Where are the Conservative voices?

@Brandon9000,

Brandon9000 wrote:

They should be judged based on the content of their character as demonstrated by their words and deeds,

Yes. For instance, I'm judging them based on the deafening silence I hear from them instead of the expected condemnation of those who slaughter innocents in the name of Islam.

I also notice a large number of them smirking at the slaughter of those innocents. But as has been pointed out previously, just because some smirk, that does not mean all do.

So I'll just judge them based on their refusal to condemn those who slaughter innocents in their name.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

, I'm judging them based on the deafening silence I hear from them instead of the expected condemnation of those who slaughter innocents in the name of Islam.

or for their silence on the backwardness of Islam. Westerners constantly give Rome **** for how they treat gays and women, how do the followers of Islam get a pass for not meeting our standards of morality and civility? I think the answer is a pro muslim bias in the West. Some on the left bitch about how muslims get treated by us, but the truth is they get treated much better than they deserve.

3 Replies

@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

I think the answer is a pro muslim bias in the West.

I think it's that a certain type of Liberal delights in the slaughter of innocent Americans.

I previously mentioned that at least some moderate Muslims have a happy little smirk when innocents are slaughtered by other Muslims. I see the same happy little smirk on a lot of Liberals when innocent Americans are massacred.

I would not be at all surprised if every single Liberal who has posted in this thread was absolutely delighted at the 9/11 attacks.

But as mentioned before, I'm only condemning a certain strain of Liberal (the sort of Liberals who have been posting in this thread). There are some Liberals who do not deserve to be lumped in with these people.

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@hawkeye10,

Quote:

or for their silence on the backwardness of Islam. Westerners constantly give Rome **** for how they treat gays and women, how do the followers of Islam get a pass for not meeting our standards of morality and civility? I think the answer is a pro muslim bias in the West. Some on the left bitch about how muslims get treated by us, but the truth is they get treated much better than they deserve.

And in Dearborn
http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/local-couple-taunted-over-flags-hanging-outside-home/-/1719418/23229024/-/ru9l1r/-/index.html

Quote:

Dearborn: Couple terrorized for Israeli flag on home, felt safer in Lebanon

And Muslims have taken to Twitter to incite others to target the "jew flag." (Tweets thanks to Blazing Cat Fur.)

And turning Dearborn into a bigger shithole than it is , is how they show their gratitude.

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@hawkeye10,

Quote:

, I'm judging them based on the deafening silence I hear from them instead of the expected condemnation of those who slaughter innocents in the name of Islam.

hawkeye10 wrote:

or for their silence on the backwardness of Islam. Westerners constantly give Rome **** for how they treat gays and women, how do the followers of Islam get a pass for not meeting our standards of morality and civility? I think the answer is a pro muslim bias in the West. Some on the left bitch about how muslims get treated by us, but the truth is they get treated much better than they deserve.

For what thay did to us in NY and Washington on 9/11/1,
thay were lucky that we did not nuke Mecca on 9/12/1.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

thay were lucky that we did not nuke Mecca on 9/12/1.

You could probably get a couple of US bases at the same time if you use a big enough nuke.

What do you think the consequences of nuking an ally would have been? How much more do you think petrol would cost? How much more powerful would Iran be with their biggest rivals taken out?

2 Replies

@izzythepush,

Quote:

What do you think the consequences of nuking an ally would have been? How much more do you think petrol would cost? How much more powerful would Iran be with their biggest rivals taken out?

somewhere last week i was reading an assessment that the Saudis are our best Ally in the region, far more important than Israel. I am not sold, but I do note that this was the bush the seconds view.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

They're one of the biggest suppliers of oil to the West, one of the biggest buyers of western munitions, and were used as a base to launch the 1st Gulf War.

The fact that it's governed by an extreme Wahabbist form of Islam that does not allow women to drive doesn't seem to bother Bush, Blair, Obama, Cameron et al.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

The fact that it's governed by an extreme Wahabbist form of Islam that does not allow women to drive doesn't seem to bother Bush, Blair, Obama, Cameron et al.

the argument was that bin laden came after them first, and that they have been a force of moderation. problem is that I have long heard that they paid off bin laden and their part of wrecking Syria does not look like a responsible act.

I am willing to listen to arguments on the value of the Saudi's to US interests, but I am leaning against. these people seem irresponsible, valueless, like all they know how to do is to buy stuff they want. the oil money will run out, and what will remain?

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

They make a good living out of pilgrims going to Mecca. They've not just invested their money in arms. They have substantial property portfolios in London, New York and elsewhere.

One major problem is that Wahhabism is being exported to countries with a far more moderate interpretation of Islam.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

They're one of the biggest suppliers of oil to the West, one of the biggest buyers of western munitions, and were used as a base to launch the 1st Gulf War.

The fact that it's governed by an extreme Wahabbist form of Islam that does not allow women to drive doesn't seem to bother Bush, Blair, Obama, Cameron et al.

Maybe it does/did bother them, but when you're actually in a position of responsibility, you have to weigh all of the factors. By the way, most of the 9/11 conspirators were Saudi nationals.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

Or Egyptians, no Iraqis or Iranians.

2 Replies

@izzythepush,

Three Egyptians, on Lebanese, and the rest Saudis.

0 Replies

@izzythepush,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

thay were lucky that we did not nuke Mecca on 9/12/1.

izzythepush wrote:

You could probably get a couple of US bases at the same time
if you use a big enough nuke.

Not an ideal American goal, there, Izzy.
A small fission bom, as distinct from a fusion bom 'd be a better choice.

izzythepush wrote:

What do you think the consequences of nuking an ally would have been?

Well, to begin with,
the Moslems might have 2nd thawts
about blowing up or burning down our edifices.

izzythepush wrote:

How much more do you think petrol would cost?

I dunno, but America has its own petroleum reserves, Izzy.
Does England have petroleum among its natural resources ?

izzythepush wrote:

How much more powerful would Iran be with their biggest rivals taken out?

I wonder how much more co-operative thay 'd be
when thay saw that we broke out the nukes ?

If I had been the President on 9/11/1, I 'd not necessarily
have used a few of them on 9/12/1, but I might have tangentially brought it up in conversation,
along with alluding to the wisdom of lining the flight decks and steering wheels of planes in pig leather.

In America for the last year or 2, there has been much use of
a frase: "just saying" which I have been led to believe means
that the speaker is just saying something, without actually
attesting to its truth. (I have little confidence in the accuracy
of my understanding this concept.) I was just mentioning
the possibility of American vengeance of that nature; it wud be dramatic. Don 't u think??

Get the Moslems' attention (the surviving ones) ?

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Well, to begin with,
the Moslems might have 2nd thawts
about blowing up or burning down our edifices.

Instead of dealing with a handful of religious fanatics you'd make yourself the enemy of the whole Moslem world. US bases in Bahrain and Saudi Arabia wouldn't last long because every Moslem would see it as their sworn duty to kill Americans.

China and Russia would put their missiles on standby, and Europe would excuse themselves from any further confrontation.

A war with all of Islam is one you can't win.

2 Replies

@izzythepush,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Well, to begin with,
the Moslems might have 2nd thawts
about blowing up or burning down our edifices.

izzythepush wrote:

Instead of dealing with a handful of religious fanatics
you'd make yourself the enemy of the whole Moslem world.

I 'm pretty sure that the Moslems already consider
themselves to be our enemies, no matter what.
Note the dancing in the streets by the citizens of Kuwait,
whom we had just rescued (for free) from Saddam.
Thay bear us ill will now. Denial is naive.

Between the French and the Moslems of Kuwait,
we shud have LEARNED something about *gratitude*.

izzythepush wrote:

US bases in Bahrain and Saudi Arabia wouldn't last long because every Moslem
would see it as their sworn duty to kill Americans.

Well, the Third World War is over now; we won.
We don't need those bases as much as we did
while the 3rd World War was still in progress.

Was 9/11/1 the first day of the 4th World War??

izzythepush wrote:

China and Russia would put their missiles on standby,
and Europe would excuse themselves from any further confrontation.

It might be the better part of discretion
to touch base with Putin beforehand.

izzythepush wrote:

A war with all of Islam is one you can't win.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Actually Kuwait is one of the few Arab counties that doesn't.

Most ill will is due to the attack on Iraq, which was done in such a cack-handed manner that it made things ten times worse.

After 9/11 there was a lot of good will towards America. Arafat made a point of donating blood, and urged others to do the same.

Quote:

Was 9/11/1 the first day of the 4th World War??

No it was a criminal act by a small group of terrorists.

If you look at what's going on in the Me right now, you'll see it's dominated by sectarianism, particularly the Sunni/Shia divide.

Al Qaida wanted to turn this into an Islam v the West confrontation. We shouldn't be giving them what they want.

2 Replies

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

Al Qaida wanted to turn this into an Islam v the West confrontation.
We shouldn't be giving them what they want.

We avenged ourselves; to a very limited extent.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

We didn't avenge ourselves against those (revenge?) against those who carried out the 9/11 attacks, like izzythepush said, we only turned a lot of good will against us by attacking a country who had nothing whatsoever to do with 9/11. Blaming all Arabs/Muslims nations or regions or person(s) for acts they had nothing to do with is part of the problem in which this thread started.

It's like if a red headed man attacked me, afterwards I just decide any red headed men will do and attack them. By this I put the blame and retribution on all or any red headed males.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

We avenged ourselves; to a very limited extent.

Vengeance is a very poor substitute for justice. As Rev has pointed out we killed a lot of innocent men and women who had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. We made matters worse.

Btw, 9/11 would not have happened if America had had similar airport security measures to those in Europe.

3 Replies

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