25
   

Israel's Reality

 
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 09:56 pm
@bobsal u1553115,
Quote:
Images of Gaza Devastation - a picture can destroy a thousand lies


What lies................
oralloy
 
  -2  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:21 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Romeo Fabulini wrote:
Has anybody here come forward yet to suggest a solution to the Israel/Hamas thing, or have I missed it?

I have a solution. I've not mentioned it until now.

First, have Israel mount a full-scale ground invasion and completely conquer the Gaza Strip, renewing the occupation. This occupation would be military-only. No settlers.

If Palestinians in parts of the West Bank prove restive, Israel should mount a similar invasion/military occupation of those areas.

Second, have Israel declare the Security Fence as their official border. Israel should annex all territory on their side of the Security Fence. All settlements on the other side of the Security Fence should be dismantled and withdrawn.

Having a declared border, with no settlers outside the border, will undercut all the calls to grant Israeli citizenship to Palestinians living outside the border.

Having the Israeli military in direct control of the Palestinians will prevent the rocket attacks.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:23 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:
People can be against Israel without being a Jew hater.

Trying to disguise anti-Semitism by directing false accusations "at Israel" instead of "at Jews" does not change the fact that it is anti-Semitism.


revelette2 wrote:
the fact is that a lot of innocent Palestinians are being killed by Israeli bombs.

That's hardly a fact. The casualty figures are fake.

But even if it were true, Israel still has the right to defend themselves.
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:24 pm
@BillRM,
That IDF targets "military" targets only, it doesn't carpet bomb. For starters.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:35 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
Trying to disguise anti-Semitism by directing false accusations "at Israel" instead of "at Jews" does not change the fact that it is anti-Semitism.


Like these guys:

http://www.nkusa.org/activities/Demonstrations/2014/20140705London/new/IMG-20140706-WA0010-N.jpg

Anti-Zionist Jews torch Israeli flag in New York during Purim
By JPOST.COM STAFF
03/18/2014 12:35





Members of a sect of hassidic Jews in Williamsburg, New York took part during Purim in a demonstration of their opposition to the existence of the State of Israel.

In a video published Monday, a crowd lead by Satmar Hassidim in the Brooklyn neighborhood engage in an annual Purim tradition of torching an Israeli flag.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:38 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:
Pretty handy to have a scapegoat to continue to slaughter innocent lives.

Pretty outrageous to suggest that the Israelis are trying to slaughter innocents.

But it is indeed pretty handy that Jews have the same right to defend themselves that any other person has.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:44 pm
@RABEL222,
There's a pack of morons here that want it to stay that way.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:44 pm
@Olivier5,
Olivier5 wrote:
Are you a decent human being, butt? I haven't seen you express much compassion about the massive toll on Palestinian civilians....

Don't be silly Olivier. There is hardly a massive toll.

And more to the point, the Palestinians deserve every bit of what is happening to them.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:45 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Romeo Fabulini wrote:
Some people including me have called it "human shields" but on second thoughts it might simply be a military tactic.

The use of human shields is indeed a military tactic. However, it is an illegal military tactic.
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:47 pm
Israeli military wanted prior review of New York Times articles on soldier Goldin

By: Sydney Smith
August 02, 2014 09:22 PM EST

Israeli military wanted prior review of New York Times articles on soldier Goldin

http://www.imediaethics.org/newsImages/B_Image_4672.JPG

Israel's military censor wanted prior review of the New York Times' article on Second Lt. Hadar Goldin, a missing Israeli officer now believed dead.

In the New York Times' August 1 article, "Gaza Fighting Intensifies as Cease-Fire Falls Apart," the newspaper revealed that it was the first time "in more than six years" Israel wanted prior review.

The Times said it didn't fully comply with the order. Instead of sending "a draft of this article," they just "summarized" the section of its article about Goldin in a phone call. The Times's report reads, as of August 2:

"Israel’s military censor informed The New York Times that material related to the missing officer had to be submitted for review, the first such notification in more than six years. International journalists must agree in writing to the censorship system in order to work in Israel. The Times did not send the censor a draft of this article before publication, but summarized over the phone its biographical references to Lieutenant Goldin."

Interestingly, the Huffington Post noted that the Times didn't include that paragraph about the censor until "nearly six hours" after publication, pointing to News Diffs' record of changes to the article. That may have been because the prior review request came after publication for future reports.

iMediaEthics wrote to the Times to ask when exactly the paragraph was added and why it was added after publication.

In a report just published tonight, the Times reported Goldin is "now believed dead." iMediaEthics asked the Times if they were required to submit or read any portion or summary of this article to the military before publication, and if the gag order is over now that Goldin is reportedly dead.

The Times' spokesperson Eileen Murphy simply sent iMediaEthics the following statement from foreign editor Joseph Kahn.

"We are not submitting NYT articles for prior review by Israeli censors. We are aware of a very narrow issue that concerns the censors about the background of the captive solider. And our reporters in Israel have not reported on that issue. But censors are not reviewing what we publish prior to publication."

Times public editor Margaret Sullivan wrote about the Israeli request. According to Sullivan, Times foreign editor Kahn described this instance as "military censorship" as opposed to a "gag order."

Kahn explained that New York Times staff in Israel is held to the prior review requirement. But, he said the Times hasn't sent any articles for approval.

"Our accredited staff in Israel cannot legally publish stories on subjects the censors declare a matter of national security unless they are reviewed by censors and cleared," he told Sullivan. "In this case, they have declared detailed reporting about the missing Israeli soldier a matter that the censors need to review. "

He added, "We do of course use our full international staff to cover important issues, and The Times as a whole is not subject to Israeli censorship. So our broader report is not necessarily impacted by a censorship order in Israel or any other country.”"

For example, Sullivan noted the Times can skirt the prior review requirement if a journalist based outside of Israel writes about the issue the government wants to censor, like earlier this year when the Israeli government put in place a "court-imposed gag order" about reporting on journalist Majd Kayyal, who had been detained.

Calling the gag order "disturbing," Sullivan commented that at least Israeli military had a "narrow" request for review -- that being stories on the soldier Goldin.

"This instance is not entirely dissimilar to the American government holding back details on an American citizen, for example, a soldier, diplomat or spy caught up in hostile action, that could place that person in greater jeopardy," Sullivan wrote.

In a statement to the Huffington Post, Kahn added "We are aware of a very narrow issue that concerns the censors about the background of the captive solider...And our reporters in Israel have not reported on that issue. But censors are not reviewing what we publish prior to publication."
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:48 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
The massacre of so many Palestinians by Israel leads many outsiders to think the Zionist nation is driven by a bloodlust to eradicate as many Palestinians as they can so the next time they attack the Palestinians on one pretext or another, there will be fewer left.....and there will be more room for settlements!

Don't be silly. There aren't very many Palestinians being killed. They are faking the casualty figures.

And more to the point, the strikes on Gaza are entirely defensive in nature. The only thing driving the strikes is the need to prevent the Palestinians from murdering innocent people.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:49 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Romeo Fabulini wrote:
Speaking of war crimes, surely Hamas firing rockets at Israeli towns is a war crime?

Yes.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:49 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
And this is one of the chief reasons Israel's actions will be labelled war crimes waged against the vulnerable Palestinians with nowhere to escape;

Only anti-Semites think it is a crime for a Jew to defend himself when he is attacked.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:50 pm
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:
What I am against is the oppression and the stealing of land the State of Israel does against Palestinians.

Israel is neither oppressing people nor stealing land. They merely defend themselves against aggressors who refuse to make peace.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 10:55 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
The use of human shields is indeed a military tactic. However, it is an illegal military tactic.


And a war crime
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 11:04 pm
@BillRM,
So's collective punishment. Its a war crime. Yet IDF delivers it day after day.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Sat 2 Aug, 2014 11:47 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Quote:
Gaza (along with the West Bank and East Jerusalem) is occupied Palestinian territory under international law,

No it isn't.


Quote:
determined by the vast majority of the world,

Why do anti-Semites always pretend that they speak for the world when they spew their hateful lies?

BTW, JTT already cut-n-pasted this gob of anti-Semitism some time ago. It isn't so good that it deserves a re-post.


Quote:
Gaza cannot commit aggression against Israel,

When Palestinians reject peace and launch unprovoked attacks, that counts as aggression.


Quote:
since Israel is in constant and continual commission of illegal aggression against Palestine by occupying it

As already noted, Israel is not occupying anything.

But if they were occupying Gaza, that would not in any way be illegal.


Quote:
(illegally and sadistically blockading it

There is nothing even remotely illegal about the blockade.

The suggestion that it sadistic is silly.


Quote:
frequently committing terrorism against its civilians,

The only people here engaging in terrorism are the Palestinians.


Quote:
including by targeting them with chemical weapons provided by US taxpayers

Israel has never used chemical weapons. The US taxpayers have never provided Israel with chemical weapons.

I suspect (but didn't bother to check) that Israel has never even possessed chemical weapons.


Quote:
As documented by Amnesty Int’l, Human Rights Watch, and many others, Israel intentionally targets and murders civilians, including children, en masse.

No one has ever documented any case of Israel targeting civilians.

However, it has been documented that the Palestinians target only civilians.


Moment-in-Time wrote:
There is nothing the US government can do to prevent academic institutions from pulling their funds from any Israeli business, etc.

Don't count on that.


Moment-in-Time wrote:
Regardless the outcome, the current Israeli massacre of the Palestinians is labelled a war crime.

The fact that anti-Semites lie about Israel does not make the lies true.


Moment-in-Time wrote:
I am still hopeful that the BDS will work its magic. It's a possibility that many Israeli leaders might be arrested if they try to travel to Europe, given time.

Europe’s largest teachers’ union endorses Israel boycott call
http://www.bdsmovement.net/2014/europes-largest-teachers-union-endorses-israel-boycott-call-12039#sthash.WPMlg8F4.dpuf
____
Proposals for academic boycotts of Israel have been made by academics and organisations in Palestine,[1] the United States,[2] the United Kingdom,[3] and other countries to boycott Israeli universities and academics. The goal of proposed academic boycotts is to isolate Israel in order to force a change in Israel's policies towards the Palestinians which proponents state to be discriminatory and oppressive, including oppressive to the academic freedom of Palestinians.[4]

It is shameful the way we've allowed anti-Semitism to take root in our educational institutions.


Moment-in-Time wrote:
The US always does that, thus insuring there will never ever be justice in this ME conflict.

I don't know about that. While the supposed "big death toll" is clearly faked, it has been quite nice seeing the Palestinians get what they deserve these past weeks.

If that's not justice, it's a pretty close second.
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Sun 3 Aug, 2014 12:07 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
Why do anti-Semites always pretend that they speak for the world when they spew their hateful lies?


How about these antiSemites? Why do you cut these antiSemites so much slack??

http://www.nkusa.org/activities/Demonstrations/2014/20140705London/new/IMG-20140706-WA0010-N.jpg
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sun 3 Aug, 2014 01:06 am



Israel bans radio advert listing names of children killed in Gaza
Human rights group B'Tselem will petition Israel's supreme court after advert was deemed to be 'politically controversial'

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Harriet Sherwood in Jerusalem
theguardian.com, Thursday 24 July 2014 03.24 EDT

A Palestinian rescue convoy navigates rubble in Gaza City
Aid agencies said on Wednesday that a child had been killed in Gaza on average every hour for the preceding two days. Photograph: Khalil Hamra/AP

The Israeli Broadcasting Authority has banned a radio advertisement from a human rights organisation which listed the names of some of the scores of children killed in Gaza since the conflict began 17 days ago.

B'Tselem's appeal against the decision was rejected on Wednesday. It intends to petition Israel's supreme court on Sunday in an effort to get the ban overturned.

The IBA said the ad's content was "politically controversial". The broadcast refers to child deaths in Gaza and reads out some of the victims' names.

In its appeal, B'Tselem demanded to know what was controversial about the item. "Is it controversial that the children [aren't] alive? That they're children? That those are their names? These are facts that we wish to bring to the public's knowledge."

In a statement, the human rights group said: "So far more than 600 people have been killed in bombings in Gaza, more than 150 of them children. But apart from a brief report on the number of fatalities, the Israeli media refrains from covering them." By Thursday morning, the death toll in Gaza had exceeded 700.

B'Tselem went on: "IBA says broadcasting the children's names is politically controversial. But refusing to do so is in itself a far-reaching statement – it says the huge price being paid by civilians in Gaza, many of them children, must be censored."

Aid agencies said on Wednesday that a child had been killed in Gaza on average every hour for the preceding two days, and more than 70,000 children had been forced to flee their homes. There has also been a spike in the number of premature births.

"The shocking number of children being killed, injured, or displaced in Gaza demands an unequivocal international response to stop the bloodshed," Save the Children said. "Entire families are being wiped out in seconds as a result of the targeting of homes."

Dr Yousif al Swaiti, director of al-Awda hospital, said: "We have witnessed many premature births as a result of the fear and psychological disorders caused by the military offensive. The number of cases of premature births per day has doubled, compared to the average daily rate before the escalation."
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sun 3 Aug, 2014 01:50 am
0 Replies
 
 

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