What would the World be like if JESUS had never been Born?

Steve, That's the one! Thank you. The link is very good, and people planning a trip to London should take note. c.i.

[Qoting from a pub guide, just for Steve's delight (and from personal view, as well!):
"Few, if any, towns or cities within the UK can offer a selection of pubs to compare with Stockport. It has an unbeatable combination of traditional locals, classic heritage pubs, notable free houses and quality cask ales from a variety of independent brewers, including all four of Greater Manchester's established family brewers, together with up-and-coming micros such as Porter's and Beartown. While mainly an urban area, there's also a small but impressive selection of country and village pubs to the south and east of the Metropolitan Borough area. The welcome is warm, prices are reasonable and the attitude towards closing times is generally relaxed. ]

Steve:

Muhammadanism is commonly referred to today as Islam.

I tend to agree with Marcus Borg (Professor of Religion at Oregon State University), who wrote a book called "Meeting Jesus Again For The First Time".

Borg says that Jesus was a mystic, and that Jesus never claimed to be the Messiah and he never expected the 'coming of the Kingdom of God'.

To quote Borg....
"he was a spirit person, subversive sage, social prophet, and movement founder who invited his followers and hearers into a transforming relationship with the same Spirit that he himself knew, and into a community whose social vision was shaped by the core value of compassion" .......compassion "was the central quality of God and the central moral quality of a life centered in God"

Borg also says that the image of Jesus as 'the son of God' is metaphorical, and that Jesus spoke in parables.

So, as to the discussion topic of this thread, and taking what Borg has written...... If Jesus had not been born, we would have missed the opportunity to experience a great mystic.

Learn More
Learn more about Marcus Borg and Jesus

Re-Visioning Christianity: The Christian Life
Re-Visioning Christianity: The Christian Life - Marcus Borg

Boss where are you? You'll get a kick here: :-)

Jesus and Buddha: The Parallel Sayings

I can't believe it's taken me this long to come up with this, but...

Well, for one thing, that Mary would be really pregnant!

Husker: I took a look at your last URL, where I noted the following quotation:

As much as the book Jesus and Buddha deals with issues that leave to chance how Christianity and Buddhism are rendered by the individual, collective, and historical imagination, it comes down to being a spiritual guide for those who seek moral instruction and inner strength from the best of what both religions have to offer. In coming together "in an encounter of the spirit in the West," as Jack Kornfield writes, Buddha's and Jesus's words are designed to lead the faithful on the same "path of liberation from our anxious grasping, resurrection into a new way of being, and transformation into the compassionate life."

Sounds fair if you believe the two are comparable, but then Jesus did say:

John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

Exactly, Bib, it is the exclusivity of Christianity which has pushed me away.

Piffka: you make a good point about "exclusivity."

This raises an interesting subject about ABSOLUTE AUTHORITY.

If the actions, thoughts and beliefs of Humanity can be what ever anyone wants, then who is to say what any of us do is right, moral, or just?

Christians use the teachings of Christ as their foundation for morality and justice, as well as many other facets of life and lifestyle.
In essence, Christians use the Bible as their source of Absolute Authority in all of these issues.

If this sort of belief-system is perceived as "exclusivity" then what standard or authority do non-Christians use? - is it not exclusive of Christianity also?

Christianity starts out OK, "Love your neighbor" etc. then demands salvation occurs only through their Godhead, only using their rules. Not only that, it is all based on teachings from a book whose origins are shaky, translations are numbing, and whose original caretakers, the Catholics, are considered less than Christian by the rest of the religion.

If our God is so powerful, then why oh why, would He/She be unable or unwilling to give salvation to people who had lived good and excellent lives before Jesus had ever been born, or who lived far away from the eastern shores of the Medi, and never even heard of the Bible? It just doesn't ring true.

Particularly when the emphasis sounds more like what little kids on a playground would come with... bullying and popularity contests, rather than on the kindness and understanding which we would otherwise believe is part of Jesus.

Either the translation is off or the message is wrong.

Hear hear Boss . . . valid objections, and succinctly stated. It is also worth noting that religion never made a bad man/woman good, nor has the lack thereof made a good man/woman bad.

Where have all these hermaphrodites come from?

They just wandered over from the Secret Policeman's Ball . . .

Piffka: does this scripture assist you in answering the question about salvation before the birth of Christ?:

2 Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."

I believe God wants us to Worship him. Worship is something for Him. We forget in our vanity that he made us not for us but for Him. He touches us first, to open our minds to him. He gives us His love first, regardless of who or what we've been and what we are. No matter what, "The very first thing I want you to know is that I love you!" "I love you. And as a result of all I'll show you and do for you, you'll worship me." We were created for His purpose. That's what worship is about. What happens when we enter into worship with God? We enter into a loving relationship with God. We enter into a relationship that will go beyond measure. Are you in a relationship with God right now? Do you know what that relationship is or should be? A lot of people know God. A lot of people understand that God exists. But all of this is one way. We find that we are loving God on our own terms, not His. Piffka, God\Jesus is going to give the peoples on the eastern shores a chance on Judgement day (the ones that did not hear) and the other places where the WORD has not been heard. A large problem for many will be that they hear and still turn away. Me personally I try to daily not be conformed to this World. I try and live sacrificially everyday in my thoughts and actions. Am I successful? Not always - but My Lord and God forgives me of my past, present, and future transgressions. He only asks that I do my best in that relationship (worship and praise).
It can be a difficult thing, but one that has a lot of hope and promise.

Piffka et al:

The following questions may help you answer some of your questions and doubts:

Q1. Have the promises of the Bible failed you, or has your understanding of them been incomplete?

Q2. Have the teachings of Jesus failed you, or those who said they were following such teachings?

Q3. Have you found a belief-system that betters Christianity, or a group of people who just share your existing values?

Yes indeed, it would have been necessary to make him up...............Well, maybe we did make him up.
Human beings seem to have a "religious gene". If we could take one of those devices from "Men in Black" and wipe out all our memories, I think we'd be back in the God business in no time at all.