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Strengthening Grammar Skills in Mid-Life

 
 
Reply Thu 13 Dec, 2012 01:31 pm
I am in my mid-fifties and, to a large extent, use my comparatively strong writing skills to make my living. I work with engineers who, as some of you may know, are notorious for their poor writing. In any event, I sense that I am beginning to experience a decline in my own skills, almost certainly related to age more than to anything else. For example, I find myself to be unsure about the proper use of the comma in some sentences, whereas I am quite confident I had that issue mastered in the past.

Do any of you have suggestions about how I, or anyone for that matter, can maintain, or perhaps even improve, their grammar skills as they age? I read a fair quantity of published (and therefore generally well-written) sophisticated material, so the issue is not a lack of exposure to appropriate, well-written material.

Perhaps nothing can be done, but I am open to suggestions.
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Dec, 2012 03:05 pm
@Andrew H,
I've no suggestions, Andrew. I have observed something similar problems involved in unlearning and relearning things I've used so long they've become a part of me. Once I incorrectly learn a person's name, Dick might just as well become accustomed to being called Dave, cuz I'll probably never get it right without checking my notes.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Dec, 2012 03:22 pm
@Andrew H,
Read the New Yorker.
Watch what they say.
I say this as a New Yorker fan re well told tales. No, I don't always agree on the body of the content, but I consider the editors sane.
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Dec, 2012 03:23 pm
@Andrew H,
We do have a comma thread, here - I'll search it.

Still looking.

Listen to Roberta.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Dec, 2012 03:39 pm
@ossobuco,
Meantime, a new yorker link I hadn't read before -
http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/culture/2012/04/in-defense-of-commas.html

That's where I am.

Whether or not you are New Yorker picky, or skip a lot of commas - which I sometimes do - it's useful to understand the terrain.

0 Replies
 
TheParser
 
  2  
Reply Thu 27 Dec, 2012 08:04 am
@Andrew H,
I am almost 76 years old. Not that my grammar skills are great, but they have never been better. My skills have grown better because I was forced to better understand grammar when I was called upon to help others. As the saying goes: If you want to learn something, teach it.

As far as commas are concerned, the best thing to do -- as other posters have already suggested -- is to read widely and notice the "art" of punctuation. I have read that in ancient Rome, authors felt that a well-written article (in Latin) did not need punctuation. Also, they say that in classical Chinese there was no such thing as punctuation.

If you really want to understand grammar, I suggest that you consider learning the old-fashioned Reed-Kellogg system of diagramming. Now considered very old-fashioned and seldom taught anymore, it forces you to account for every single word in a sentence. It is literally a map of a sentence. When you get time, please google for more information regarding the Reed-Kellogg system. It has helped my self-confidence tremendously.


JTT
 
  1  
Reply Thu 27 Dec, 2012 07:36 pm
@Andrew H,
I didn't notice any problems whatsoever with your grammar skills, Andrew. Punctuation ain't got nothin' to do with grammar.

What makes you think that your grammar skills are declining. And at age 50, barring a medical condition, not a chance. You're probably at your strongest. You could be experiencing a bit of burnout, a bit of the blaaaahs, but I really wouldn't worry if I were you.
0 Replies
 
Kolyo
 
  2  
Reply Thu 27 Dec, 2012 09:06 pm
@Andrew H,
Andrew H wrote:

Do any of you have suggestions about how I, or anyone for that matter, can maintain, or perhaps even improve, their grammar skills as they age? I read a fair quantity of published (and therefore generally well-written) sophisticated material, so the issue is not a lack of exposure to appropriate, well-written material.


Practice. Practice. Practice. At this site for instance. You have to write stuff of your own aside from just reading what other people write. Composition isn't a spectator sport, any more than math is.

As I said, a2k is as good a place to practice as any, since you seem to have worldly knowledge of your own to share.

If you really want grammar lessons, start an argument about grammatical conventions with JTT when she's helping out a foreign ESL student.
(That is, unless fireworks are banned in your state.) Smile
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Fri 28 Dec, 2012 11:55 am
@ossobuco,
Quote:
but I consider the editors sane.


You might want to reconsider that, Osso. Smile


Quote:

False Fronts in the Language Wars
Why New Yorker writers and others keep pushing bogus controversies

by Steven Pinker

...

This pseudo-controversy, a staple of literary magazines for decades, was ginned up again this month by The New Yorker, which has something of a history with the bogus battle. Fifty years ago, the literary critic Dwight Macdonald lambasted the Third Edition of Webster’s New International Dictionary for aiming to be “a recording instrument rather than … an authority” and insufficiently censuring such usages as “deprecate” for depreciate, “bored” for disinterested, and “imply” for infer. And in a recent issue, Joan Acocella, the magazine’s dance critic, fired a volley of grapeshot at the Fifth Edition of the American Heritage Dictionary and at a new history of the controversy by the journalist Henry Hitchings, The Language Wars. Acocella’s points were then reiterated this week in a post by Ryan Bloom on the magazine’s Page-Turner blog. The linguistic blogosphere, for its part, has been incredulous that The New Yorker published these “deeply confused” pieces. As Language Log put it, “Either the topic was not felt to be important enough to merit elementary editorial supervision, or there is no one at the magazine with any competence in the area involved.”


http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/the_good_word/2012/05/steven_pinker_on_the_false_fronts_in_the_language_wars_.html
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Fri 28 Dec, 2012 11:57 am
@ossobuco,
Quote:
Listen to Roberta.


That's going to be awfully difficult advice to follow, Osso, because Roberta refuses to talk about grammar or language and how it works.
0 Replies
 
SticklerEditing
 
  3  
Reply Fri 28 Dec, 2012 02:53 pm
@Andrew H,
Hello Andrew,

As others have mentioned, it's a matter of practice. Just reading your posts here, it seems you're doing a great job!

For me personally, even as an editor by profession, I sometimes get those same moments of confusion or questioning about the use of something that I should otherwise know. Besides daily practice, there are plenty of blogs on the web that discuss these and other common grammar issues specifically that you might enjoy following. And there's no shame in checking in on one of them every time you're unsure of something.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Fri 28 Dec, 2012 03:01 pm
@SticklerEditing,
Quote:
there are plenty of blogs on the web that discuss these and other common grammar issues specifically that you might enjoy following. And there's no shame in checking in on one of them every time you're unsure of something.


You have to be really careful about those blogs, SE, because many simply repeat the same old nonsense about grammar.
0 Replies
 
Andrew H
 
  3  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 05:23 pm
@ossobuco,
Hi:

As a matter of fact, my wife gave me a subscription to the New Yorker for Christmas.....
Andrew H
 
  2  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 05:24 pm
@TheParser,
Thanks for the suggestions - I intend to act on them.
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 05:41 pm
@Andrew H,
Don't look to it for advice on how language works, Andrew.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  3  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 05:50 pm
@Andrew H,
Also, Roberta started a whole bunch of grammar threads several years ago.
She is a respected book editor, and a relaxed person at a2k.
I once had a post listing a lot of those early grammar threads. I'll try to look for it. Or, you could look up her profile and check her My Topics list, which are probably in some way in chronological order.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 06:14 pm
@ossobuco,
Quote:
Roberta started a whole bunch of grammar threads several years ago


I'm sad to report that many of these were also covered in the Pet Peeves of English thread. Roberta covered them in a more graceful fashion to be sure, but she hewed to the old prescriptive line and as a result reported the same falsehoods that have been reported for a couple of centuries now.

Quote:
She is a respected book editor, and a relaxed person at a2k.


She is, to be sure, a respected book editor. She wouldn't have survived all these years if she wasn't.

Though it may seem counter intuitive to some, being a book editor, respected or not, doesn't make someone a grammar expert, anymore than being a relaxed person at A2K does.

Osso, well she received her tuition at the end of Sister [____]'s ruler. She too, clings to a lot of grammatical old wives tales.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 06:18 pm
@ossobuco,
How in heaven's name did you forget to offer Merry Andrew's name, Osso? Are you not aware that he taught high school English?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 29 Dec, 2012 09:27 pm
@ossobuco,
Quote:
Roberta started a whole bunch of grammar threads several years ago.


Here's one.

http://able2know.org/topic/9405-1
0 Replies
 
 

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