15
   

Age Discrimination???

 
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2014 09:56 pm
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:

But not at a university and not re research?

It's hard for me to see a university ignoring her creds, unless maybe her cred studies were at some odd school.

But her fellow graduates in their 20s all found jobs in the first few months except for one. If it were an odd school, wouldn't they be equally affected? By the way, it was the local community college.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2014 09:57 pm
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:

Brandon. What to say - if we have talked before, it's been not all good, politics or whatever.

I am extremely interested in how this goes. I want to see her doing well.



Thanks, Osso. I'll post updates.
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2014 10:01 pm
@CalamityJane,
CalamityJane wrote:

It has to be her resume if she doesn't get even a foot in the door. You cannot model her resume after your own, Brandon. You are in a completely different profession. She needs to model her resume according to the medical community. Maybe if her name suggests that she's a foreigner, just use a middle name then and your married name. If she writes under skills that she speaks several languages and one of it is her native tongue, that could be a red flag too.

I don't know where you live, but I'd think in certain areas they're not accustomed to foreigners. Also, try to omit years - like jespah had suggested, this way they cannot pinpoint her age. No one needs to state their age, but when they graduated high school in 1960, it's obvious that
they're not in their 20s.

Get as much written recommendations as possible from previous employers/internships/professionals, that helps too.

Rewriting her resume is the easiest part you can do, yet you keep saying that she has a good one. Obviously is not good enough if she doesn't get an interview.

Try several variations and see what it brings. On the other hand, your wife has already applied to every hospital in your area, I don't think that it would be wise to re-apply with a different resume. Can't she go into private industry? Does it have to be a hospital?

I'm not going to do a very good job of addressing this very kind post, because I have to run off to bed, but if it is her resume, is it also the resume for the rest of the grads over 40 who mostly also can't get a nibble? Only one or two in that age group were hired. She does have three very good references, but no one will look at them. Most of the places she has applied haven't answered at all. The few that have replied have sent very impersonal form rejections. By the way, we live in Tampa, FL.
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Mon 21 Apr, 2014 10:02 pm
What if you or she could see a resume of some of her former classmates to see what theirs looked like?

Is she still in contact with any of them?
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 04:34 am
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:

what does her school do to prepare students for job-searching? do they have campus recruiting events? what support does the school offer grads who are looking for work?

32 years after graduating from one university and some mysterious number of years after completing a few programs at another (somewhere in the 20 - 25 year range), I still get emails letting me know about programs offered to grads who are job-hunting.

To the best of my knowledge there have been no such programs, at least not that I have ever heard mentioned. Remember that there is a small, fixed (maybe 15?) number of employers for med techs within a reasonable distance. There are not even recruiters for these specialties. I even checked that one with a recruiter who had found me a job around the time she graduated.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 04:37 am
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:

What if you or she could see a resume of some of her former classmates to see what theirs looked like?

Is she still in contact with any of them?

Yes she is, although a bit more with the older ones (who are in her situation too), but I have a hard time believe that all of the people too young to have worked before had good resumes and virtually none of the older people did. The younger ones were all snapped up, even ones with very mediocre records, and virtually all of the older ones are being ignored. One female graduate slightly older than my wife has applied in other states and has still never received a single interview.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 04:45 am
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:

Brandon9000 wrote:

It doesn't have to be the CV. It may be simple age discrimination.


if your wife isn't even getting an interview, how do recruiters/employers know she isn't in her 20's?

if they are figuring it out by way of her resume (c.v.'s are usually only for academics and teachers), then, yes, it is the resume and her age - though 40 seems very early for that to kick in

she definitely does not want a one-size-does-not-fit-all resume. She needs to prepare it sniper-style to suit each ad. Another factor is that by the time there is an actual ad, it can be too late to apply. A good resume with a superbly tailored cover letter can get her some attention from h.r. when postings are sent to them by hiring departments.

has she done any informational interviewing? where she contacts potential employers to find out where their new employees come from.

my current employer hires virtually nobody straight out. everyone (below executive level) comes in on a 6 - 12 month contract to begin with. People applying for apparent job openings will be sorely disappointed as they aren't going to be considered for a permanent role to begin with. if things are sticky, you've got to find out what the industry-specific tricks are.

I suppose that it would be possible to send out resumes proactively. As for targeting the resumes to each employer, it might be slightly possible, but remember that these are not employers in different lines of work. These potential employers are all hospitals in precisely the same line of work as each other.

She has gone to places she rotated through as a student to say hi to the people and sometimes bring them cookies, but we haven't heard of "informational interviewing." Even on a couple of occasions when an old teacher has said, "Send a resume to this manager. I will let him know that you're good," none of them has responded.
Germlat
 
  2  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 05:10 am
@Brandon9000,
Due to the economy, many medical professionals returned to work ( after raising kids, etc). There is also the factor of infusion of young professionals. Maybe the field is saturated at the moment. If also depends on the size of the community where you reside. If it is not a large community, but has numerous schools churning out graduates in greater proportion than needed, then it'll be more difficult to find work. You may want to wait, relocate, or consider non-traditional work. For instance, medical sales , pharmaceutical sales....case management for medical insurance companies...don't get discouraged. Best wishes!
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 05:17 am
@Germlat,
Germlat wrote:

Due to the economy, many medical professionals returned to work ( after raising kids, etc). There is also the factor of infusion of young professionals. Maybe the field is saturated at the moment. If also depends on the size of the community where you reside. If it is not a large community, but has numerous schools churning out graduates in greater proportion than needed, then it'll be more difficult to find work. You may want to wait, relocate, or consider non-traditional work. For instance, medical sales , pharmaceutical sales....case management for medical insurance companies...don't get discouraged. Best wishes!

The market is saturated. A few years ago, an additional local college added a program in her specialty.

As I've said, we live in Tampa, FL. We cannot relocate, because I am not about to quit a good job. As for taking other lines of work, it is possible, although it might contribute to keeping her out of her actual new profession longer, and the longer she doesn't find a job in her profession, the more employers in her profession will judge her negatively just for not finding work. When we got married, I told her that she didn't ever have to work if she didn't want to, but she chose to take a job at a department store. Later, she moved to a better department store. She quit when she entered college in order to be able to concentrate. So, yes, she could get job in an unrelated field. My rant here in this thread, though, is that a student with virtually the highest possible grades and excellent references is ignored, while other graduates, with worse records sail into jobs with no problem.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 05:18 am
One more note - in fact I never said that my wife is 40, I said just over 40.
0 Replies
 
Germlat
 
  2  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 05:53 am
@Brandon9000,
Age discrimination has always existed. We relocated to the state where we currently reside due to the economy. My husband was afraid the company he worked for would eliminate his position. My earnings at the time were the highest in my career. But, still my husband's earnings would always be higher.. I took a huge pay cut, earning half of my previous wage. My husbands earnings, however increased with the move. So in a way it balanced out. I never wanted to live here and feel stuck. ( this place is incredibly poorly suited to my needs). We have made a decision to move by next year. We are getting older, and my husband fears he will have more difficulty getting hired due to his age. It sucks to know age does limit you.
0 Replies
 
jespah
 
  2  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:15 am
Try looking on Indeed for jobs.

Try informational interviewing.

Is she on LinkedIn? You both should be.
https://www.linkedin.com/nhome/
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:27 am
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
but if it is her resume, is it also the resume for the rest of the grads over 40 who mostly also can't get a nibble?


that suggests it does have something to do with either the format or content of the resumes of the over-40 group

resume styles change in the same way clothing styles do - longer/shorter/plainer/more elaborate - a resume based on one first created in the 1990's is going to look different from one first developed in the 2010's

has your wife kept the ads she applied to? have her go through the ads and note all the words used. then have her go through her resumes and covering letters and see how often the words used in the ads are used. it is really important to have a tight match between ad words/phrases and resume/covering letter words and phrases. Some companies do an initial screening based on that alone.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:27 am
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:

What if you or she could see a resume of some of her former classmates to see what theirs looked like?


great idea
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:30 am
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
To the best of my knowledge there have been no such programs, at least not that I have ever heard mentioned.


have your wife head to the school to talk to someone in the student counselling/placement area. she needs to stay connected to the school so they know she's available in case someone contacts them looking for a recent grad due to an off-grad season opening
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:31 am
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
I have a hard time believe that all of the people too young to have worked before had good resumes


does she have copies of the younger students' resumes?
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:34 am
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
I suppose that it would be possible to send out resumes proactively.
possible? think required

Brandon9000 wrote:
As for targeting the resumes to each employer, it might be slightly possible, but remember that these are not employers in different lines of work.
does every ad use the exact same wording?


Brandon9000 wrote:
These potential employers are all hospitals in precisely the same line of work as each other.
do they share an h.r. department?


Brandon9000 wrote:
She has gone to places she rotated through as a student to say hi to the people and sometimes bring them cookies, but we haven't heard of "informational interviewing."
sounds like more research about the process of finding work in North America in the 2010's is in order (informational interviewing has been taught in schools/universities since the 1980's)
0 Replies
 
Miller
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 06:52 am
@Brandon9000,
There are many reasons why some individuals are hired and many others aren't. First of all where in the US are you located? This could play a major role in the hiring process.

I'm in the Boston area and as you may well know there are many hospitals, both in Boston and in the surrounding areas. Most of the hospitals ( if not all) don't advertise in newspapers in the help-wanted ads.
They frequently advertise on bulletin boards in the hospital/health care clinics.

Today, the way to a job ( at least in the health field ) is through "networking". If you know someone with a job, they often can help you find a way into a similar job. But not always.

Research techs in basic research in the Boston area, appear to be filled almost strictly by Asians ( many of them Asian Americans). This could be due to the process of "networking". Another trend in the medical fields is to hire those who know at least 2 different languages. Again, "networking" seems to play a major role.

Your wife at age 40 doesn't appear old. But in many professional fields, as for example, Pharmacy ( retail) the jobs will go to the recent graduates because of age and also because of physical endurance.

Appearance also plays a role. Overweight folks seem to have a harder time finding jobs in the health field. Is this a discrimination issue?

For sure, there is discrimination in the job market. However, if your wife can contact a few friends who have jobs, then they may be able to guide her through the "job door".

Good luck!
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Apr, 2014 07:02 am
@Brandon9000,
Brandon9000 wrote:
My rant here in this thread, though, is that a student with virtually the highest possible grades and excellent references is ignored, while other graduates, with worse records sail into jobs with no problem.


well then, enjoy the rant and good luck to your wife
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Apr, 2014 11:46 pm
@Brandon9000,
Is this the Brandon I know and respect or some imposter?

That your wife is from a foreign country is immaterial as proven by the number of foreign nationals and first generation immigrant Americans in the healthcare industry.

As for age, how much older than 40 is she?

Over 40 is a (ridiculously) protected federal class, but unless your wife is 41 and has limited her applications to "We Only Like Young People" health organizations, it's tough to see age discrimination.

My guess is that of the three possibilities you've offered for your wife's unfortunate situation, the first is the most likely

Banal, incompetent, and Orwellian bureaucracy, by far, is a greater peril than age discrimination relative to someone younger than 45.

But if you and she think she has a case for age discrimination, press it.


0 Replies
 
 

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