Things I want to know about the US (but was afraid to ask!)

Grand Duke, Back in the days when I had money for such frivolities, I used to go to Atlantic City fairly often. It's just far enough away to have kept me from going too often. I could easily have become addicted.

I've been to the track many times, also. Love the excitement--the thundering hoofbeats. And it's true that you care a whole lot more about the outcome of a race when you've bet money on one of the horses. C'mon Secretariat. Move your bloomin' arse (a line from My Fair Lady, except for the Secretariat part). I loved dat horse.

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What's the deal with "registered Democrat" and "registered Republican"? Is it a common thing for people to register with one of the political parties? In the UK, the number of registered party members is a very low percentage of the voting population.

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When you register to vote you have the option of registering with a party. It's beneficial to register with a particular party if you want to participate in the primaries. There are some state that allow anyone to vote in any primary but they are a very small number.

You can also, in most states, register as an Independent, but that would preclude you from voting in the primaries.

Are you familiar with our primary election process?

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I have vague recollections that the primaries are when each state selects the candidate they want to run in the next presidential election? And thanks for stopping by, Joe.

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True, but there are primaries in many local races as well, for mayors,city councils, for State Congressional Offices and State Governors. There was an election in Tulsa one year that had twenty-two people vying for the office of Mayor on the Democratic ticket. Jim Inhofe, a Republican, won in the November elections.

Primary election day is also a big favorite day to have votes on school boards, property taxes and school bond issues IF the local powers are opposed to the measures because they figure only the most curmudgeonly folks will show up, and they are usually right.

Joe

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Are the primaries only used to vote for the presidential "challenger" i.e. Kerry last year? If so, and only registered Democrats were out voting, how can they get a democratic vote on the other issues? Or is it a multi-part vote where Republicans would just ignore the Democratic nomination and vote on the rest of it?

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Er... it depends on the election. When GW Bush ran the first time he was opposed in the primaries by, amongst others, John McCain. Gore had primary opponents too, including his soon to be running mate Joe Libermann. This time around Bush was unopposed for his reelection (though Republican did go through the motions of having a primary so that the media could report "Bush captures New Hampshire Primary," and it was Kerry who had to spend weeks and months debating with Dean, Edwards, Libermann and several others..the Rev Al Sharpton... trying to get his message out.

George HW Bush had to run against Bob Dole back when he was running this first time. And Jack Kemp, Forbes, the list of also rans goes on and on.

Presidential Primaries are a bit different than the local issue primaries in that the balloting is usually limited to only the selection of a candidate. In my previous post I should have said that bond issues and the like are brought up in the off-years primaries.

Our system of electing Presidents is exhausting. Lasting now about two years from start to finish with nobody getting any work done in the final two months and I'm sure Bush is going to need to sleep for a week now.
There were already articles in the paper yesterday regarding who NOW has the best chance to run in 2008............ Twisted Evil

We are mad. Please send help.

Joe

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Thanks for the info, Joe. So if registered Republicans thought GWB was doing a bad job, they could have chosen someone else to stand in the election?

The system here is a fair bit simpler. Party members in each of the 650-ish constituencies (probably numbering only a few thousand) chose who they want to stand as the candidate for that seat in the general election. The prime minister is chosen by the members of parliament from his (or her) party. The House of Lords - our 'upper chamber' are not voted for at all!

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Grand Duke wrote:

Thanks for the info, Joe. So if registered Republicans thought GWB was doing a bad job, they could have chosen someone else to stand in the election?

They could have if someone was running against him. But, as far as I know, he ran unopposed in the primaries. So disaffected Republicans had to wait to the general election to cast their vote.

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Thanks, Roberta. Maybe a potential Republican candidate would have seen it as political suicide to stand against the encumbent president?

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Actually Joe, it depends on the state whether an independent can vote or not in the primaries. I am registered as an independent and in Mass. I have the option of voting in either the Republican or Democratic primary.

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Good old Massachusetts! Yeah I tried to say that but in a remarkably bad bit of writing I posted:

Quote:

There are some states that allow anyone to vote in any primary but they are a very small number.
You can also, in most states, register as an Independent, but that would preclude you from voting in the primaries.

Unless, of course, you were living in one of those aforementioned states, he hastened to add much belatedly.

Wisconsin, I believe is another state which allows any registered voter to vote in any party's primary. The result this year was a lot of rumors that Republicans were voting for Dean in the Democratic Primary in an attempt to derail Kerry.

I think it's part of our nature in America not to be too organized. We are not too keen on any sort of National Program to Streamline and Codify the Electoral System, except for those of us who are very keen on doing just that. We are suspicous of every voting booth having the same blank electronic screen, we probably get that from our experience at trying to load Myst II onto our hard-drives and from the usual, and usually correct, tales of fraud, hacking and other computer gliched mis-adventures. Also, we like to feel a bit superior about those who live in other States, "Look at those dweebish Floridians punching at cards in the dark, while we New YAwkers still hold on to our rattling vote tabulators with the big red handle designed as God intended for a voting machine to look."

We've also been to all the movies where the evil guy is mucking around with the data without anyone knowing about it or the good looking gal-pal of the hero is lurking around the evil guy's computer and transmitting several hundred pages of incriminating stuff back to HQ while supposedly making a trip to the bathroom. (Should I speak English? trip to the loo.)
Anyway, it seems to a lot of us that the electoral system at present is a mess, but that's what we said four years ago and all we did was pass a law that allowed anyone who was denied access to vote to vote on a "provisional ballot" --- "provisional" from the Algonquin word for toilet paper. ..........

Ah.

Democracy.

Joe

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Thanks for all these informations!

Which lead to my question:
since it doesn't seem to be terrible difficult to register twice (or illegally), what about e.g. driving licenses or passports?

How can it be avoided that you get a couple of licenses or passports?

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Beats the hell out of me, Walter.

Word was that in past elections in the city of Chicago, many dead people cast their ballots for the incumbent. Probably not just Chicago, but that's the place that got the most notoriety for it.

Speaking of voting, the Supreme Court has decided not to decide on the legality of convicted felons voting. The states will have to decide. Considering that there are over a million people in prison in the US, the prison population could prove to be a powerful voting bloc.

BTW, it was reported today that the female prison population has reached its highest point ever. Over 100,000. You go, girls.

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So once someone has commited a felon, and served time, they permanently lose the right to vote? A felony is a 'major' crime, like drug dealing, armed robbery, rape or murder?

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As far as I know, a felony is typically defined as a crime punishable by a term of imprisonment of not less than one year.

More info e.g. at the Election Law@Moritz website Felon Disenfranchisement

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Thanks Walter. The description given at that site was surprisingly easy for a layman such as myself to understand. I believe in Britain that prisoners cannot vote, but those released are able to. How does it go in Germany? And do you think it is "right" to deny someone the right to vote based upon a crime for which they have already punsihed by a prison sentence?

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In America, the right to vote is sacred, so sacred that only about half of those eligible to vote even do it. We vote at about the same percentage of those who show up for their high school reunions.

Walter:

Quote:

Which lead to my question:
since it doesn't seem to be terrible difficult to register twice (or illegally), what about e.g. driving licenses or passports?
How can it be avoided that you get a couple of licenses or passports?

The production of Fake ID and the crime of Identity Theft are close cousins in the US. It is seldom necessary to actually make contact with the authorities, ie. registering twice for a driver's license, when the right people can laser print you a nice new one or two in minutes. The States work very hard to make their IDs more and more complex, adding 3-D markers and imbedded ribbons to make it much more difficult to reproduce, but the thing is, most of the time, when I look at a person's ID (to verify for a check) they are surprised that I take such a good look at it.
Americans are not too nosey about their neighbors and they would be pleased for the most part if their neighbors were not too nosey about them. Mohammed Atta and his lads lived, ate, drank and drove around their Florida neighborhood for months without any visible means of support, but no one thought anything about it. And, it should be added they had REAL ID, fake ID might have brought them to the attention of some airport cop in Maine or Boston.

This is a free country. We move from place to place, across State lines or across the street, no one asks to see your ID.

We'd like to keep it that way.

Joe Nation

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I'd like to come back to the voting and ID questions, but before I forget... Why do Americans write the numerical date as month-day-year? This has always puzzled me, confused me and sometimes, when using Excel, annoyed me! How does the rest of the world do it? It may well be purely due to nurture, but my logic tells me that day-month-year makes more sense - as the units are in ascending order.

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Grand Duke wrote:

Thanks Walter. The description given at that site was surprisingly easy for a layman such as myself to understand. I believe in Britain that prisoners cannot vote, but those released are able to. How does it go in Germany? And do you think it is "right" to deny someone the right to vote based upon a crime for which they have already punsihed by a prison sentence?

It really is very similar:

Quote:

Criminal Code (Strafgesetzbuch, StGB)

Section 45
Loss of the Capacity to Hold, or be Elected to Public Office and the Right to Vote
(1) Whoever is sentenced for a serious criminal offense to imprisonment for at least one year shall lose for a period of five years the capacity to hold public office and attain public electoral rights.

(2) The court may deprive the convicted person of the capacities indicated in subsection (1) for a period of from two to five years, to the extent the law specifically so provides.

(3) With the loss of the capacity to hold public office the convicted person shall simultaneously lose the corresponding legal statuses and rights he possesses.

(4) With the loss of the capacity to attain public electoral rights, the convicted person shall simultaneously lose the corresponding legal statuses and rights he possesses to the extent the law does not otherwise provide.

(5) The court may deprive the convicted person of the right to elect or vote in public matters for a period of from two to five years, to the extent the law specifically so provides.

Section 45a Entry into Force and Calculation of the Period of Loss
(1) The loss of the capacities, legal statuses and rights shall take effect when the judgment becomes final.

(2) The period of the loss of a capacity or a right shall be calculated from the day the term of imprisonment has been served, barred by the statute of limitations or remitted. If a measure of reform and prevention involving deprivation of liberty was ordered collateral to imprisonment, the term shall be calculated beginning on the day the measure was completed.

(3) If the execution of the punishment, the remainder thereof, or the measure has been suspended through a grant of probation or an act of clemency, then the term shall include the probationary period, if, after its expiration, the punishment, the remainder thereof, or the measure has been completed.

Section 45b Restoration of Capacities and Rights
(1) The court may restore capacities lost pursuant to Section 45 subsections (1) and (2), and rights lost pursuant to Section 45 subsection (5), if:

1. the loss was in effect for half of the time it should have lasted; and

2. it is to be expected that the convicted person will not commit any intentional crimes in the

future.

(2) The time in which the convicted person is held in custody in an institution pursuant to an order of a public authority shall not be calculated into the terms.

Usually, you can vote (see above), but can't be elected for a certain time.

This seems to be okay, especially, since it doesn't happen often (mostly related to "Crimes Against Constitutional Organs As Well As During Elections And Ballots" =
Section 105 Coercion of Constitutional Organs
Section 106 Coercion of the Federal President and Members of Constitutional Organs
Section 106a Violation of a Protected Zone
Section 106b Disturbing the Activity of a Legislative Body
Section 107 Obstruction of an Election
Section 107a Election Fraud
Section 107b Falsification of Election Papers
Section 107c Violation of the Secrecy of Elections
Section 108 Coercion of Voters
Section 108a Deception of Voters
Section 108b Bribery of Voters
Section 108c Collateral Consequences
Section 108d Area of Application
Section 108e Bribery of Members of Parliament )

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Things I want to know about the US (but was afraid to ask!)

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