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There's now a five-time winner in the men's competition

 
 
WBYeats
 
Reply Sat 18 May, 2013 06:31 pm
From news report: There's now a five-time winner in the men's competition

In English grammar, determiners can be divided into three types: pre-; central; and -post. Since teachers here know this, I'm not going to explain them.

In English, people do not say 'He has stolen THE MY BAG' and THE should be deleted. But is it idiomatic to say the red sentence? I think it's OK, because in this case MEN'S has become a simple adjective modifying COMPETITION, and THE is used to specify COMPETITION, but I'm not sure; could you help me?
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Type: Discussion • Score: 3 • Views: 1,357 • Replies: 24

 
dlowan
 
  3  
Reply Sat 18 May, 2013 11:18 pm
@WBYeats,
Yes, the red sentence is ok.

Except I wonder if it ought to be five times. Very possibly it ought.
contrex
 
  2  
Reply Sun 19 May, 2013 01:12 am
@dlowan,
dlowan wrote:
I wonder if it ought to be five times. Very possibly it ought.

Expressions of this type use the singular of whatever is being counted.

A five-time winner
A two-time loser
A five-dollar cigar
A fifty-dollar watch
A million-dollar prize
A sixty-mile journey
A two-hundred-foot drop
WBYeats
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 May, 2013 02:42 am
@contrex,
Thank you~

For

In my schoolboy's mind this disparity would refract into an invitation to lie.

Is it better to change SCHOOLBOY'S to SCHOOLBOYS'?
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 May, 2013 02:49 am
@WBYeats,
WBYeats wrote:
In my schoolboy's mind this disparity would refract into an invitation to lie. Is it better to change SCHOOLBOY'S to SCHOOLBOYS'?


No. The speaker states that he possesses the mind of a schoolboy (singular).
WBYeats
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 May, 2013 11:15 pm
@contrex,
Oh...

Thank you~
0 Replies
 
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Tue 28 May, 2013 11:02 am
@contrex,
contrex wrote:
The speaker states that he possesses the mind of a schoolboy (singular).


Or possibly he is describing an event that took place when he was a schoolboy, and therefore had the mind of one. You neglected to provide any context.

0 Replies
 
WBYeats
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 May, 2013 10:14 pm
Is it natural and idiomatic to say?:

There's now a five-time winner in men's competition.
0 Replies
 
WBYeats
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jul, 2013 08:05 pm
@contrex,
Nowadays do native speakers say this?:

-We made a five hours' journey in great heat from Kyoto to Yokohama.

Must HOURS' be changed to HOUR?
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jul, 2013 10:28 pm
@WBYeats,
It would sound more modern.

The apostrophe part might give the apostrophe freaks a **** hemorrhage. I'll leave that to them.

Oops, no 's', problem solved.
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Jul, 2013 12:47 am
@JTT,
JTT wrote:
The apostrophe part might give the apostrophe freaks a **** hemorrhage.


Not this one; a possessive apostrophe in a temporal expression is perfectly acceptable, but often omitted. It goes before the s for single units of time and after for multiple units of time. Some sources advise against the apostrophe after multiple units.

one year's insurance, a week's holiday, a day's work, an hour's delay, a minute's warning

three years' insurance, a five hours' journey, twenty minutes' delay, ten years' wait, two months' salary, six months' interest-free credit


0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Jul, 2013 02:05 pm
@contrex,

Quote:
A five-time winner
A two-time loser
A five-dollar cigar
A fifty-dollar watch


I'd say the first two are American idiom (journalese?). In Britain you probably wouldn't see them written that way; I don't know why exactly.
The other two seem more natural in AmE or real English. Wink
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Jul, 2013 02:17 pm
@McTag,
McTag wrote:

The other two seem more natural in AmE or real English. Wink


I forgot about a five-pound note, or a "fi'-pun' note" as Dickens had someone say. Or a two-shilling piece from my youth. Or Two-Ton Tessie O'Shea likewise.

0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Jul, 2013 03:03 pm
@McTag,
Google exact phrase - UK only region
"a five-time winner"
About 238,000 results

"a two-time loser"
About 33,000 results

WBYeats
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Jul, 2013 09:10 pm
@JTT,
Try to google 'furnitures' and see what we'll get. I don't know why my laptop can't show the number of results.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jul, 2013 01:08 am
@WBYeats,

"Furniture" is already a plural, so "furnitures" is a bit awkward. But not impossible.
contrex
 
  2  
Reply Sun 14 Jul, 2013 02:08 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:


"Furniture" is already a plural, so "furnitures" is a bit awkward. But not impossible.


In modern English furniture is an uncountable noun like (for example) advice, accommodation, baggage, bread, cheese, equipment, furniture, information, knowledge, money, pasta, work, progress, research, travel.

We say furniture is expensive or ugly or wooden or absent. Before the end of the nineteenth century, the plural furnitures existed in Standard English in both the U.S. and the U.K.; during the twentieth century, however, it ceased to be used by native speakers. A single item of furniture, such as a chair or a table, is often called a piece of furniture.

A quick Google search for "furnitures" showed me results mostly from non-native speaker sources,e.g. shops in Kenya, Korea, the Phillipines, the Netherlands, India, etc.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jul, 2013 02:24 am
@contrex,

Tam o' Shanter, imperfectly remembered

"...it gars me greet
Tae think how many counsels sweet
How many xxx , sage advices
The husband from the wife despises
"

Okay uncountable noun then. Bacon.
0 Replies
 
WBYeats
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jul, 2013 10:37 am
@contrex,
I'd also like to have google as a convenient tool to learn English, but very often it proves unreliable.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jul, 2013 01:07 pm
@WBYeats,

Fashion is an uncountable noun, but often seen in the plural.
 

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