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Need encouragement and advice...

 
 
Heeven
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 May, 2004 10:52 am
Well I don't recommend calling her the B-word, she might not appreciate it and even get madder at you. One thing to think about, I've often wondered how we would feel if someone were to "play-back" our behavior to us. I would have been utterly mortified if I had been caught on video behaving this way. It's one thing to act like a demon, it is quite another to watch yourself acting like that and rethinking how immature and stupid you are.
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samantha n angie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 May, 2004 12:15 pm
You go H.V. Very Happy
I have a very good girlfriend who has an opinion on everything, no holds barred, direct and to the point. Mostly, your just quiet around her especially if she gets all up and in your face about something. We all chose to see only the good in her (she is a good person) which was enabling in a way. I finally had to say, "Hey CHILL!!" That mellowed her a bit.

T.H. try not to enable her behavior. Perhaps you can say, "CHILL OUT BABE, I AM NOT YOUR ENEMY - I LOVE YOU!!!" This will probably get her completely silent. Maybe be the wake up call H.V. was referring to. Just a random thought T.H., hope it leads you closer to a perfect solution. Rolling Eyes
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Eva
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 May, 2004 01:53 pm
The girl needs to get a grip.

The first time I tried that on my now-hubby, he quietly got up and walked out the door. I was furious...I had no one to scream at. When he returned, I asked him why he did that, and he said he was there to love me, not to be my punching bag, and I'd have to find another target. Really took the wind out of my sails.

I tried it one more time, and as he headed for the door, I asked him where he was going. He said, "I'm gettin' the hell outta Dodge!" I worried the whole time he was gone that he wouldn't come back.

He taught me to be kind to the people I love. It's one of the best lessons I ever learned.
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thehusband
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 06:51 am
I def think those are good ideas. But now im just beginning to withdraw. Like all yesterday evening I just kind of stayed to myself. For multiple reasons, first of all I dont want to piss her off, and secondly, because I am just getting worn down. I am getting weary in always holding her up and having to worry about her and what she is going through, while I have to deal with my problems and emotions on my own. We havnt made love in ten days... Am I just off to think thats weird for a couple that have been married just a year and a half, with no kids and nothing major taking each others time? So now I am just staying distant cause I am tired of always being the giver.

I dont know... I am probably being selfish and now I am just rambling, but I just gotta get some of this out...
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 07:25 am
Well, withdrawing may make things worse. She might launch into you about being uncommuniticave or something. I think the 'untrain' her idea is a good one. You would not be selfish in being firm about how much her behaviour is affecting you. You have to be firm though, no wishy-washy 'talking about it', but a real 'laying it on the line' approach. Don't get me wrong here either, I would never condone anything like yelling, swearing or worse. Just say "this can't go on, and this is why, and for the sanity of both of us, you have to listen." Or, something like that.
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 09:25 am
Also, I think you can benefit by separating out what is OK from what isn't. Like, if she's had a hard day and wants to talk about it, that's fine -- as long as she doesn't direct her aggression at you. Like, she can complain about her boss, but she can't snap at you for pulling out into traffic too quickly because she's stressed out about her boss.

I think if you make it too all-or-nothing -- no complaining, all nicey-nicey all the time -- you'll set yourselves up for failure. It's too radical of a change, and she'll feel shut down.

Now, once you get past that -- she's not allowed to be mean to you just because she's stressed -- maybe she or both of you can start working on why she seems to never really be happy.

Are you guys from the same cultural background?
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Joeblow
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 09:25 am
I do wish you'd consider the possibility that there are some simple steps your wife might take that would put you both out of "her" misery. A frank discussion about her chartable episodes would put the onus on her to deal with her unacceptable blow-ups. This doesn't mean you are unsupportive.

Getting moody yourself and withdrawing out of pique isn't an answer, it's just another brick in the wall. Walking on eggshells to avoid her anger also isn't helpful, as I'm sure you well know. A straightforward discussion is required.
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katya8
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 12:58 pm
I used to know a guy.......we weren't married.....he worked the night shift as an editor for the New York Times.....he used to come see me around midnight, sit down on the side of my bed, and rant non-stop about everyone he worked with and saw outside of work.

99% of those rants was him getting his rage out. After about an hour of doing so, he'd be ready to smile and hug and etc.

But guess what?

All that poisonous rage that he'd gotten rid of, was now inside of me, and so I'd feel like hell, and it turned my own life gray and ugly, like his.

I hung in for a long while, because I really liked him, and looking back now (ten years later) I know was so flocking used to being abused by people, that I didn't even realize I didn't have to let them subject me to their garbage.

So now.......smile, smile, whenever someone starts to mess with me or lay their rage on me......they're out of my life in 5 minutes......maybe 10......sometimes even 24 hours, if I'm feeling generous........but of one thing I'm certain now: you cannot ever change another person by fighting with them or by having long talks about what they're doing wrong.

If someone is what I call a "Terrorist of the Heart" they'll continue to oppress you or rage at you, unless you non-verbally train them to understand that you simply will not tolerate being abused like that.



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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:00 pm
"Terrorist of the heart" is a good term. I have always referred to those sorts of people as "toxic friends."
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katya8
 
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Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:11 pm
Is "Toxic Terrorist" overkill?

I use "terrorist", Carfancier, because I'm writing about them.
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doglover
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:16 pm
katya8 wrote:



You need to untrain your lady.

Your silent but immediate exits will let her know that a husband should be loved and honored, instead of being made the constant recipient of his wife's rage at the world.

It's amazing, really, how many individuals have the mistaken notion that being married means one can abuse one's partner with impunity, when this is exactly the one person in their life, who ought NEVER to be abused.



katya8's points are right on target Husband.

We teach people how to treat us. What is acceptable behavior and what isn't....what we will tolerate and what we won't. Being firm with your wife and setting bounderies for yourself is a loving thing to do. Don't withdraw from her...lay it on the line. You deserve to be treated with respect by everyone you know, including her. Being married doesn't exclude one from rude, aggressive behavior toward their spouse.
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:17 pm
Hmm...I don't think personal links are allowed here katya8, but your original term, 'terrorist of the heart' is better than 'toxic terrorist.'
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thehusband
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:25 pm
Ok we are getting a little off what my wife is. She isnt a 'terrorist at heart' by any means. We did grow up in the same type cultures, however the major difference that is playing out here is that in my house there was never any yelling allowed. My dad would never let us yell at each other in anger. Well, my wife's mom is a screamer when she gets mad, and her dad always retreated to the basement. So I think she is doing this because of what she grew up around. So I think the "untrain" her approach is really good. I will start keeping that in mind and working on it. I appreciate all this advice!
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cavfancier
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:29 pm
thehusband wrote:
Ok we are getting a little off what my wife is. She isnt a 'terrorist at heart' by any means. We did grow up in the same type cultures, however the major difference that is playing out here is that in my house there was never any yelling allowed. My dad would never let us yell at each other in anger. Well, my wife's mom is a screamer when she gets mad, and her dad always retreated to the basement. So I think she is doing this because of what she grew up around. So I think the "untrain" her approach is really good. I will start keeping that in mind and working on it. I appreciate all this advice!


This clarifies things a lot. In my family, we talked, never yelled. Yelling among the family made my grandfather physically ill. My wife is West Indian. What I see as yelling, she sees as regular communication. I think that you are on the right road here with the 'untraining'. My wife and I finally met somewhere in the middle, and it's been happy ever since.
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:34 pm
Interesting about different family backgrounds, thehusband. That would make sense.

I'm deaf, and one thing about Deaf Culture is that usually the deaf person has hearing parents, and so the deaf person doesn't always get the cultural traditions of his family. I'm also (half) Jewish, and had a deaf friend who looked very Jewish. (This is going somewhere, bear with me...) One day he said to me, "you're a nice lady, but do EVER stop complaining??" I was brought up short... Me? A complainer? Huh?

What eventually came out is that he looked so Jewish that I was relating to him in a certain way (unconsciously) -- lots of kvetching, hopefully humorous, and sympathetically listening to the conversation partner's kvetching, but lots of kvetching, yeah. He looked Jewish but wasn't actually culturally Jewish, and wasn't raised in that culture, and so he found it oppressive. I had to adjust.

So, even aside from cultures, I could see that your wife has been raised in a family culture to let it all out, be uninhibited, however they may phrase it in her family. I think you might want to stay away from value judgements and just explain that it is difficult for YOU, and why it's difficult for you, and what you would prefer and why.

As Joeblow said as well, just have a straightforward conversation and come up with some solutions.
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:37 pm
Again, Cav and I are on the same page. (Didn't see what he said, but he saw where I was going...)
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Eva
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 01:55 pm
Seems like we're all on the same page here. I come from an Irish family...lots of yelling, get-everything-out-on-the-table types. My husband comes from a very passive family that ignores the elephants in the living room. We had to work out a happy medium, too.

Soz, I had forgotten to say something you touched on...it's okay to vent (a little) as long as the anger is directed toward the target that caused it. But it's not okay to direct that anger toward an innocent bystander (thehusband). So now we say, "My boss is a JERK! I can't believe how f*cking idiotic he is! Wait 'til I tell you what that s.o.b. did today....." Then the partner responds with sympathy (not "helpful advice" unless it is expressly requested.)

It's important that you share your feelings, just not in a way that hurts the other person.

Whoever said marriage is easy, anyway? This is just one of those things you have to work at.
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Heeven
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 02:09 pm
Yowza, I come from a family where my mother constantly berated my father and us kids ... I knew when my bf pointed out my behavior exactly where I got it from. It became a habit - an automatic attitude that I still have to watch out for, but I am very aware of it. Caught myself snapping at someone because I was stressed with an overload at work - it just happened to be the giver of all this work and he got a wee bit of a fright. Guess I got the right person but gotta control that attitude, coz I realize that not only does it not solve the problem, it makes me miserable even being around myself!

Hey, whoda known? I'm not perfect, imagine that! Workin' on it .....
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2004 06:38 pm
Katya, on posting one's website -

as I understand the matter, it is extremely heavily frowned on within a post, by itself, and a call to action, that is, to ask people to look at it, is even worse re being a violation of the terms of service, the tos which we all read, say we agree, when we sign up. See below on this page, it is called terms of use.

However, you can put your favorite website and it might be your own, on your profile. At least I think that is still ok.
It is not good to call attention to it, though, that is another "call to action". The reason this is such a big deal is that the site gets a cajillion spammers and the people who try hard to have the site not be inundated/breached by them basically don't have time to figure who is friend and who is doing promotion.

If we all looked at profiles more often - oh, many don't fill them in at all - and even got into updating them... it would add another layer of interest to a2k.
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babeez1
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 May, 2004 12:05 pm
OK I have some advise for Husband. Don't walk out of the room...this is a separation technique and will just make you two more separated. She is having more problems than just work. She obviously doesn't know how to deal with anger and frustration. If she is in this mood for the majority of the month I say she may have to talk to a therapist. The longer this tension goes on between you the more separation you will have. You have to have happy times and communication together to keep nurturing your relationship. Although the career may be a perfect fit for her, you may be as well and she is sacrificing the close bond you have. It seems like you are there for her, but she needs to see and appreciate that. Have you considered buying any books? There is a good one called the truth about love, by Dr. Love. It is great....it talks about the stages and what is necessary in a relationship to keep it going. Relationships are hard work, so don't shut down now when with a little work and understanding you can be going through this together instead of apart. By the way, sex once a week is more than some that have been together for 5 years.....especially if someone is having issues and causing issues in the relationship. Hold on to her, love her, and support her...but at the same time make her understand that bonds between you need to grow and all of the animosity is just making them weaker.
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