private matters. Many unconstitutional laws have been passed in this country due to the interfering holier-than-thou mob mentality, but eventually (even if it takes a hundred years or more), the U.S. Supreme Court gets around to striking down these unconstitutional laws and we progress as a society.

We have a long way to go, but we're working on it.

Someday, same-sex couples will be allowed to get married.


freedom and respect for privacy are of the utmost concern. as long as people arent hurting other people they should be allowed to live their lives as they see fit. the government should not view gays differently than non-gays. BUT marriage is originally a christian tradition and the government also cant take away the the right for christians and their litle club to make up whatever rules they want about whos allowed into the tree fort.
0 Replies
 
limbodog
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 11:46 am
stuh505 wrote:
BUT marriage is originally a christian tradition and the government also cant take away the the right for christians and their litle club to make up whatever rules they want about whos allowed into the tree fort.


I think I was with you right to that point.

Since when did Christians invent marriage?
0 Replies
 
stuh505
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 12:32 pm
All religions are the same to me, if I got the exact one wrong, I'm sorry...
0 Replies
 
limbodog
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 12:40 pm
stuh505 wrote:
All religions are the same to me, if I got the exact one wrong, I'm sorry...


I admit to having a tough time telling one branch of Christianity from another myself. But all religions? (pretty sure the Catholics are the one with pointy-hat-guy)

Regardless, there is no evidence to suggest:

1. Marriage came from one source and was not invented multiple times in multiple cultures.

2. The inventors were religious icons.
0 Replies
 
disenter512
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 01:19 pm
Quote:
3) against God's will - sez who? I read a different prayer book than most of the people in my state, and I fully expect that my friends from my last job read another, and my neighbors read yet another and you get the point. The bottom line is, who's to say what God's will is? Whose interpretation is perfectly correct? Wasn't it allegedly God's will that we have slavery in this country? Wasn't it supposedly God's will that we not allow interracial marriages here? Wasn't it said to be God's will that we not give women the right to vote? And what about separation of church and state? Why should our ideas of what's legal and not legal be dictated at all by what is written in anyone's prayer book?


Ok I know you run the show but a prayer book is not the Bible I don't care who you are if you know anything about God the Christians God it is pretty clear that He Hates the sin of sodomy (go get a bible and read about sodom and gomorrah) God created men and women to fulfill the function of repopulation. and Homosexual behavior is a twist and perversion of marriage and natural order. Do you see gay animals ......NO men and women were created for each other. The Bible doesn't say anything about women voting or black rights but on this it is clear. Too many times people invoke Gods name and have no clue what the heck they are doing.
0 Replies
 
limbodog
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 01:30 pm
Actually, there are gay animals. Case in point: we've a pair of mated penguins (mate for life you know) which are both male at the Aquarium in Boston.

And I think the point that person was making is that not everyone shares religious views.
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Rick d Israeli
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 01:49 pm
limbodog wrote:
Rick d'Israeli wrote:
stuh505 wrote:
I think gayness should be tolerated but not supported, since it is in fact an abnormal sexual desire...and many gay people are much more about sex than straight people.

This has nothing to do with the fact whether you are gay or not. It has to do with whether you are male or female. Males have a larger sexual desire than females (in general). A male homosexual couple has more sex than heterosexual couples, yes. On the other hand, a female homosexual couple has less sex than heterosexual couples.

You don't know the gay women I know.

You don't know the gay women I know. :wink:
0 Replies
 
limbodog
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 01:53 pm
Rick d'Israeli wrote:
You don't know the gay women I know. :wink:


maybe we should introduce 'em. Smile
0 Replies
 
Rick d Israeli
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 02:03 pm
Mr. Green Good one limbodog.

No seriously, for example HIV-infections is lowest among gay women, and one of the explanations for that is that gay women don't have as much sex as heterosexuals or gay males.
0 Replies
 
patiodog
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 02:07 pm
Um, there are some mechanical reasons for infection rates being very low among lesbians, as well.
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Rick d Israeli
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 02:09 pm
True. That's why I said 'one of the explanations'. It has also to do with, for example, the low number of HIV-virusses in the vaginal fluids.
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Rick d Israeli
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 02:10 pm
But I'm getting off topic now.
0 Replies
 
limbodog
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 02:11 pm
Rick d'Israeli wrote:
Mr. Green Good one limbodog.

No seriously, for example HIV-infections is lowest among gay women, and one of the explanations for that is that gay women don't have as much sex as heterosexuals or gay males.


I think that's that they're less inclined to have as many partners.

(that and slightly less likely to transmit diseases)
0 Replies
 
JLNobody
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 03:47 pm
I havn't been keeping up so this may be redundant. If lesbians have lower rates of HIV it may be because they do not receive it from males. Remember, it's the exchange of fluids that does it, either by sex or from needles. And female sex partners generally do not exchange fluids, except for saliva. Have I, as a naive male, missed something?
0 Replies
 
SCoates
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 03:53 pm
Adrian wrote:
Agreed, but my point is that there are a very large number of people in the world for whom, "holy matrimony", has no religious aspect. That has been the case throughout recorded history, so to say;

Quote:
I'm sure it has religious background, even if it has been adopted to "seperation of church and state" society.


Is somewhat unsupportable.


I can be sure of something, and still be incorrect. Smile
0 Replies
 
SCoates
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 04:11 pm
As far as justices of the peace, I just hadn't thought it out. I can't picture a marriage without a wedding. Seems kind of pointless, since weddings are better than marriages. Smile
0 Replies
 
stuh505
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 05:21 pm
my dad used the JOP for his 3rd wedding...dropping 30k on a day would be fun once or twice but i think id probably just want a JOP for #3+ also...Razz
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Thu 15 Jul, 2004 05:49 pm
stuh505 wrote:

well, they ARENT ordinary...sorry for them. There is no reason to lie and say it is normal for people to be gay, it is not selected for and gays are a minority. Im not saying we should discriminate but come on...its NOT normal lets not forget this.


It is normal for people to be gay. Being in a minority does not make people abnormal. Or are American men over the age of 25 abnormal? click
0 Replies
 
 

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